E-2s vs E-3s

[kmac]

Ok NFOs, just came back from the Tinker AFB air show. As I was looking at the AWACS do it's super-cool, non-low-altitude, slow-ass flyby, I was wondering about a story I once heard. Apparently, both in Afghanistan and Hurricane Katrina a Hawkeye had to take over control from an E-3. First off, can anyone validate that? The "party line" on it has been that an E-2 can do a better job with the 3 NFOs than an E-3 can do with its crew of 11 (or however many people there are). I talked to an E-3 ACO about it and he guessed that the E-2 can do a better job of tracking helicopters. So, what's the deal?

This all may be a crock of crap, but it sounded interesting anyway. Fly Navy!

 

[Goober]

Apparently, both in Afghanistan and Hurricane Katrina a Hawkeye had to take over control from an E-3. First off, can anyone validate that? The "party line" on it has been that an E-2 can do a better job with the 3 NFOs than an E-3 can do with its crew of 11 (or however many people there are). I talked to an E-3 ACO about it and he guessed that the E-2 can do a better job of tracking helicopters. So, what's the deal?

This all may be a crock of crap, but it sounded interesting anyway. Fly Navy!

Been there. Done it. More than once.

A lot of it comes from the efficiency of all three controllers side by side, each capable of making a command-by-negation decision. There's no committee, no time-lag...one guy turns to the center seat and says "I need to do this with this guy in order to do X. You good with that?" Center seat makes the call and says run with it. Yeah, I'd have to say it's the efficiency more than anything else. E-2 crews also practice to the ABCC / DASC-A type mission, and the AWACS guys would rather have a root canal than touch it.

 

[usnmerritt]

AF v. USN. I rest my case.

 

[MasterBates]

When I was flying in JTF Katrina, the E-2 was much better to deal with than the E-3 we had one day.. After that, I only dealt with the Hummer.

AF guys did not seem to understand that we:
1- Were SLOW
2- 200' was not a cause for panic
3- Could hover
4- Needed a decision in less than 1 min.

 

[Flash]

I would also argue that the E-2 guys going through flight school and wearing real wings has a lot to do with it. There is something to be said about experiencing what you are controlling first hand. The AWACS gus I have met don't quite 'get it'.

 

[atogg16]

I'll take a Hummer anytime...

You heard correctly, we can definitely do a much better job than the Air Force homo's. I spent a few months this summer flying up the blvd and into Afghanistan, and we can definitely do alot more with 3 NFO's than the Air Force can do with 20 some odd. The biggest difference, system limitations. In the Hawkeye, our system is up and running on deck before we launch. About 10-15 minutes after we take off, we'll know if we can take the mission or not. With the AWACS, it takes them a full hour AFTER they launch to get their system fired up. In the E-3, if a controller wants to change a radio freq, he calls back to the enlisted tech, who switches the wires, and changes the freq for him. In the Hawkeye, we just lean over and dial up the new freq in the radio, it's a much easier process. The E-3 also doesn't have any front to back ICS, so it's pretty funny to hear the back end give the front end traffic calls over the radio. As far as Katrina goes, I know my squadron, VAW-121, the Bluetails, were flying out of Pensacola for a few weeks doing control over New Orleans. I wasn't in the squadron yet, so I don't know if they ever took over from an AWACS, but they definitely controlled a ton of helo's that we're going in an out of the area. Bottom line, each platform has it's pro's and con's. There's definitely been day's in the Hawkeye where I would've killed to have 15 more people with me, and days I can't stand having just two. But I think if you ask any pointy nosed guy out there, and they'll tel you they'd much rather have a Hawkeye watching their back any day outa the week. And if you ever get to see a Hawkeye demo at an airshow, I can guarentee you'll be impressed, and it's defintely much cooler than the AWACS flyby!

 

[kmac]

And if you ever get to see a Hawkeye demo at an airshow, I can guarentee you'll be impressed, and it's defintely much cooler than the AWACS flyby!

I'll have to watch for that demo of a Hawkeye sometime.

 

[FLYTPAY]

S-3B vs. P-3C

Been there. Done it. More than once.

A lot of it comes from the efficiency of all three controllers side by side, each capable of making a command-by-negation decision. There's no committee, no time-lag...one guy turns to the center seat and says "I need to do this with this guy in order to do X. You good with that?" Center seat makes the call and says run with it. Yeah, I'd have to say it's the efficiency more than anything else. E-2 crews also practice to the ABCC / DASC-A type mission, and the AWACS guys would rather have a root canal than touch it.

Well that pretty much settles the S-3 versus P-3 "debate" too!

 

[HAL Pilot]

Well that pretty much settles the S-3 versus P-3 "debate" too!

Yup, the S-3 made a very efficient buoy locker for the P-3 who was maintaining the contact....

 

[FLYTPAY]

I flew out to Whidbey to give a Mission Commander check flight to our NSAWC rep to be. We were doing a WASEX for the Prowler Weapons School Class and were "supported" by a P-3. The P-3 was "on station with a target an hour before the strike launched. Enroute to the target....wheels in the well....Jimmy noticed no doppler motion in the P-3's target which was ID'd by them as a frigate. My stud expedititously corrected the ID of the blip as a huge rock, found the frigate, passed the 9-line, and killed the target.....before the 3P on the P-3 could make the first batch of coffee... I gave Jimmy 3 aboves for that flight....the P-3 crew did not show up to the debrief.