Not to mention he landed on private property with out permission. Not that that one action would lead to loss of card, but a case COULD be made along with all his other shenanigans.
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Big Deal, happens all the time in AK
- Thread starter usmarinemike
- Start date
Not to mention he landed on private property with out permission. Not that that one action would lead to loss of card, but a case COULD be made along with all his other shenanigans.
And there is also the "catch all" FAR:
Section 91.13: Careless or reckless operation.
(a) Aircraft operations for the purpose of air navigation. No person may operate an aircraft in a careless or reckless manner so as to endanger the life or property of another.
Besides endanering the life of his passenger, unless he owns the aircraft he has endangered the property of another. (Yes it has been used against pilots in this manner before.)
Section 91.13: Careless or reckless operation.
(a) Aircraft operations for the purpose of air navigation. No person may operate an aircraft in a careless or reckless manner so as to endanger the life or property of another.
Besides endanering the life of his passenger, unless he owns the aircraft he has endangered the property of another. (Yes it has been used against pilots in this manner before.)
You, sir, have gone "Full Chopper." :icon_drin
Does that reg not merely state he has to be familiar with the data in the flight manual as it pertains to his flight? He made a "precautionary landing" at an off airport site due to a rough running engine AND a sick passenger. He didn't DECLARE an emergency, but it doesnt mean he didn't have (or suspect he had) one. I think either one of those issues could qualify as an emergency.
The controller said it was a "public beach", did he end up landing on a private beach?
Just because he landed on a beach doesn't mean he endangered himself or anyone else. As for the aircraft, I believe it was in fact a rental so this may be what they can get him for.
I don't doubt that when the FAA wants to make an example of someone they're going to. That pretty much applies for any governmental agency.
The controller said it was a "public beach", did he end up landing on a private beach?
Just because he landed on a beach doesn't mean he endangered himself or anyone else. As for the aircraft, I believe it was in fact a rental so this may be what they can get him for.
I don't doubt that when the FAA wants to make an example of someone they're going to. That pretty much applies for any governmental agency.
You sound like my kid parsing my words to avoid getting into trouble. "You said no video games, I was playing a computer game on my PC. Didn't go near the XBOX." What purpose does it do to be familiar with the requirements of 91.103 if not to be guided by them? I assure you, if you looked at the flight manual and saw you needed 2500 feet for take off and then slapped the book shut claiming you could do better, then tried to launch from a 1200 foot strip, you'd be fried. Same with the declaration of an emergency. You MUST declare an emergency, or controller or airline dispatcher. Some one must declare a emergency to get a pass on following the FARs. An airsick passenger is not an emergency requiring an immediate landing on a beach. Rough running engine my ass. Listen to the way he sounds. Oh yeah, he was sure afraid his motor was going to stop. If it was running rough then he must not have had any intention of taking off that beach. But I bet he tried to talk them into it. There is the real punishment. They will have it disassembled and trucked out. He will have to pay for it all, just for being a smart ass. What does a 60 day suspension cost a recreational flier?
"listen to the way he sounds"? Really? He sounds like a retard on the radio, he MUST be lying! Lol. I don't THINK he had engine trouble either...but, even if they can't duplicate it on the ground it doesn't mean it didn't happen! Reasonable man theory says it was all bs and the kid was just trying to impress his girlfriend. But how he sounds on the radio or failure to declare an emergency isn't proof of that.
As far as the comment regarding 91.103...a precautionary landing is used to get the aircraft on the ground as soon as and as safely as possible before a more serious malfunction occurs. It doesn't mean you have to go out and physically survey every possible landing site before hand! You're assuming he's lying based on his poor comms and letting that detract from the real issue. Based on the info available (a reportedly rough running engine), he did NOTHING wrong (even his bad comms aren't technically illegal). If mx can't duplicate the rough running engine, is that an indication that he's lying? I'd hope youd say no, because I'm sure we've all seen (many of us have written) mafs on our aircraft that mx couldn't duplicate. CND doesnt mean we lied about the issue.
As far as the comment regarding 91.103...a precautionary landing is used to get the aircraft on the ground as soon as and as safely as possible before a more serious malfunction occurs. It doesn't mean you have to go out and physically survey every possible landing site before hand! You're assuming he's lying based on his poor comms and letting that detract from the real issue. Based on the info available (a reportedly rough running engine), he did NOTHING wrong (even his bad comms aren't technically illegal). If mx can't duplicate the rough running engine, is that an indication that he's lying? I'd hope youd say no, because I'm sure we've all seen (many of us have written) mafs on our aircraft that mx couldn't duplicate. CND doesnt mean we lied about the issue.
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
Dude,.......please.
That guy was full of crap.
He wanted to land on the beach, was told "no", and did it anyway.
Any of the crap that came out of his mouth during or after the flight are thinly veiled lies in an attempt to sealawyer some sort of approval or get out of trouble.
Did he violate FARs? I don't know. I'm not a lawyer. Would I ever fly with him, rent him a plane, or give him a job?
Absolutely not.
I hope he does well at Medical School. His chances of making a living as a pilot are slim.
That guy was full of crap.
He wanted to land on the beach, was told "no", and did it anyway.
Any of the crap that came out of his mouth during or after the flight are thinly veiled lies in an attempt to sealawyer some sort of approval or get out of trouble.
Did he violate FARs? I don't know. I'm not a lawyer. Would I ever fly with him, rent him a plane, or give him a job?
Absolutely not.
I hope he does well at Medical School. His chances of making a living as a pilot are slim.
I don't know what the big deal is - he's clearly on track to become one of those doctors that has more money than sense who thinks just because he can afford a plane he should buy one and terrorize the skies (and beaches) with it.
Land someplace where you can't know if you can take off again safely, and were advised against it, you better declare an emergency. You have to say the words, or in some countries, MAYDAY.
Well in my case, I was! I landed on some open pit mine tailings back in college. I had followed another airplane down that I was flying in formation with. As soon as we landed security rolled up and started to bitch at us about trespassing. My flying partner quickly went into a story about how our wingman landed first and since he didn't have a radio, we landed to make sure he was ok. The other guy pick up the fiction, said he had a rough running engine, that we had taken a look at things and figured it must have been carb ice. We explained the whole venturi pressure temperature thing and that the warm air on the deck probably cleared it up, leaving no evidence of a problem. We would run up the engine, then be on our way. What do ya know, it ran smooth and we launched, made a low transition over their jeep and got waves and fist pumps. All B.S. Now we were trespassing. But we knew we had the distances and weight bearing surface to make safe landings and take offs. We wouldn't have been violated by the FAA, just thrown into the county pokie. :icon_wink
Like i said, we're in agreement on this, but the FAA shouldn't violate him for it. When the FAA starts second guessing pilots then a dangerous precedent is set. If he would have killed himself or someone else, then it should be pursued further by the FAA. Otherwise, like Wink said, punish him in a way that doesn't threaten his license (but hurts him where it counts--aircraft transport, mx inspection fees, corrosion treatment, etc). This way the FAA isn't directly involved in the punishment but the kid is still taught a (expensive) lesson. What they have to avoid is giving pilots the impression that if they suffer some mechanical issue and need to do something they're not supposed to iot save themselves, that the FAA isn't going to come prying and ultimately violate them. What they don't want is someone else coming along and upon hearing their engine hiccup decide to fly the three additional miles to the nearest airport and balling it up enroute.