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U.S. to boost arms sales to India

89-LX

Registered User
NEW DELHI, India (CNN) -- India will be able to buy more sophisticated fighter aircraft and other high-tech arms from the United States as part of a closer defense relationship between the two nations, the United States Department of Defense has said.

This would include state-of-the-art combat aircraft including the F-16 and F-18, the department said in a statement released Thursday.

"It is our goal to help meet India's needs in the defense realm, and to provide important capabilities and technologies that India seeks. We are on a path to accomplish this," the statement said.

The defense decision comes as the U.S. and India signed a groundbreaking nuclear pact during a visit to New Delhi by U.S. President George W. Bush.

Under that deal, the U.S. agrees to send nuclear fuel and expertise to India in exchange for New Delhi opening up its civilian nuclear reactors to international inspectors.

The arms decision will be viewed with interest by India's regional rival Pakistan, which President Bush will visit briefly on Saturday.

India was disappointed by a U.S. decision nearly 12 months ago to sell F-16s to Pakistan, a key U.S. ally in its war on terror.

"Where only a few years ago, no one would have talked about the prospects for a major U.S.-India defense deal, today the prospects are promising, whether in the realm of combat aircraft, helicopters, maritime patrol aircraft or naval vessels," the department statement said.

"We have indicated our intention to offer both the F-16 and the F-18, both combat proven aircraft. As additional capabilities enter our force, we will work with the government of India to make them available," it said.

"Our proposal will also address India's interest in technology transfer and indigenous co-production."

President Bush's three-day Indian trip continues Friday with a trip to the thriving technology metropolis of Hyderabad.

It is expected the president will be met again by protesters reflecting the nation's mixed feelings about the United States -- a country seen as a loyal friend by some and a global bully by others.

On Wednesday, nearly 150,000 protesters, most of them Muslims, demonstrated in New Delhi.

However, only a few thousand protesters took part in Thursday's demonstrations -- made up of a mix of social and environmental groups. "Bush is a killer," one sign read.

Local police in Mumbai said at least 65,000 anti-Bush protesters rallied there Thursday. Protesters burned effigies and shouted slogans.

Under the nuclear deal announced Thursday, India pledges to open up its 14 civilian nuclear reactors to international inspectors and keep power generation separate from its military program.

But India -- which first tested its nuclear weapons nearly eight years ago -- will keep eight sites for secret military purposes under the terms of the deal, reached after intense negotiation.

Some details of the agreement were not released. The U.S. Congress must approve the terms before any action can be taken.

Bush said India and the United States were developing closer ties and that expanding India's nuclear power capacity would ease pressure on fossil fuels and the U.S. economy.

"We have concluded a historic agreement today on nuclear power," Bush said at a news conference Thursday with Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in New Delhi. (Watch for details on the last-minute deal -- 2:17)

Bush said the agreement would help to "make the world safer" and praised India for setting an example "for other nations to participate in civilian nuclear power in such a way as to address nonproliferation concerns."

India has not signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty designed to stop the spread of nuclear weapons to non-nuclear nations, and critics say the India deal could undermine the international pact.

But Bush, who is in India to build relations, said he would lobby Congress to approve the deal, which faces opposition in both countries. (President's trip in pictures)

"I am confident we can sell this to our Congress as in the interests of the United States," said Bush, who is trying to reduce U.S. dependence on fossil fuels.

A richer India also could be a larger market for U.S. goods and Bush is anxious to help.

India's economy is booming and requiring more power, and that demand is expected to continue to rise.

The nuclear issue became the biggest single irritant in U.S.-India relations after the 1998 India nuclear tests triggered fears of a nuclear arms race when New Delhi's neighbor and traditional foe, Pakistan, conducted its own nuclear tests days later.

India and the United States now say the nuclear pact is the centerpiece of what they call a "strategic partnership."

But many Indian scientists and others in the nuclear establishment fear it will erode the military ambitions of the world's second most populous country and possible Asian counterbalance to the power of China as well as Pakistan.

Potential political fallout
Aware of their concerns, Singh has pleaded for their support.

"There has been no erosion of the integrity of our nuclear doctrine either in terms of current or future capabilities," he said earlier.

Despite the potential political fallout from the deal, both sides have much to gain, one analyst said.

