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I need help getting SWO information

A

AJOaks

Member
First of all, I am enlisted in the air national guard. I have been selected for SWO in the Navy and RPA Pilot in the Air Force.

I am married with no kids, but want them someday, and have 2 dogs and a cat. My wife's "fur babies." She also has a horse that I will gladly try to have moved out where we are stationed at a nearby stable to help keep her occupied and happy.

I am trying to find out some good information on what she can expect. She has this preconceived opinion of the Navy and it's hard to get her to actually look into it.

From what I have read and researched, as it stands now I feel like SWO would actually be easier on the family rather than the undermanned RPA career field. However, if I am mistaken or anyone has more insight on this, please correct me.

Thanks in advance.
 
I spent many hours in the Gulf on deployment communicating with dudes who were RPA pilots "deployed" at their home base. Their biggest bitch was they had to work a lot of holidays and weekends, and had night shifts which would hinder their daily routine when they went home to their families every day... I'd look around combat and look at people who worked holidays and weekends and hadn't seen their families in months and wouldn't for months more, and resisted my urges to say to "fuck you" to them.

RPA pilots and SWOs get about the same amount of respect by other members of their service. QOL wise RPA pilots win hands down.
 
First, there's no such thing as a "family friendly" first tour for a Navy junior Line (air, subs, swo, etc) officer. You're going to be gone from home a lot and working long hours when you are home.

AF RPA and SWO are both career fields that have difficulty with retention, historically. You can tell a lot about a job when people vote with their feet.

I will say that at least it sounds like the Shoes are trying to remedy the situation, which is heartening. The AF is a long way from solving their RPA Pilot retention problem.

The AF RPA community doesn't have a lot going for it. They're a vital part of the war right now, but they don't get much respect in the service and career prospects both inside and outside are somewhat limited. Maybe that'll change in the future, but that's how things look right now.

There are already several threads on AW about SWOLife, so have a look around and ask any remaining unanswered questions.
 
I'll just start by saying that I don't know anything about the RPA field, but can tell you a bit about SWO. Most of the lifestyle stuff has already been answered in other threads, as others already pointed out.

Every ship is different, but in general you can expect long hours, duty once a week (or more), and various underways and at least one or two deployments during your first two tours. She's going to have to be able to get by on her own without you and get used to job unpredictability.
 
Oh boy, where do I start? I have a buddy who's an RPA pilot and he's always posting pictures on the weekend of him flying or skydiving or any of the other myriad of hobbies he has. Me, I've spent 90% of the last 4 years away from homeport. I'm lucky in the fact that I've been able to see my wife and daughter about once every other month right now, many can't. My first tour was even worse than this one. As a SWO, expect LOTS of time away at sea and when you're in port expect to work half days (12 hours is half a day, get it?). Deployments are increasing to anywhere between 7-9 months being the norm and the requirements on ships for inspections is only increasing. Also, as a JO you can expect to have even more hours added to your work day in order to get your pin. Unless SWO is something that you truly want or is on the path to something else that you want, then I would not choose it if you think your family cannot hack the separation.
 
Thank you all for the replies. We are still not completely sure which route to go. My wife has warmed up to the idea of me being gone, to give her the chance to grow into adulthood better on her own. It is good for us that we do not have any kids yet, so it should be a little easier on my wife. She has a good head on her shoulders and has a couple of time consuming hobbies to keep her occupied. I also know the Navy knows that because of the mission, ships are gone and families stay back, so the Navy has made support systems for them. Me and my wife are also forgiven sinners that "try" to get to church as often as we can, and that support system seems to be pretty solid. I also throw my favorite line on her when things get tough, and I am sure I'll have to use it for her and myself numerous times in my career, that God gives his toughest battles to his strongest warriors. If other families have done it, we don't have to be any different.

As for myself, I want the chance to be the "traditional" officer in a leadership role, with the chance of moving up the chain of command into more responsibility. The RPA Pilot mission seems like it would be fun, but I feel like it would not take long for the "fun" to go away. Nothing against the RPA mission, I applied for it for a reason, but I just seem to want the chance to get the sh** kicked out of me mentally and physically, and then see it all come together once I, hopefully, lead a good division/department on a deployment. It also seems to me that the RPA field has a ceiling as to how far you can go with it, at least until the appropriate manpower is there to allow the pilots to take on different opportunities.

And from what I have read in all the other threads on here and many different forums, I think I have heard about 50 something different experiences, with the one common factor of it being what you make of your situation.

