My Latest Purchase (or just pictures of your current guns)

[Rocketman]

If you have a well-written trust that's modular, it's easy to remove people and then add them back on, other than needing to redo the notary process for everyone.

In my view a well written trust is a must. I've had mine for 10 years and it's very easy to take trustee's off and add others on the fly. I payed $150 dollars for it back then and I can't believe they still charge $150 today. It's written by an attorney that specializes in NFA Trusts and it includes ongoing support in case you need it. NFA Gun Trust Laywers is who I used and they still take my phone calls and answer my emailed questions.

 

[sevenhelmet]

In my view a well written trust is a must. I've had mine for 10 years and it's very easy to take trustee's off and add others on the fly. I payed $150 dollars for it back then and I can't believe they still charge $150 today. It's written by an attorney that specializes in NFA Trusts and it includes ongoing support in case you need it. NFA Gun Trust Laywers is who I used and they still take my phone calls and answer my emailed questions.

Seems like the best COA would be to put your items in a trust with yourself as trustee, and then add folks later, right?

Have been thinking about doing this for a while- might take your advice and go for it.

 

[Rocketman]

Seems like the best COA would be to put your items in a trust with yourself as trustee, and then add folks later, right?

Have been thinking about doing this for a while- might take your advice and go for it.

Yup. That's what I do. You can add and remove trustees at any time. The only restriction is that you can't add trustees while you have an outstanding application awaiting approval. You have to wait until you get the stamp.

As Gatordev alluded to, multiple trustees, can slow down the background checks and thus the stamp approval. My trust only requires one page to take them off and one page to add them back. If you apply for a stamp with multiple trustees they all have to provide prints and a pic etc.

At any rate I'll confirm that it's easier and quicker than its ever been. If you are "making an SBR" (turning a rifle you already own into an SBR) you can actually submit the application online using the ATF eForms website. The last one I did only took 2 days for approval. I made an SBR from a 10/22. It's an SBR now with a folding stock, an 8 in barrel and a suppressor. It's a blast to shoot. All you hear is a "tic" as the bolt hits the buffer.

DO IT.

 

[GroundPounder]

Just got the word on pricing to buy our issued ( soon to be replaced by Glock model 45 ) Sig Sauer P320s.


Survey says.......$260 each. I'd have to double check, but I think we have had them since 2021. I feel for the people who paid retail for them a few years ago, and now they are worth less than a holster and cheap light.

 

[sevenhelmet]

Just got the word on pricing to buy our issued ( soon to be replaced by Glock model 45 ) Sig Sauer P320s.


Survey says.......$260 each. I'd have to double check, but I think we have had them since 2021. I feel for the people who paid retail for them a few years ago, and now they are worth less than a holster and cheap light.

Reputation matters... sucks to suck. Still, that's alarmingly cheap.

Really glad I stayed off the P320 train.

 

[BigRed389]

Reputation matters... sucks to suck. Still, that's alarmingly cheap.

Really glad I stayed off the P320 train.

LE trades in are normally pretty damn cheap, and if they’re allowing officers to buy I’d expect they wouldn’t mark them up at all.

I’m still ambivalent on the 320s, a little less so on the M17/18s. Michigan State Police just signed up for the M18, which I thought was an interesting choice. Im still comfortable with mine for range/HD use. There’s a lot of like about it…other than that one kinda big thing

Now if DOD ever quits on the M17/18, then the product line will probably go to shit.

 

[GroundPounder]

LE trades in are normally pretty damn cheap, and if they’re allowing officers to buy I’d expect they wouldn’t mark them up at all.

I’m still ambivalent on the 320s, a little less so on the M17/18s. Michigan State Police just signed up for the M18, which I thought was an interesting choice. Im still comfortable with mine for range/HD use. There’s a lot of like about it…other than that one kinda big thing

Now if DOD ever quits on the M17/18, then the product line will probably go to shit.

Our last price, when we got the 320 was $325 for Glock 22s.

The best deal was when we went from S&W 64s to Glocks ( I'm old ) and we could buy them for $100. No one wanted them, so I bought 10.

The best deal is when you retire, you get to buy your last gun for $1. So in the next year or so, I'll send a pic of that Glock.

As for the Sig, we have had 3 NDs, two of which ended in shot legs. Both guys swear that weapon was in holster. Sig sent a factory guy to put our command staff through their armorer course to prove the weapon can not fire without activating trigger. It was convincing, but at the same time, I'm not 100% sure that at least some of the issues are real.

 

[number9]

Our last price, when we got the 320 was $325 for Glock 22s.

The best deal was when we went from S&W 64s to Glocks ( I'm old ) and we could buy them for $100. No one wanted them, so I bought 10.

