OCS attrition

[exNavyOffRec]

Looking at the most recent report which details OCS attrition those that have the highest attrition are SNA, but that is still low, the total number of OCS attrites from mid July 2011 to current is 35.

What this means is no matter how crappy OCS is if you can put up with it and not quit you should make it.

 

[HAL Pilot]

We had more than that attrite from just my AOCS class.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

We had more than that attrite from just my AOCS class.

The screening prior to OCS has become more stringent and the info prior to them going has increased, we give them workout guides and such to reduce attrition, of course if someone shows up pregnant they are still going home.

 

[djguernsey]

Is the high attrition of SNA's attributable to higher numbers attending with that designator? And do they give any listing of reason for attrition?

Curious minds of future OCS attendees wonder.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

50/50 for DOR and physically unable to complete

the high numbers are part of it but nukes have just as many with lower attrition

 

[Picaroon]

Looking at the most recent report which details OCS attrition those that have the highest attrition are SNA

To be honest that really surprises me. SNA historically has some of the highest standards associated with it, yes? I would have guessed people who weren't as likely to know what they were getting themselves into (10+ year commitments, flight school, etc) would be the first to be out.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

To be honest that really surprises me. SNA historically has some of the highest standards associated with it, yes? I would have guessed people who weren't as likely to know what they were getting themselves into (10+ year commitments, flight school, etc) would be the first to be out.

Surprised me to, but with 35 total it just takes a few to boost the numbers, I mean nukes were 3rd, but if you were to take out the person that showed up pregnant they drop to like 6th.

I would say the standards prior to board are tougher but all equals out prior to OCS, it could be they weren't prepped well by their NRD, I could look at that as well.

 

[HAL Pilot]

The screening prior to OCS has become more stringent and the info prior to them going has increased, we give them workout guides and such to reduce attrition, of course if someone shows up pregnant they are still going home.

And OCS has become a lot easier than AOCS was. The Marines had a mission at AOCS to attrite. You can screen all you want, but screening does not alleviate the head games and physical abuse that was AOCS. Candidates did not attrite for low intelligence, extra cirricular activitives on their resume or lack of desire. They attrited because life at AOCS was 12 weeks of pure misery and abuse followed by a week as a Candidate Officer where you recovered just enough to be barely presentable at your commissioning. There was no liberty until week 7 , no cell phones, no internet, no no personal time, etc. It was 24/7 under pressure with everyone who was not a candidate looking for a way to boot your ass out of the program or to get you to DOR. I am certain that in today's kinder, gentler PC military most of the daily stunts pulled by our DIs would be considered hazing or worst, and result in their receiving NJP at a minimum if not more serious punishment. The recruiters' job was to get you selected for the program, the AOCS staffs' was to weed out as many as possible. I watched AOCS class 13-83 get dissected. They started with about 80 candidates and their DI proclaimed that since their class number was 13, then 13 would get commissioned. He got the 14th left standing to DOR 2 days before they were to become Candidate Officers by 48 hours of constant harrassment and PT. He picked out who he thought was the weakest and ignored the rest for those 2 days. After he got his last DOR, he told the rest he had 13 and was done - congradulations!

AOCS was for pilots, NFOs and AIO (aviation intelligence officers). Everyone else went to OCS at Newport, RI and they started classes of 200 with 190 or so commissioning. OCS had maybe a 5% attrition rate. AOCS had a 65-75% attrition rate (my class started with 78 and commissioned 21. My brother's started with about 80 and commissioned about 20). It was a different time and a different culture.

After I got commissioned, I ran into a couple of the DIs in a Pensacola bar and bought them a few beers. They told me that most of the AOCS DIs had already completed tours as Marine OCS DIs and perferred AOCS because it had far fewer rules they had to follow than Marine OCS. AOCS let them use their imaginations in the most wicked and devious way possible. They continued to say that they respected every single officer that commissioned out of AOCS because they survived the hell the DIs put them through. They said that wasn't necessarily true of those commissioned from Marine OCS because the rules weakened the DI effectiveness. Again, this was the early 80s, not today. I have know idea what the DIs would think today but I suspect it is much harder to make it through Marine OCS now than Navy OCS.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

I completely agree different time I had a CPO I worked for who would show us a picture on his boot camp graduation day, he had a black eye, he made a smart ass comment to his CC and rec'd a fist as a response.

