Arrested after getting accepted to OCS, but before heading out..just read.

[BOMBSonHAWKEYES]

I do not recommend this. It will go no where, be distracting to your true goal and prove to be costly. Merchants have more latitude under the law regarding this sort of "mistake." There are essentially no damages at this point. A claim the store will drop the charge over the threat of a lawsuit is mighty bold considering no one here knows all the facts. That isn't to say innocent or guilty of theft, but whether what the store did was within the bounds of reasonable under tort law. They are permitted to mistakenly accuse people, just not unreasonably so. And there is a fair amount of latitude there.

This is not the Navy where we crush people for speaking up for themselves. In the real world, lawsuits can be levied regardless of how strong they are, and by people in almost any position - including those in jail. If this kid got caught in a chain store, I imagine it was not the company's CEO that was in some back room monitoring the security cameras and calling the cops. This is an isolated incident at the local store's level. Hell, the head manager may not even know it took place. When a lawsuit is levied, you can rest assured that it will reach well beyond the local level, all the way to the headquarters of the business, and I'm certain that they will go back to the local store and tell them to call the local judge and drop this thing. It is just not worth the risk to the company to fight the little guy.

And what's the risk? I'm sure he'd get a deal with a lawyer who would be chompin at the bit to collect potentially huge fees in a settlement.

 

[Spekkio]

And what's the risk?

Retainer costs for a civil attorney who will get laughed out of court.

Prosecution gets wind that OP threatened litigation with a pending criminal suit and uses it against him.

 

[BOMBSonHAWKEYES]

Retainer costs for a civil attorney who will get laughed out of court.

Prosecution gets wind that OP threatened litigation with a pending criminal suit and uses it against him.

Getting laughed at might scare some people. Feelings are real, but there isn't really a risk associated with that given this guy's current position. If this guy is facing a FELONY, then he will never get a commission and likely never get a job better than construction.

when the lawyer he hires goes to the store to ask to see the video evidence, this is going to blow over.

And by the way, these overzealous cops are starting to get a taste of their own medicine these days:

http://www.roanoke.com/news/virgini...cle_a5e91ce8-b508-11e3-ac72-0017a43b2370.html

 

[Spekkio]

The store in question will have a corporate legal team that works for them. That team is contracted. They get paid regardless of whether or not some ambulance chaser threatens to sue for 'lost wages' in a job OP doesn't even hold with a pending criminal trial. The legal team will say that all the store employee did was call security/police when they suspected that theft had occurred consistent with store policy. They will argue, probably successfully, to a judge that the sole purpose of the suit is to retaliate for pending legal action regarding theft. Then they will call the DA and tell him/her that OP threatened legal action in retaliation for a pending criminal suit.

But realistically, you'd probably have to find a pretty desparate civil attorney to even touch the case at this point in the process.

You were suggesting that OP threaten to sue the store, when the story you linked have people suing a police department over a case that was already dropped. A course of action the OP might choose to pursue if the case gets dropped and sufficient evidence exists that the police did not act in accordance with the law. Since no one was roughed-up and OP wasn't dragged into a windowless room by plain-clothed thugs, it's unlikely to be successful. Additionally, it will hold up OP's commissioning accession if he chooses to pursue litigation after the case is dropped.

 

[BOMBSonHAWKEYES]

The store in question will have a corporate legal team that works for them. That team is contracted. They get paid regardless of whether or not some ambulance chaser threatens to sue for 'lost wages' in a job OP doesn't even hold with a pending criminal trial. The legal team will say that all the store employee did was call security/police when they suspected that theft had occurred consistent with store policy. They will argue, probably successfully, to a judge that the sole purpose of the suit is to retaliate for pending legal action regarding theft. Then they will call the DA and tell him/her that OP threatened legal action in retaliation for a pending criminal suit.

But realistically, you'd probably have to find a pretty desparate civil attorney to even touch the case at this point in the process.

You were suggesting that OP threaten to sue the store, when the story you linked have people suing a police department over a case that was already dropped. A course of action the OP might choose to pursue if the case gets dropped and sufficient evidence exists that the police did not act in accordance with the law. Since no one was roughed-up and OP wasn't dragged into a windowless room by plain-clothed thugs, it's unlikely to be successful. Additionally, it will hold up OP's commissioning accession if he chooses to pursue litigation after the case is dropped.

