ground effect?

[vaportrail]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=fJGVXpunZ_4&feature=related

-Since my recent select letter has come in the mail for SNA, I've taken the time to begin learning about flight. I am currently reading the FAA's handbook to aeronautical knowledge which I am hoping will give me a solid footing at API and beyond. In recent posts, I've seen alot of low altitude fly by's. In this video, is ground effect playing a major role? Is this sort of flying safe...or better yet, intelligent? I know it looks cool, but aren't these pilots risking alot?

PS. On a different note, is the Navy bringing on F-22s? My processor mentioned this to me, but I was under the impression that the F-22 was specifically designed for the USAF. Any info would be great

 

[JBM]

As I can't access youtube from the SDO desk I can't answer exactly as to what is in the video. Ground effect really only has an effect within one wingspan from the ground. So if the a/c is flying within a wingspan from the ground then it is in ground effect, otherwise no.

And no, the Navy will not be flying the F-22. Maybe if you go to a joint squadron, but the likelyhood is about zero for a Navy pilot to fly the F-22

 

[Mumbles]

here's a good link illustrating the ground effect phenomena. "Even though it's in German, you'll get the idea.

 

[bunk22]

API through winging will teach you everything you need to know. Might be better things to do with your time........if not, have at it.

 

[jg5343]

Those planes were too high to be in ground effect, and were flying well beyond a speed for which it would matter. Ground effect is only dangerous because it allows the plane to 'fly' at speeds/power settings it normally would not by reducing induced drag. Essentially flying below a normal stall speed since it creates more lift. So if you float down the end of the runway in ground effect toward some trees and never gain enough real flying speed, when you go to pull up you will not have the energy to do so. Conversely on landing the only danger, if you want to call it that, is overshooting by coming in too fast and finding yourself unable to set it down. There is a video out there somewhere of a guy that smacks some trees because of it. I am sure there are tons of aero guys on here that could go into the minute details of why and how...

 

[NavAir42]

here's a good link illustrating the ground effect phenomena. "Even though it's in German, you'll get the idea.

I want to say Popular Mechanics or something like that had an article on a project Boeing had been looking at called the Pelican. It probably wasn't anything more than a concept. I know the Soviets also built some actual aircraft and tested them. I believe the video, although in German, is actually the Soviet birds.

For a more indepth look at ground effect and the Soviet bird in the video this is a pretty good link: http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/aerodynamics/q0130.shtml

 

[Mumbles]

Yeah...the ekranoplan...and I'm no aero-wiz, but I'm pretty sure it's a ground effect vehicle, as in WIG (wing in ground effect)

 

[BACONATOR]

Those planes were too high to be in ground effect, and were flying well beyond a speed for which it would matter. Ground effect is only dangerous because it allows the plane to 'fly' at speeds/power settings it normally would not by reducing induced drag. Essentially flying below a normal stall speed since it creates more lift. So if you float down the end of the runway in ground effect toward some trees and never gain enough real flying speed, when you go to pull up you will not have the energy to do so. Conversely on landing the only danger, if you want to call it that, is overshooting by coming in too fast and finding yourself unable to set it down. There is a video out there somewhere of a guy that smacks some trees because of it. I am sure there are tons of aero guys on here that could go into the minute details of why and how...

Basically the short story is that with the interference of the downwash with the ground, the total lift vector is "rotated" forward (due to the effect on the relative wind- def of AOA) and thus the vertical component of lift is greater and induced drag is reduced.

Anything above 1 wingspan distance to the ground, and the downwash isn't affected much by the ground.

 

[Raptor2216]

Basically the short story is that with the interference of the downwash with the ground, the total lift vector is "rotated" forward (due to the effect on the relative wind- def of AOA) and thus the vertical component of lift is greater and induced drag is reduced.

Anything above 1 wingspan distance to the ground, and the downwash isn't affected much by the ground.

 

[Mumbles]

so once again, how in the hell are those "planes"... too high to be in ground effect when they are less than 20' off the water??

 

[HeyJoe]

...... is the Navy bringing on F-22s? My processor mentioned this to me, but I was under the impression that the F-22 was specifically designed for the USAF. Any info would be great

Sure your processor didn't say V-22?

 

[jg5343]

so once again, how in the hell are those "planes"... too high to be in ground effect when they are less than 20' off the water??

I was talking about the planes in the first video that flew down a runway. Maybe the last one was in ground effect for a moment, but it sure as hell wasnt going to make him worry about what he was doing. That thing over the water was definitely in ground effect.

 

[pilot_man]

As I can't access youtube from the SDO desk I can't answer exactly as to what is in the video. Ground effect really only has an effect within one wingspan from the ground. So if the a/c is flying within a wingspan from the ground then it is in ground effect, otherwise no.

And no, the Navy will not be flying the F-22. Maybe if you go to a joint squadron, but the likelyhood is about zero for a Navy pilot to fly the F-22

There is a Navy guy flying the F-22 so make that 1%.

 

[Scoob]

There is a Navy guy flying the F-22 so make that 1%.

and I'll bet he misses the FVCK out of a good Navy ready room.

 

[pilot_man]

and I'll bet he misses the FVCK out of a good Navy ready room.

Yes, but it is Las Vegas!