The best deal is when you retire, you get to buy your last gun for $1. So in the next year or so, I'll send a pic of that Glock.

As for the Sig, we have had 3 NDs, two of which ended in shot legs. Both guys swear that weapon was in holster. Sig sent a factory guy to put our command staff through their armorer course to prove the weapon can not fire without activating trigger. It was convincing, but at the same time, I'm not 100% sure that at least some of the issues are real.

I'm not convinced all of the issues as real either but over the years there has been so, so much smoke there's bound to be at least a little fire behind it all. And I'm a P320 owner...

 

[Griz882]

Sig sent a factory guy to put our command staff through their armorer course to prove the weapon can not fire without activating trigger. It was convincing, but at the same time, I'm not 100% sure that at least some of the issues are real.

I’ve had zero issues with my Sig but I went ahead and had the free factory modification done. I have to be honest, I think anyone who says a modern pistol went off in the holster without touching the trigger is fibbing (https://www.swatmag.com/article/stop-blaming-the-trigger-negligent-discharges/). I saw plenty of NDs with the M9 and every one was a matter of trigger awareness and/or sloppy muzzle awareness and the M9 has a trigger pull that feels like 750 lbs.!

 

[BigRed389]

I’ve had zero issues with my Sig but I went ahead and had the free factory modification done. I have to be honest, I think anyone who says a modern pistol went off in the holster without touching the trigger is fibbing (https://www.swatmag.com/article/stop-blaming-the-trigger-negligent-discharges/). I saw plenty of NDs with the M9 and everyone was a matter of trigger awareness and/or sloppy muzzle awareness and the M9 has a trigger pull that feels like 750 lbs.!

There’s enough video out there, and while none are 100% slam dunks by themselves, there’s enough that looks off when you put them together to make me doubt.

I sold my commercial P320s. The only ones I kept were the military contract overrun guns.

The M17/18 are apparently built on a different product line, and with a different TDP. There’s also direct DOD oversight of what SIG is up to on that line compared to their commercial line, where they can do whatever the hell they want to cut costs. I’m pretty sure the Army (or whoever owns that program) is well aware of the doubts, and so no doubt has had SIG convince them things were ok with their product. The fact all sentries across DOD are continuing to carry locked and cocked daily without the same drama the Civ/LE side has is a positive indicator.

Personally, based on the number of incidents at this point, I believe it’s quite possible there is something off with the design that requires strict QC to prevent, that QC or tolerances may have been lowered on the commercial side, or with other rolling TDP changes to cut costs, and it may have led to bad lots of guns going out. I’d also bet SIG has probably fixed whatever the issues were (known or suspected), but I also wouldn’t be surprised if they aren’t saying shit for liability reasons.

Bottom line, I think the gun is probably mostly fine, especially the Mil one, but I’m definitely skeptical on the commercial variant until SIG is more forthcoming.

 

[ChuckMK23]

Really glad I stayed off the P320 train.

Developing story about Airman who was killed in an accidental discharge yesterday. A major command has removed M18 from service. The order removing from service by a GO is all over social media...

 

[BigRed389]

Developing story about Airman who was killed in an accidental discharge yesterday. A major command has removed M18 from service. The order removing from service by a GO is all over social media...

Yeah I just saw that. Absolutely ridiculous, I think this might be the first fatality.

The DOD’s endorsement by dropping them was IMO the main thing preventing a total loss of confidence in the 320.

I have no idea how they managed to screw up their production line so bad that made early guns we’re fine to run combat deployments in Afghanistan, and now they’re randomly just fucking going off with slight bumps.

 

[sevenhelmet]

Yeah I just saw that. Absolutely ridiculous, I think this might be the first fatality.

The DOD’s endorsement by dropping them was IMO the main thing preventing a total loss of confidence in the 320.

I have no idea how they managed to screw up their production line so bad that made early guns we’re fine to run combat deployments in Afghanistan, and now they’re randomly just fucking going off with slight bumps.

Several police departments have apparently banned P320 pistols as well. Numerous classes and ranges are also turning them away. My local range couldn’t even sell their remaining P320 inventory at a loss. It doesn’t look good for Sig- an awful lot of people have legal standing for lawsuits now.

I still have yet to see a decent technical take on what is going on, but it’s clear something is up.

Truly awful for that airman’s family.

 

[number9]

Fair winds and following seas to the airman.

I think that's it for me - I'll sell my P320 (and Flux Raider) and get a Glock.

 

[sevenhelmet]

Fair winds and following seas to the airman.

I think that's it for me - I'll sell my P320 (and Flux Raider) and get a Glock.

Careful who you sell to- not everyone knows what’s up with these. Did yours have the “voluntary upgrade”?