Questions for an NFO

[megadethstar]

Hey guys, I have become more and more interested in the Navy since I got out of high school and although I do love to fly, I also love to operate high tech equipment. So, I am looking heavily into becoming an NFO sometime in the future. What hours do you guys work? Is it like a 9 to 5 thing or ready at a moments notice kind of deal. Ive checked out Navy.com, Navy.mil, and several others but left me with some unanswered questions. I am very fit for the job, I can handle alot of G-forces (love roller coasters) and I have taken a tiny bit of civilian flight training. If anyone could fill me in on basically, what you guys do from day to day and enlighten me on the subject. Id rather be answered from a real NFO rather than reading and reading. And, oh yeah, I havent even heard of the NFO before I discovered it last year, where did it start?

 

[FLYMARINES]

Roller Coasters only pull on average about four g's max and they are not sustained g's liked jet aircraft, so roller coaster's don't accurately measure your real g tolerance. An F-16 can pull up to 9 g's and sustain them almost indefinitely. Also questions about life as an NFO have been asked a million times, so search some of the past threads for info like that, they have answers from real NFO's and good luck!

 

[megadethstar]

Holy ****, 9 g's? wow

 

[Brett327]

An F-16 can pull up to 9 g's and sustain them almost indefinitely.

In what bizzarro world are you living in?

Keeping it real,

Brett

 

[GeoffStahl]

A couple snap shots...

During Operation Southern Watch in 92...
About 4 hours of sleep a night. Brief, fly, plan fly, repeat. Very tiring but very rewarding. Lots of combat flight time, very busy flights (4 hours seemed like 5 minutes).

During a shore tour as an instructor at Strike Fighter Weapons School Pacific...
10 to 12 hours days were the normal when flying, 8 when not, with about 1/3 of the time at Fallon doing strike training with the squadrons. I was the only NFO so that was kind of weird but got lots of FA-18 flight time and my share of stick time. Work with both FRS students and squadron pilots. Again very busy but very rewarding.

I blasted through training with no delays and got my choice of aircraft and squadrons (choose E-2s but that is another story). When I got to my squadron, I met them in Panama doing counter narcotics operations. Overall I spent 44 months with my squadron tour 18 months on the boat, 30 months somewhere away from home. Was squadron legal officer, NATOPS officer, NFO training officer and admin officer during my tour. Got out with about 1500 hours.

Would I do it again, absolutely. Did I work my butt off, absolutely.

Why did I get out? Lots of time away from home, two much time in the FA-18 to go want to the E-2. =)

Good luck, it is never too early to chase your dreams.

 

[FLYMARINES]

In what bizzarro world are you living in?

Keeping it real,

Brett

True, the F-16 can sustain 9 G's indefintely. Source: My dad flew F-16's in the Air Force for 7 years, and he said so, and the Dash 1 says so (NATOPS for you guys who don't understand Air Force lingo.)

 

[A4sForever]

True, the F-16 can sustain 9 G's indefintely. Source: My dad flew F-16's in the Air Force for 7 years, and he said so, and the Dash 1 says so (NATOPS for you guys who don't understand Air Force lingo.)

I have fought F-16's, F-15's, F/A-18's (so what, right?) and the F-16 was the toughest to go against 1V1 or in a 30 plane furball .....

Yep, the Kid (and his Dad) are right .... and 9 sustained "G's" is now kind of a hardware standard designed into new fighters as a benchmark ever since the introduction of the F-16. The only "real" question that might be asked is how useful is this capability (sustained) for the average pilot? In other words ... how long can a pilot make use of this capability in a fight ???

The jury is still out on that one --- and the 30 degree cant-back seat on the F-16 is not/was not the right answer --- doesn't do you a lot of good when checking your "6" in a fight if you're laying down on the job . It seems the 9-G standard is being achieved as much by pilot training as it is by new aircraft hardware these days .... soooooooooo, it comes down to the pilot, once again, huh ???

When will they ever learn ??? ..... and be nice when you shoot them .....

 

[Brett327]

True, the F-16 can sustain 9 G's indefintely. Source: My dad flew F-16's in the Air Force for 7 years, and he said so, and the Dash 1 says so (NATOPS for you guys who don't understand Air Force lingo.)