Once again, thank you for taking the time to respond to me!
 
One more thing you might want to consider is your career options after the military (if you decide to get out after your first tour). Generally SWOs seem to go into management positions or back to school with their GI Bills. I've only known two who actually worked on ships after the Navy and they were attended a Merchant Marine Academy.

I don't know about the post-military lives of RPA pilots, but you'd have the leadership experience as well as a lot of experience in what is now a fast-growing field, which could be worth a lot in the civilian sector.

Just something else to consider.
 
AJOaks said:
. . . but I just seem to want the chance to get the sh** kicked out of me mentally and physically, and then see it all come together once I, hopefully, lead a good division/department on a deployment. It also seems to me that the RPA field has a ceiling as to how far you can go with it, at least until the appropriate manpower is there to allow the pilots to take on different opportunities.

And from what I have read in all the other threads on here and many different forums, I think I have heard about 50 something different experiences, with the one common factor of it being what you make of your situation.
Click to expand...

You will get this, a LOT of it. People do not joke around when they say SWO life is difficult and that "SWOs eat their young." Swerdna has a good point as well about post-military opportunities. If you like flying drones/UAVs but you hate the military, there are plenty of jobs flying drones as a civilian (hell, they even deploy), but the Navy does absolutely nothing for you as a SWO if you want to earn your licenses to join the merchant marine or civilian shipping industry. Also, if you have a specific field that you hope to get back into after the military, think about what 4 to 7 years away from that will do to your options. As a SWO you will have little time for anything beyond the ship and that means to the detriment of your personal, professional, spiritual, and emotional life.
 
AJOaks said:
Thank you all for the replies. We are still not completely sure which route to go. My wife has warmed up to the idea of me being gone, to give her the chance to grow into adulthood better on her own. It is good for us that we do not have any kids yet, so it should be a little easier on my wife. She has a good head on her shoulders and has a couple of time consuming hobbies to keep her occupied. I also know the Navy knows that because of the mission, ships are gone and families stay back, so the Navy has made support systems for them. Me and my wife are also forgiven sinners that "try" to get to church as often as we can, and that support system seems to be pretty solid. I also throw my favorite line on her when things get tough, and I am sure I'll have to use it for her and myself numerous times in my career, that God gives his toughest battles to his strongest warriors. If other families have done it, we don't have to be any different.

As for myself, I want the chance to be the "traditional" officer in a leadership role, with the chance of moving up the chain of command into more responsibility. The RPA Pilot mission seems like it would be fun, but I feel like it would not take long for the "fun" to go away. Nothing against the RPA mission, I applied for it for a reason, but I just seem to want the chance to get the sh** kicked out of me mentally and physically, and then see it all come together once I, hopefully, lead a good division/department on a deployment. It also seems to me that the RPA field has a ceiling as to how far you can go with it, at least until the appropriate manpower is there to allow the pilots to take on different opportunities.

And from what I have read in all the other threads on here and many different forums, I think I have heard about 50 something different experiences, with the one common factor of it being what you make of your situation.

Once again, thank you for taking the time to respond to me!
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I don't know anything about being a SWO as you can see from my signature, but I think you'll go far in this, or any career field with your positive attitude. Good luck to ya!
 
RPAs are the way of the future... Our ships are often broken and crews are bitter.

The closest I ever came to resigning my commission happened on my boat tour...twice. I never even considered it anywhere else in aviation. During my last job interview, they didn't ask anything about my boat tour even though it was the first page of my resume.

If you have a dream of commanding a boat, SWOs the life for you. Promotion potential is great because of the attrition rate amongst junior officers in the community, so you'll have a decent shot of moving up the career ladder as long as you keep fogging the mirror and don't get into trouble.

If you enjoy a quality of life outside of work, and want to have good ability to communicate with your family while deployed to some of the shitholes in the world, I recommend you reconsider your decision.
 
I've been a Navy spouse for more than a decade (eep!). I'd be happy to correspond with her and try to answer any questions if she'd like. Be forewarned that I'll give honest answers, whether they are favorable of the Navy, or not. Send me a PM if interested and she and I can chat that way. My husband is an aviator, so I can't speak about the SWO lifestyle specifically, but the Navy and those support systems you mention I can do.

Some things to think about. IME, horse people are fanatical. There are going to be significant costs associated with schleping a horse from Rhode Island to San Diego (or whatever). Make sure you really think that through before you make any promises about her horse "always" coming with you guys. And if you end up overseas, forget it. No horse. Also, most military housing only allows 2 pets (and many have breed restrictions as well), so keep that in mind. Even if you have no intention of living in military housing, the military can have different ideas. You get an overseas assignment to a place with mandatory housing, and it's Sophie's Choice for your wife. I believe Air Force policy is similar--two pets in housing.

