Leadership as a Naval Aviator

[nfo2b]

This may have been covered before here, but I couldn't find it by searching.
How much "deckplate" leadership do Naval Aviators (NFO's in my case) practice? This is a significant issue for me, being a prior. A large part of the reason that I applied for a commission is that I wanted to lead sailors (flying is, of course, the other part of the equation). I've worked for too many crappy O's that couldn't (or wouldn't) lead their E's out of a wet paper bag, and I wanted to give at least one small division in the Navy a different experience. Forgive me for sounding cliche here, but I want to make a difference for my enlisted folk, not just fly, attend briefs/debriefs, hide in my office doing paperwork, and then hit the links. Everyone here says that you're an "Officer first, aviator second." And to me, a large part of being an officer is taking care of and leading your enlisted personnel. They work for you, you take care of them, yada yada. So how much of this am I going to get to do as an NFO? Is the level of Div-O to 'E' interaction dependent on platform?

 

[bch]

Until you finish the rag, you will have very little interaction with enlisted sailors and 0 chance of having a leadership billet. As a JO you can be a Div-O, but someone with more experience is going to have to chime in on that.

 

[zab1001]

It all depends on where the front office decides to put you. As a nugget, your primary concern is going to be getting qualified, which takes a different amount of time in each community.

The more junior you are, the less "deckplate" responsibility you have, since your primary value to the squadron is your ability to handle an aircraft system. Your first ground job will be something relatively easy, logs and records, chart dude, PAO, sponsor program guy...As you advance in aircraft positional qualification you will have to study less and have more time in other, more involved billets.

Usually the second job a new guy gets is as a Branch O in maintenance. The NFOs I knew in MX were usually assigned to the tron side of things, it doesn't make much sense to have an NA with the ATs, and an NFO with the ADs...As a branch o you'll have some interaction in your shop, but you still won't be in there as much as it sounds like you want to be. Keep in mind, especially in Naval Aviation, the senior enlisted leadership is pretty fvcking outstanding. Your Chiefs and LPOs know that JOs need to keep their noses in the books and be ready to fly.

That said, you can take that branch o job and gloss it over, maybe stop in your shop every other day, and it won't really matter. Or you can make sure you're in the shop at least 2 hours a day, know all your guys' names, where they're from, family situation, etc. Makes it a lot easier when the Skipper calls you in because one of the fellas got a DUI and you actually know if he lives on or off base.

As I've said on these boards pretty much once a week, everything in the Navy is what you make of it. You may only have 2 enlisted cats working for you, but if you take the time, you can make a difference with them and if you do it right, learn a lot as well.

Usually guys finish out their last year in a squadron at a point where they can handle having to spend more of their day in the capacity of an Officer, moreso than an Aviator. You don't have your NATOPS screwed to your forehead, you're fully qualified, you're siging PQS for other guys. At this point you're either a DIVO or an Asst DH. I'm tired of typing. Good question.

(i know there's a few other threads on this, try a search with "ground job", "branch officer", "division officer", "collateral duties")

 

[nfo2b]

Wow, thanks zab, that answered my question. And you are completely right: The Navy is what you make of it. 100% on the money there. That is one of the biggest things that I always tried to drive home with my E-3/4's as an LPO, and it's true regardless of rank.
Thanks again.

 

[zab1001]

hey man, i'm just glad someone responded

 

[webmaster]

Good question, good thread, and zab hit it right on.

nfo2b, one of the main things I found, being a mustang in the wardroom, is that your presence can really help out your fellow Os. I got the typical welcome aboard spiel from the CO/XO, followed by the "we expect more out of you, and leadership in the wardroom"... Let's face it, you get there, you are the nugget, and you wouldn't/shouldn't be a leading presence in the wardroom, the senior JOs should be providing that. But, you can definitely help out in areas that they may overlook, or not realize something. Think zab put it pretty good in another thread, if a senior JO pulls you aside and says you probably shouldn't be doing something, you should heed it. Same goes for your experience and time in. If one of your buds is a branch DIVO, and one of his guys/gals is in the hospital, you better damn well make sure that they get out there to see them. It is the little things, all the stuff you (and I) respected in officers when we were Es, that they never teach us in school, that you can pass on to your fellow Os.