"The essence of this strategic partnership is to provide a countervailing influence to China ... to act as a restraint on the exercise of Chinese power," security analyst Brahma Chellaney said.

Beijing was quick to respond Thursday.

Any pact "must meet the requirements and provisions of the nuclear nonproliferation regime and the obligations undertaken by all countries concerned," The Associated Press quoted Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Qin Gang as saying.

While Bush was in India, blasts killed at least four people, including an American diplomat, near the U.S. Consulate in the Pakistani city of Karachi, police said. (Full story)

Bush is set to travel to Pakistan on Saturday. On Thursday, Bush underscored his support for that country, a key U.S. ally in the fight against terrorism. (See the Bush itinerary)

"Terrorists and killers are not going to prevent me from going to Pakistan," Bush said of the next country to be visited on his South Asian tour.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapcf/03/02/bush.india.fri/index.html
 

ATLien

Can I talk to you, Michael?
pilot
Good. We need the money and as long as the world views American products as being good products (and buys them), I'm happy.

We live in a United States that is no longer the vanguard of technological advances. Very soon after WWII, we were universally acknowledged as the world's superpower, beat the Soviets to the moon, and created the thermonuclear bomb among other things. This momentum carried us onto the personal computer, CDs, etc. I feel that our engineering minds are waning as our premier educational institutions such as MIT now unofficially stand for "Made in Taiwan" as foreigners flock to our schools and leave just as quickly for research and development in their own countries. I go to an engineering school that produces more humanities majors than engineers. Where are the technological breakthroughs coming from? Who is respected for their engineering prowess? If we don't watch it, learning Japanese, German, and Chinese might be courses imbedded in our curriculum of political science, reading, and coloring.
 

eddie

Working Plan B
Contributor
ATLien said:
If we don't watch it, learning Japanese, German, and Chinese might be courses imbedded in our curriculum of political science, reading, and coloring.
With the "degree thread" still fresh in memory, I'm going to go out on a limb here...

Japanese and Chinese cultures will enhance and increase efficiency in existing systems, but they will not innovate or invent new things. The only "proof" I have of this is my father (who worked marketing and product management for a software company) telling me about how those guys operate.

And I'm not talking about "Buy American" or whatever. I'm talking about willlingness to break from the flock and try something new and risky...

Germans; I have no idea.
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
ATLien said:
We live in a United States that is no longer the vanguard of technological advances... as foreigners flock to our schools and leave just as quickly for research and development in their own countries.

These two statements in a way contradict each other. Nowhere else do people flock to for education as they do to the United States. That says something. It says we are the education center of the world, and universities are responsible for some of the greatest research, especially places like MIT (Lincoln Labs anyone?). It IS a shame that we can educate some of the world's brightest software developers (China and India) and can't keep them here for some period of time for milking our education system.

I believe the lag in technological advance in the US is largely influenced by the population. Japan is years ahead of is in consumer technology such as cellphone networks and whatnot. They live for that sh!t. People here, for a large part, don't care. Therefore, it lags a few years. It's kind of like fashion and trends... New York and LA start most of it, and a couple years later the midwest and Rockies are picking it up (not so much now with 1000 entertainment stations and such on TV).
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
The interesting thing is in how the US is reproaching India WRT the nuclear issue. Since India isn't an NPT signatory, it would seem like a US policy shift which says that Nukes are OK if you're a democracy - interesting. This could have implications in legitimizing Israel's nukes in the context of what Iran is pushing towards. Hopefully it will also keep the pressure on Pakistan, the seed of evil of the Islamic world, IMHO.

Brett
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
Fly Navy said:
......It IS a shame that we can educate some of the world's brightest software developers (China and India) and can't keep them here for some period of time for milking our education system.
...
Very true, Fly-Guy .... maybe we should put an INCONUS "service obligation" on their student visas ??? But without a reason (or a pretty blond girl to keep 'em here) it's 'cause they go "home" and become virtual zillionaires on their local economy. They could NEVER duplicate the $$$$$ equivalent of the USA --- IN the USA --- without retreating to the Motherland. Guess "they" don't care if the water is O.K. and the electricity works 24/7 and blah, blah, blah .... ?