Despite what the pubs might say, I have flown BFM many times vs F-16s and I am here to tell you that it just ain't so. They bleed energy just like anyone else and they are not going to be able to sustain 9 Gs in a turning fight once they get slow. The second angle of reality to introduce is the fuel factor. There is, of course, a huge fuel penalty for that kind of flying, so the notion of a Viper doing a sustained 9 G circle for a 1.5 flight is kind of out of the question. Now, don't get me wrong, the 16 is a great jet and can do some pretty nifty things, but I'd be careful about using terms like indefinitely and aviation together like that.

Good times,

Brett
Smiles for A4s

 

[A4sForever]

......I have flown BFM many times vs F-16s and I am here to tell you .......They bleed energy just like anyone else .......they are not going to be able to sustain 9 Gs in a turning fight once they get slow.
Good times,

Brett
Smiles for A4s

(edit: read to music) You say potat-O, I say po-TAH-to, let's work the whole thing out .....

"Indefinite" ... yeah, nothing is "indefinite" except death and taxes .....

Actually, that was also kind of my point in the above, Brett -- reality -- as you like to say. The plane can do it --- but that pesky little detail : the pilot?? --- HE can't sustain it. The best way to defeat an F16 was get close and get there often --- slow-speed rolling or horizontal scissors .... and he's mine.

Even in the A4 when I was in great shape (p.s. and some said I was beautiful ) --- while pulling hard across the "circle" to cut someone in an F4 or an F15 down, I would "gray-out" occasionally (regularly?) --- no problem, it happeneds when you're pulling -- sustained -- hard. But since I knew where I was and what I was doing --- and the resultant "velocity vector" was "UP" .... I just kept pulling until my vision came back. Then ........

In the saddle --- GUNS KILL !!!! ) with smiles, of course)

Here's a Bf-109 (running drugs :icon_rast) I tagged and bagged over South Texas ..... GUNS KILL !!!

 

[ip568]

What hours do you guys work? Is it like a 9 to 5 thing or ready at a moments notice kind of deal.

>>It's 24/7, actually. You fly when and where you are needed. Between deployments you get a less strenuous 18/6. On deployment (in VP, anyway), you will hit the NATOPS spin cycle: on 18, off 18, for weeks or months at a time, with a rare day off. You lose track of the days.

Ive checked out Navy.com, Navy.mil, and several others but left me with some unanswered questions. I am very fit for the job, I can handle alot of G-forces (love roller coasters) and I have taken a tiny bit of civilian flight training. If anyone could fill me in on basically, what you guys do from day to day and enlighten me on the subject. Id rather be answered from a real NFO rather than reading and reading.

>>It's a rush, no doubt about it. But very tiring. Besides flying a full schedule, you'll also be a branch/division officer, coffee mess officer the first six months in your squadron, morale officer, and whatever else you're assigned. The flying is very technical in the buttonology involved plus tactics, weapon, nav, ASW, etc. When you make mission commander, the entire flight is your responsibility. Another benefit: travel. VP/P-3s go EVERYWHERE, and you take your own airplane. Some days you'll spend at the squadron, writing enlisted evals or working on the op plan or working with your chief to fix a problem in your division. 12 hours later you'll be hanging over a moonlit sea at 20,000 feet, dropping a sono pattern and listening for a Russian or Chinese sub.

And, oh yeah, I havent even heard of the NFO before I discovered it last year, where did it start?

>>The NFO designation was created in 1968 from what had been the Aviation Observer designation. It's beena long haul for the Navy to make the NFO equal to the NA. It wasn't until 1974 that NFOs could command. The first NFO VADM happened around 1985.

Any questions, drop me a note at ip568@charter.net

 

[A4sForever]

Hey guys....... I havent even heard of the NFO before I discovered it last year, where did it start?

"Navigators in Command" --- a naval perspective, by Major Michael E. Richardson USAF (!!)

One of the better "reads" on the evolution and background of NFO's and Navigators I've seen -- from the historical perspective. Dated; obviously, but still valuable and pertinent to your question. (once again, the USAF learns from the U.S. Navy ..... smiles ... and NFO means smiles )

Air University Review, January-February 1978: http://www.airpower.maxwell.af.mil/airchronicles/aureview/1978/jan-feb/richardson.html#richardson

(edit: page opens at bottom (?) -- for you Aggies, scroll to top ... smiles )