Another thought, while you might not be "leading" Es, you still have the chance to be useful. Talk to the ESO/Career Counselor, and make it known you are available for any Es that are interested in getting commissioned. I sat through some CDRBs on the invite from the ESO, and MAN, did I piss off some CPOs when I told the stellar PO2 that was interested in getting out and going to college, "that yeah, I was in the same boat, didn't want to become a chief, and was interested in furthering my education, best of luck, now, any questions on college, admissions, or student loans?", thought they were going to have a stroke on me!!

 

[Goober]

What an awesome thread. Couldn't agree more w/ the comments so far!

You'll be in a pretty unique position being older (and hopefully wiser) than your fellow JOs yet not as senior as them. Listen and learn how the wardroom works, but don't be hesitant to step in w/ some hard-earned wisdom (that was probably earned the hard way) if you see a potential of impending doom for one of the other guys. Don't be the guy known for: "Back when I was X" or "We didn't do it like that in the X community" because that can quickly get you pegged as an outsider or "different." With any luck, your skipper/XO will still keep your current position in perspective WRT the pecking order in the wardroom but be better able to relate w/ you considering you've been around the block already. It all pays huge dividends w/ your troops as a DivO knowing that you've been where they are and know how life really is for them.

 

[Steve Wilkins]

So is it safe to say that you don't get much leadership opportunity until your DH tour(s)?

 

[Goober]

Oh no. There's plenty to go around. Most JOs will be a DivO in at least two diff depts in their 1st tour. They'll start off w/ a smaller group but move up into more responsibility (and fitrep competitive jobs at that). Plenty of "opportunities to excel."

 

[nfo2b]

Good stuff. Thanks for all of the info!

 

[saltpeter]

Normally, a freshly minted pilot or NFO will be assigned as has been stated to a branch officer position in maintanence. And as has been said, there is little in the way of responsibility and the chief and the front office will leave you to your devices to get qualified. Although, as Captain Ron said, "swab, you start by taking the trash out and if you do a good job, you get a better job." There are little things that can help those you supervise out and get yourself alittle recognition too, like talking with the chief about putting one of your guys in for an LOA or LOC. I highly recommend that you do the paperwork and not let the chief or the first class do it for you so you can learn. Also, get involved in editing the evals., ranking your sailors, and fight to get your men frocked that can't pass the promotion exams. It's easy to spot those who are involved, as the enlisted service members will begin to ask YOU to promote and re-enlist them and don't think the fron office doesn't notice either.

 

[webmaster]

Also, get involved in editing the evals., ranking your sailors, and fight to get your men frocked that can't pass the promotion exams. It's easy to spot those who are involved, as the enlisted service members will begin to ask YOU to promote and re-enlist them and don't think the fron office doesn't notice either.

Good comment, but I will take it one step more. If you have some evals that you are responsible for, you better be in the review process!!! Don't let the CPO just grab your signature and pass it up to the MO. I would always grab their service records, and camp out in my office usually later at night, or on a weekend when no one was around to bother me. Not busting on my or any CPOs work, but another set of eyes reviewing the verbage never hurt, nor disussing your observations. The CPOs are going to get together with the DHs and rank the E5/E6s, and you should definintely provide input during that timeframe, not after the fact.

 

[IFT2O]

Great thread! Definately something for all of us mustangs to take a look at!!!

 

[RockyMtnNFO]

As the AV/ARM DIVO I relied on my Division Chief a great deal but still made it a point to be very involved; he spoke English as a second language and I went over almost every message/fitrep pretty carefully to make sure it sounded right. Who says an English degree is worthless.

It is what you make it. However much work you put into it, everyone will pretty much know how dedicated you are.