That's kind of why at one time, while very weak and running from an ex-wife, I toyed with the idea of moving to the Philippines -- permanently -- I could have become the Great White equivalent of Ferdinand Marcos. Literally in the top .05% of the socio-economic Philippine ladder.
They grow lots of limes there. Mabuhay. :icon_rast
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
Brett327 said:
.......India isn't an NPT signatory, it would seem like a US policy shift which says that Nukes are OK if you're a democracy - interesting. This could have implications in legitimizing Israel's nukes ....
I think it's "nukes are O.K." if you are pulling an oar in OUR boat ??? :)

And then again ... "NEW DELHI, India (CNN) -- India will be able to buy more sophisticated fighter aircraft and other high-tech arms from the United States as part of a closer defense relationship between the two nations, the United States Department of Defense has said."

Gotta love them Rupees ... yes??
 

skidkid

CAS Czar
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
This is a very smart move. A closer US/India strategic realtionship is a good thing. Personal opinion India will be the shining star of Asia very soon and this century maybe the Asian century. Think about it, India is second to China in population, has more natural resources and has the British (government, economic and military) institutions that cant be overemphasized in importance.
India is a nutural counterweight to any rise in Chinese power not to mention a much more reliable ally in the fight against radical islamic terrorists
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
skidkid said:
.....Think about it.....India is a nutural counterweight to any rise in Chinese power not to mention a much more reliable ally in the fight against radical (islam)......
I agree ... it's global power politics, as always .... and you gotta' love that British colonial-bureaucratic preparation of the ground. Especially since the WOGs have decided NOT to shoot us down if we busted their ADIZ like they threatened to do in 1974. Then ... the Russkies were their newest, best friends. Now we are .... ? :icon_wink

They are great "buddies" ... now ..... until .... when ??? :bigeyes_1

(good to see you alive and kickin', Skid ... )
 

skidkid

CAS Czar
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
A4sForever said:
I agree ... it's global power politics, as always .... and you gotta' love that British colonial-bureaucratic preparation of the ground. Especially since the WOGs have decided NOT to shoot us down if we busted their ADIZ like they threatened to do in 1974. Then ... the Russkies were their newest, best friends. Now we are .... ? :icon_wink

They are great "buddies" ... now ..... until .... when ??? :bigeyes_1

(good to see you alive and kickin', Skid ... )


I think that probably had something to do with Nixon's trips to China when the Us was playing all nice with the Chinese to provide a counterweight to Soviet influence in Asia. From a realpolotik point of view they had to jump in bed with the Russians since they were about to ahve a shooting war on the border with China and the US was running guns through Pakistan to the Mujahedin (remember those guys-yeah we are fighting them now)
Ahh global politics, its like one big playground with shifting alliances and interests.

Alive yes, kicking sometimes
 

Cate

Pretty much invincible
It sounds like a great deal economically, and at this point India is about 80% yet-untapped potential; no harm in getting in while the getting's good. My only concern would be how this would affect the US's relationship with Pakistan. With the Middle East still so unstable and high-up members of al Qaeda still alive and kicking and making videos, we're depending on the Paksitani government to keep us informed of everything that happens within their borders. Selling weapons to their mortal enemies isn't the greatest way of cementing their support. It's all about priorities, I guess.
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Cate said:
It sounds like a great deal economically, and at this point India is about 80% yet-untapped potential; no harm in getting in while the getting's good. My only concern would be how this would affect the US's relationship with Pakistan. With the Middle East still so unstable and high-up members of al Qaeda still alive and kicking and making videos, we're depending on the Paksitani government to keep us informed of everything that happens within their borders. Selling weapons to their mortal enemies isn't the greatest way of cementing their support. It's all about priorities, I guess.
I think our approach to Pakistan is shifting more towards the stick vs. the carrot. Musharaf and the Army are the only thing keeping that country from going full-blown Narco-terrorist state (now with more Islam). They need to feel the squeeze every now and then to let them know who's in charge. Musharaf has to walk an extremely fine line between the ISI backed Jihadists in his country and the big picture power politics. He knows that if his regime crumbles or falls to the extremists, the US will immediately go in to relieve him of his nukes. This has to be that country's worst fear as that's the only credible deterrent they have to India. Stay tuned kids!

Brett
 

Cate

Pretty much invincible
I certainly hope that's the case. Musharaf has been all kinds of passive-aggressive ever since we left Pakistan, and that sort of behavior just cheeses me off.
 
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