• Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?

    Go here:

    Edit Account Details and Profile

Titan Rain

raptor10

Philosoraptor
Contributor
I was reading about the confirmation hearings for Gates, and came across some serious overt threats from China that I had never even heard about...

Gates and China

SEN. INHOFE: The -- in 2000, we formed the U.S.-China Security Economic Review Commission, and it's usually referred to the U.S.- China Commission. They have had -- come out with five reports. This is the fifth report that just came out. I've been disturbed that no one seems to care about these. They don't seem to read these and understand what's in them. I have a couple of questions about that I want to ask you. But I am concerned about China, and I'd like to hear what your thoughts are.

And just in the last month the Chinese hackers, as you, I'm sure, have read, have shut down the e-mail and official computer work at the Naval War College. The -- this is referred to by this commission as the "tightened rein"(strikethrough) "Titan Rain."

In September the Department of Commerce experienced a massive shutdown of its computer system. This goes on and on.

In July the State Department acknowledged that Chinese attacks had broken into systems overseas and in Washington.

Recently China's been -- used lasers to blind our satellites.
On October 26th a Song-class Chinese submarine surfaced near the USS Kitty Hawk. They'd been following them undetected for a long period of time.

I've had occasion to spend quite a bit of time in Africa, and I noticed that China's presence in Africa, particularly in those states around the Sea of Guinea and where they have great oil reserves, is there. And they are way ahead of us. It happens that China and United States are the two countries that depend on foreign sources of oil more than any of the other countries.

The -- as this continues, I'd like to ask you what your feeling is about this as a top priority, about how you view China, about whether or not you have read these reports, and if not, if you would or if you plan to do that, and if you agree with some of that which you have heard coming out in these reports.

Some more info on Titan Rain

Also I saw Red Dawn for the first time today...
 

Goober

Professional Javelin Catcher
None
Not to be a buzzkill, but whatever anyone reads about TR in the outside public world, that's enough. This is a topic best left alone. If you have to ask, don't.
 

Carno

Insane
Yeah, my bad. But when has that ever worked?

Saying, "Just don't ask!" only serves to make one more curious.
 

Cobra Commander

Awesome Bill from Dawsonville
pilot
Back to the original topic... Maybe someone can clear this up for me but I what I don't understand why the Chinese would do this type of stuff. If you think about all of the trade between the US and China it seems counter intuative to be doing this type of thing to one of your biggest trade partners. I need a better reason than that the Chinese are evil. Thoughts?
 

MasterBates

Well-Known Member
First, you have the differnce in cultures, both historical, and the current differences in our free market, vs theirs.

Historically, the Chinese think LONG TERM. As in centuries. They will not kill the golden goose, until they have one themselves. But the death of 1000 papercuts and other subtelties are their historical earmarks.
 

nittany03

Recovering NFO. Herder of Programmers.
pilot
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Put it this way, if you ever hear anything referred to by a random codeword like Titan Rain, it means it's classified up the wazoo. The details will be told to you if you need to know them. If not, don't ask because you won't be told.
 

Cobra Commander

Awesome Bill from Dawsonville
pilot
What I'm trying to get at is that there must be some kind of political/ reigious ideology that drives this behavior. It doesn't just come out of no where. I was just thinking from a purely economic point of view that aggressive actions agianst folks you trade with just doesn't compute. There has to be some kind of ultimate goal like being the top super power.

As far as TR goes, I don't care about specifics, but I do think that the long list of incidences involving the Chinese is as bizzare as it is disturbing.
 

eddie

Working Plan B
Contributor
What I'm trying to get at is that there must be some kind of political/ reigious ideology that drives this behavior. It doesn't just come out of no where. I was just thinking from a purely economic point of view that aggressive actions agianst folks you trade with just doesn't compute. There has to be some kind of ultimate goal like being the top super power.
This is why I'm can't be an IR major...

Motives? They are the Chinese. Power, long term victory, ALWAYS trumps trade. They aren't communists or capitalists; they're Chinese. It's not about ideology, it's about hard-boiled, long-standing, cultural institutionalism. Economics? Balance of Power? The ideas behind these things are tools the Chinese utilize against their Western makers, not rule sets they play by.

They may not appear rational or practical to you, me, and other "Westerners" (an appropriate term, in this case...), but, that's part of the beauty of it.
 

raptor10

Philosoraptor
Contributor
The western model of economics and the eastern model of economics are really quite different. In western societies the goal of loans, investments, banks is... to make money. Simple right? In China the economy is used to develop and cement personal and political relationships.

I.e. you own a construction company that is in the red but employs tons of people in your province, the government funded banks will continue to give you loans (that they don't ever expect you to pay off). This increases the reputation of the bank and its employees, which is the real currency in China.

I know A4s has already said it, but sign up for the intelligence reports from www.stratfor.org . Lots and lots of gouge on the problems that will happen when China joins the WTO.
 

pourts

former Marine F/A-18 pilot & FAC, current MBA stud
pilot
Second Stratfor. Great analysis and insight that you cannot get anywhere else as a civilian. They are not right every single time, but they provide info you won't get from any other news source, period. And, its free.
 
Top