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Navy CSAR det gets rescue

zippy

zippy

Freedom!
pilot
Contributor
Just waiting for the Army/ company equivalent of an SIR to come out to explain what happened to cause the plane to do a forced landing T-34 style.
 
hscs

hscs

Registered User
pilot
jtmedli said:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...pter-rescue-mission-for-downed-plane-in-iraq/

Good work by our friends in HSC5. There's more to the story on this one but let's keep those details to ourselves if you know them. If it's not in the article (I.e. Already disclosed) then let's not discuss it here. Some good validation for all that PR training we've been doing.
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Concur - great work, but I would not say this one event validates the PR training. Lots more to this story - as always the devil is in the details.
 
J

jtmedli

Well-Known Member
pilot
hscs said:
Concur - great work, but I would not say this one event validates the PR training. Lots more to this story - as always the devil is in the details.
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Not saying that it means we're hear to win the war. Some very important people tried fight having the Navy put a CSAR det in place and say that a 'fleet squadron' couldn't do it (along with various other BS reasons) so having them actually get used in that capacity kinda makes them eat their words a little bit.

Youtube video:
 
J

jtmedli

Well-Known Member
pilot
Pags said:
From the cheap seats: Does it count as CSAR if there are firefighters and other civilians there?
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I get what you're saying and that's why I phrased the title the way I did. In my mind, yes. But I see the argument. These guys were very close to ending up on the wrong side of the wrong line and barely made it to a safe zone. In CSAR we have DARS and SAFE zones for this very reasons and we brief them accordingly. There were other entities involved to include the JPRC, PJs, AC130 gunship, and A10 coverage. I don't think discrediting what it was is fair because in your mind they didn't have to "fight your way in and fight your way out". Keep in mind that they're in a situation over there where civilians and fire trucks don't always = safety. In a lot of ways, if it were me, I'd feel safer if the civilians and fire trucks Weren't there.
 
zippy

zippy

Freedom!
pilot
Contributor
Pags said:
From the cheap seats: Does it count as CSAR if there are firefighters and other civilians there?
Click to expand...

Thank goodness for the Peshmerga and the Kurds. If they went down in ISIS controlled territory there's a good chance we'd end up seeing the crew being burnt to death in cages after being gang raped.

It's good to see that Personnel recovery has become a bigger priority over there. When things kicked off initially it wasn't due to the adminstrstions reluctance to have US forces on the ground, and the closest CSAR assets weren't even in country.
 
P

Pags

N/A
pilot
jtmedli said:
I get what you're saying and that's why I phrased the title the way I did. In my mind, yes. But I see the argument. These guys were very close to ending up on the wrong side of the wrong line and barely made it to a safe zone. In CSAR we have DARS and SAFE zones for this very reasons and we brief them accordingly. There were other entities involved to include the JPRC, PJs, AC130 gunship, and A10 coverage. I don't think discrediting what it was is fair because in your mind they didn't have to "fight your way in and fight your way out". Keep in mind that they're in a situation over there where civilians and fire trucks don't always = safety. In a lot of ways, if it were me, I'd feel safer if the civilians and fire trucks Weren't there.
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I get all this. It was mostly a joke. Mostly.

It's obviously goodness that the EMARSS crew came down in an area with friendly locals, that the plans all worked, and that the training paid off.

And glad to see HSC getting a chance to do Gods work.
 
hscs

hscs

Registered User
pilot
jtmedli said:
I get what you're saying and that's why I phrased the title the way I did. In my mind, yes. But I see the argument. These guys were very close to ending up on the wrong side of the wrong line and barely made it to a safe zone. In CSAR we have DARS and SAFE zones for this very reasons and we brief them accordingly. There were other entities involved to include the JPRC, PJs, AC130 gunship, and A10 coverage. I don't think discrediting what it was is fair because in your mind they didn't have to "fight your way in and fight your way out". Keep in mind that they're in a situation over there where civilians and fire trucks don't always = safety. In a lot of ways, if it were me, I'd feel safer if the civilians and fire trucks Weren't there.
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Jtmedi - not trying to discredit their work but this is a larger problem of HSC and HS before them. We look at the success of one mission and start beating our chests. When we beat our chest, we miss the fact that we have a data set of 1, that crews are likely very senior and that HSC is not manned, trained, and equipped to operate in this manner (away from ship - truly expeditionary).

It is natural to be excited, but your post borders on overconfidence. About the time you show overconfidence, you will have something really bad happen.

What we should do instead is to have a serious discussion on why there was so much controversy , what changes need to be made, and review of certain programmatic cuts in naval aviation.
 
J

jtmedli

Well-Known Member
pilot
hscs said:
It is natural to be excited, but your post borders on overconfidence. About the time you show overconfidence, you will have something really bad happen.

What we should do instead is to have a serious discussion on why there was so much controversy , what changes need to be made, and review of certain programmatic cuts in naval aviation.
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It's not overconfidence. Trust me. Just glad to see our crews getting to do something good over there. If you knew me, you'd know this. I don't think anything in my post indicated otherwise. I will say this though, I know who is over there and they took all flavors of pilots. Not just the O4s and O5s are out there flying.

Things like this will hopefully start those conversations which is why it's a good thing and why it validates the need to have PR asset/capability.
 
jmcquate

jmcquate

Well-Known Member
Contributor
To add another wildcard to this incident and any future one involving a similar type is the crew of the King Air (MC-12?) are SAIC (or something like that) civilian contractors, some prior, some not. With minimal training.
 
SynixMan

SynixMan

Mobilizer Extraordinaire
pilot
Contributor
Isn't the point here a good story and datapoint to the endless "We never do that, it's stupid" vs "Of course we'll never do it if we're never given the chance" crowds? Sure, not the craziest mission, but still.

Good on these guys for being on the watch when they were needed.
 
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