It looks like most of the comments overall for drops are not mentally prepared.

Several of my guys have come back and said the DI's would PT the hell out of them to drop a certain number, they said the females get the worst of it, one class lost all but one of the females.

I miss the less PC days when you could make a person who is a screw up cry without getting in trouble.

 

[Swanee]

AOCS was for pilots, NFOs and AIO (aviation intelligence officers). Everyone else went to OCS at Newport, RI and they started classes of 200 with 190 or so commissioning. COS had maybe a 5% attrition rate. ACOS had a 65-75% attrition rate (my class started with 78 and commissioned 21. My brother's started with about 80 and commissioned about 20). It was a different time and a different culture.

After I got commissioned, I ran into a couple of the DIs in a Pensacola bar and bought them a few beers. They told me that most of the AOCS DIs had already completed tours as Marine OCS DIs and perferred AOCS because it had far fewer rules they had to follow than Marine OCS. AOCS let them use their imaginations in the most wicked and devious way possible. They continued to say that they respected every single officer that commissioned out of AOCS because they survived the hell the DIs put them through. They said that wasn't necessarily true of those commissioned from Marine OCS because the rules weakened the DI effectiveness. Again, this was the early 80s, not today. I have know idea what the DIs would think today but I suspect it is much harder to make it through Marine OCS now than Navy OCS.

79 started in my platoon at Marine OCS in Jan of 09 (OCC 200). 27 commissioned 10 weeks later. Attrition still happens and those who don't cut it get weeded out. DIs are crafty SOBs. For every rule that comes out they have 2 ways to get around it. And we were told at OCS that it's not hazing if they call it civilian to military transition training.

 

[blackbart22]

12 weeks? Preflight was 16 weeks for both AOCs and NAVCADs way back. During our welcome aboard speech, the officer in charge of the kaydet regiment said "Look at the man on your left. Look at the man on your right. 18 months from now one of you won't be with us." Things like the step test, swim tests, etc winnowed out the ranks. My NAVCAD class started out all prior enlisted during hell week, but were then combined with the class that got the orientation flights, but were still about half priors. So most of the DI BS didn't work all that well on us. On the other hand, since half the class had no collage, a lot of guys spent some very long nights in the head, the only place in the kaydet barrarcks where the lights were on after taps. We still lost about a third during preflight and primary.

 

[AllAmerican75]

50/50 for DOR and physically unable to complete

the high numbers are part of it but nukes have just as many with lower attrition

Having recently completed OCS, I can tell you that the majority of those attrited from aviation are due to those candidates being NPQed from aviation. Frankly, the way we handle flight physicals for OCS accessions is ridiculous and needs to be fixed.

 

[Recovering LSO]

Having recently completed OCS, I can tell you that the majority of those attrited from aviation are due to those candidates being NPQed from aviation. Frankly, the way we handle flight physicals for OCS accessions is ridiculous and needs to be fixed.

How are they handled and what makes them ridiculous?

 

[eas7888]

Our class started with over 50 people, and we graduated only about half of the original class. A number of people roll back three, six, or even nine weeks for various reasons ranging from PT to failing inspections. Yes, there were those who did DOR as a result of being NPQd on their flight physicals as well. OCS may not be what AOCS was, but it's still not easy.

 

[BackOrdered]

Our class started with over 50 people, and we graduated only about half of the original class. A number of people roll back three, six, or even nine weeks for various reasons ranging from PT to failing inspections. Yes, there were those who did DOR as a result of being NPQd on their flight physicals as well. OCS may not be what AOCS was, but it's still not easy.

HAL and the older posters are talking about REAL "I can't take the heat, I Q.U.I.T. quit" attrition, not the force shaping attrition of having half a class rolling for RLP or some tomfoolery only to graduate in another class weeks later. If you look back and really look at who rolled and who didn't, you can see the PERS numbers game. "I can't take it" attrition at Newport OCS is rare.