There will be no classic court room proceedings like people see on TV. The legal division of the company could fight this case on the company's behalf, but the risk of bad publicity that comes along with targeting customers won't be worth the potential benefits that would arise from defending the company against a lawsuit. They will settle out of court. The local judge will drop the criminal charges.

By the way, I don't know where the term "threatened with a lawsuit" comes from. It IS a lawsuit if the OP's lawyers file one. There are no shows of force in the courtroom.

 

[wink]

For a lawyer to "threaten" a lawsuit to get what he wants (for his client) is unethical. Saying you will sue means nothing. You either file a claim or not. No matter what the phone book advertising lawyers say, there is no such thing as a lawsuit that "costs you nothing unless we win". All sorts of fees and expenses add up pretty quickly. A corporate legal department will bleed a bottom feeding attorney who takes a case like this.

Don't conflate the suggested civil law suit and the criminal defense. They are hardly related. No one is saying a criminal defense lawyer would be laughed at for taking this case. It is the civil action that is stupid, particularly now and knowing so little. To sue you need damages. Where are the damages now? You can't just sue because you got a raw deal or you had to spend money to defend yourself.

This doesn't seem like a case of over zealous police. They showed up, store security/witnesses say something was stolen, they do their job and make the arrest. They are now out of it. The prosecutor will talk to the store employees, look at any video, and decide how to proceed. If there is a trial it will be the store security folks versus the OP. Police just showed up after the fact to applied the law.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

I hope the OP isn't thinking about any legal action at this point, I hope he would be happy enough to get the issue dropped and then be in the USN. If this whole thing screws him due to the length of time causing him to lose his pro rec then he may want to explore his options AFTER the situation is dropped, I believe some stores have become overzealous to the point of harassing customers and need to be put in their place.

 

[Renegade One]

I hope the OP isn't thinking about any legal action at this point, I hope he would be happy enough to get the issue dropped and then be in the USN. If this whole thing screws him due to the length of time causing him to lose his pro rec then he may want to explore his options AFTER the situation is dropped, I believe some stores have become overzealous to the point of harassing customers and need to be put in their place.

I was going to just "like" this on first reading…but the whole thing about stores needing to be be "put in their place". changed my mind. I guess I like the "first half" that ends with a period. That's solid.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

I was going to just "like" this on first reading…but the whole thing about stores needing to be be "put in their place". changed my mind. I guess I like the "first half" that ends with a period. That's solid.

put in their place was probably a bit too strong, that sounds as if I am against the stores, I am not, maybe I should have said they are getting overzealous and need to be reminded we are supposed to be in a "innocent until proven guilty" society and treat people as such. I have seen people that when given a badge and a flashlight feel they have power over anyone, an example is last week the elderly guy who drives the security pickup truck for the building owners where my office is at attempted to "chase down/pursue" the USPS guy because he "thought" the USPS driver was speeding.

 

[Bradicus]

Since nobody's said it yet, OP needs to delete any posts he's made in relation to this incident in order to protect himself. In fact, the whole thread needs to be deleted since there is a lot of quoted content. Hopefully he has gotten the message of "get a lawyer and talk to your OR" to the point where he doesn't need to refer back here anymore. Good luck, man.

 

[picklesuit]

To the OP:
Sign NOTHING without a lawyer. No statement to the board, no waiver, NOTHING.

That being said, let the justice system run it's course. If you are innocent (which you are, until proven guilty) the evidence will bear that out and charges will be dropped/found not guilty. No plea deal, no "nolo contendre" just innocent or dropped, and you will be fine for OCS. Convicted felony? See ya.

The Navy is the least of your problems at this point.
Pickle

 

[picklesuit]

Since nobody's said it yet, OP needs to delete any posts he's made in relation to this incident in order to protect himself. In fact, the whole thread needs to be deleted since there is a lot of quoted content. Hopefully he has gotten the message of "get a lawyer and talk to your OR" to the point where he doesn't need to refer back here anymore. Good luck, man.

Bradicus,
Future Mod/Sea-lawyer...
Don't hold the thread responsible for his lack of common sense, this is way more interesting than ASTB score discussions.
Pickle

 

[xj220]

The entertainment value alone is worth it. Maybe start a "criminal records of Airwarriors" thread?

 

[Sache]

 

[CAMike]

The entertainment value alone is worth it. Maybe start a "criminal records of Airwarriors" thread?

Possibly "Duke" should start that thread. He'd be the perfect OP. What's his AW name?
ref: R. Cunningham (Not TV Ninja boy)