Your second post mentioned that because the Navy knows that missions are difficult, they have support systems. We are at a joint base right now, and my observation is that it doesn't seem like the Navy has better/stronger/more support systems than any branch. Mostly, you have spouses clubs, and the robustness and value of those depends entirely on the command. Some are great, and some are nearly non-existant or are exceptionally dysfunctional. They are run essentially entirely by the volunteer efforts of spouses so how much time goes in to them, what kind of events they have, general culture, and pretty much everything else vary based on who is passing through at the time and who has stepped into leadership roles in the group. Be careful about assuming they will be there to cradle your family while you are gone. They might be, or they might be simply a monthly meeting, a contact roster, and little more. One group for the same command could even be both of those as CO spouses and other involved spouses change during your time. I have a friend who was the wife of an Air Force officer, who stayed in long enough for command and post-command tours. He wasn't RPA or aviation, but her experiences with the spouses clubs seems to be fairly similar. As for programs outside the spouses groups, they are few and far between. Occasionally there are some "how to write a resume" kind of offerings, and there is access to mental health care, but that's about it. From your post, I get the impression maybe you think the support systems are more robust than they really are.

I am not a church-goer, but I do think that most military communities, especially the more distant or remote ones, have strong church communities so that will likely serve you and your wife well.

I won't step outside my lane and give you advice on your two choices, even if I had advice to offer. But as a general note, you are the one who has to go to work everyday and do the job. Both are going to have a fair amount--or more--of suck, and of course you and your wife are a team and should make decisions accordingly. But in the end, her having you home a bit more isn't going to be better on your marriage if you are miserable.
 
AllAmerican75 said:
Navy does absolutely nothing for you as a SWO if you want to earn your licenses to join the merchant marine or civilian shipping industry.
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Yes, and no. Sea time is credible as a SWO 3 to 1 toward a 3rd Mate/OICNW ticket assuming the vessel is over 1600 GRT. As far as professional development and the required classes, save your money if that's your ambition after SWO life, there are no Navy qualifications that will cross over unless you pursue federal service (I.E Mag Sprink, HCO, LSE, etc etc.) so yea SOL there, but honestly sea time is usually the big issue. I had to explain to the last QMC that I worked with what counted, and what didn't count towards a license. I'm not 100% sure, but some of the BRM classes at NSST might count for that cert. I know NSST can definitely sign you off on assessments for OICNW if you can convince them to help you out.
 
Thank you all for the replies.

I will inform this group that I have decided to take my SWO selection. All my paperwork was turned in last Thursday and could possibly go to OCS mid-October.

Oddly enough, my wife was a little hesitant at first, but once she researched more about the two jobs, she called me at work Thursday morning and told me to call my recruiter and go with the Navy. Funny how things can change in a week.

A lot of that had to do with her talking to some people she knows serving in various ratings in the Navy right now. We also both got to talk to a SWO fresh off her first sea tour. Her and the recruiter both told my wife to expect the first two years to be horrible, the next two years after that to still be pretty terrible, then after that, it would get better. We would be more familiar with deployments, and get the chance to have some shore tours.

So, we know it will be tough, but we also know it is for a very great cause and it will be as enjoyable as we let it be.

Thanks again everybody! I guess now if anyone has any advice they want to throw out seeing as my decision is made, that would be greatly appreciated. I have read most threads on here such as OCS gouges, what are good ships to be assigned to for your first ship, etc.
 
Duc'-guy25 said:
Yes, and no. Sea time is credible as a SWO 3 to 1 toward a 3rd Mate/OICNW ticket assuming the vessel is over 1600 GRT. As far as professional development and the required classes, save your money if that's your ambition after SWO life, there are no Navy qualifications that will cross over unless you pursue federal service (I.E Mag Sprink, HCO, LSE, etc etc.) so yea SOL there, but honestly sea time is usually the big issue. I had to explain to the last QMC that I worked with what counted, and what didn't count towards a license. I'm not 100% sure, but some of the BRM classes at NSST might count for that cert. I know NSST can definitely sign you off on assessments for OICNW if you can convince them to help you out.
Click to expand...

Interesting. Personally, I never want to work like the merchant community does. Spending 9 months at sea with only a handful of days in port is not my idea of a good time.
 
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