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First Shore Tour to NPS

Not undesirable at all, just that in getting a patch your community generally expects you to go to billets that you'll go do things that require patch level knowledge. At least in MPRA per our WTM if you get a patch you're required to do a shore tour in a WTI billet (aka MPRWS, WTU, NSAWC, NMAWC, some VP-30 billets, or some forward CTF billet). For MPRA if you did a WTI shore tour you can be eligible for the super JO gig (now called SMTI) provided you meet some other requirements. We only have 12 squadrons so less demand for numbers of super JOs vice boat orders, so it's pretty competitive to get.
 
Flash said:
I knew a few folks who did the 'fellowship' or other special program shore tour after their initial sea tour and all have gone on to bigger and better things. Are they common tours for folks to end up in? No, but they do exist and seem to hold a special cachet for the participants and their chances down the line even today.
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In the current climate, I'd be very careful about labeling any NOB tour as competitive. I would never advise a due course JO to take a NOB tour of any flavor over a production tour if that JO desired to remain competitive for O4/DH/CO.
 
There is also an instruction out there that dictates anyone who gets level IV (aka, a WTI), owes two years post weapons school/NSAWC in a sea going tour. It doesn't specify that it has to be as a super JO but only a sea tour.

In HSC land, the current business practice is to detail post weapons school guys as the super JOs and CAG staff, with the leftover CAG staff billets going to shit hot RAG guys.
 
BleedGreen said:
When you say, "payback" for getting their WTI patch, are you implying WTI is a less desirable shore tour? I thought going to WTI was a good deal, is that not the case?
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I put payback in quotes because it's not a bad deal at all. In fact, it's pretty much the best deal going. WTI is a golden ticket and the payback associated with it keeps you flying and you stay active, relevant, and current in your community. You'd be hard pressed to find anything negative about it.
 
Brett327 said:
In the current climate, I'd be very careful about labeling any NOB tour as competitive. I would never advise a due course JO to take a NOB tour of any flavor over a production tour if that JO desired to remain competitive for O4/DH/CO.
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As a more current data point a peer of mine went to become an Ohlmstead Scholar and was 2xFOS for O-4. When he called the detailer to negotiate disassociated orders he was given his choice of crap billets to include ATO on the CVN. He had a high up contact at PERS who said even if he had been the CNO's aide it wouldn't have saved him from getting FOSd.
 
Pags said:
I put payback in quotes because it's not a bad deal at all. In fact, it's pretty much the best deal going. WTI is a golden ticket and the payback associated with it keeps you flying and you stay active, relevant, and current in your community. You'd be hard pressed to find anything negative about it.
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I won't say 100% golden ticket. I know a dude this year who didn't make O-4 and a bunch who didn't screen for DH. Some who got picked up second round look only got OP-T, which basically means no O-5 for them.
 
CommodoreMid said:
I won't say 100% golden ticket. I know a dude this year who didn't make O-4 and a bunch who didn't screen for DH. Some who got picked up second round look only got OP-T, which basically means no O-5 for them.
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"Only OP-T.."
Yeah, might be the best gig out there...
Stay current, meet a shit-ton of airline pilots, and get to see your family.
Those guys are really suffering...
 
CommodoreMid said:
I won't say 100% golden ticket.
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P-3 folks?

Methinks this is community-dependent. Like Pags, I understand SWTI to be the current golden path for helo guys. Anecdotal "evidence" points to damn-near guaranteed CO unless you choose to quit trying.

I think a lot of the stats and stories depend on the DH:JO and O-5: DH ratios in a community's deploying squadrons. For example, single-seat VFA squadrons need just as many DHs as an HSC CVW squadron, but they don't have as many JOs. So, I would expect VFA DH opportunity to be high, especially given the O-4 board "blindness."
 
CommodoreMid said:
I won't say 100% golden ticket. I know a dude this year who didn't make O-4 and a bunch who didn't screen for DH. Some who got picked up second round look only got OP-T, which basically means no O-5 for them.
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Your mileage will vary by community and there are exceptions to every rule.

My largely uninformed impression is that VP hasn't fully bought in to the WTI concept as fully as other communities so that may also be affecting the outcome.
 
Pags said:
As a more current data point a peer of mine went to become an Ohlmstead Scholar and was 2xFOS for O-4. When he called the detailer to negotiate disassociated orders he was given his choice of crap billets to include ATO on the CVN. He had a high up contact at PERS who said even if he had been the CNO's aide it wouldn't have saved him from getting FOSd.
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The Navy's loss, pretty stupid to make that investment and then cut them loose. Myopic, why have someone like that when you can have nothing but former RAG instructors as your DH pool? Stavridis and McMaster would be proud. Fortunately it did not happen to the folks I know who went similar routes.
 
Flash said:
The Navy's loss, pretty stupid to make that investment and then cut them loose. Myopic, why have someone like that when you can have nothing but former RAG instructors as your DH pool? Stavridis and McMaster would be proud. Fortunately it did not happen to the folks I know who went similar routes.
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Agreed.

Ducks pick ducks.
 
Naval Aviation doesn't do strategy very well.

*also applies to personnel practices and policies
 
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