Boys and their pop guns

[Fly Navy]

Don't sweat it A4's... I've probably capped off more 20MM in a few passes than you did in those 12-15 hours. 6000 RPM puts a lot of lead down range!!! We still shoot, just later in the game (when you actually have a gun on board).

Edit... I'm really sick of this topic popping up.

Some of you need to watch this.

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/posting.php

What're you doing shooting HI in A-G mode? Bad! Must be set in LO.

 

[Brett327]

Don't sweat it A4's... I've probably capped off more 20MM in a few passes than you did in those 12-15 hours. 6000 RPM puts a lot of lead down range!!! We still shoot, just later in the game (when you actually have a gun on board).

Edit... I'm really sick of this topic popping up.

Some of you need to watch this.

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/posting.php

Yeah, 6000 RPM sounds cool, but tell us all how many rounds are in your drum?

Brett

 

[HighDimension]

In the Rhino, the WSO controls the weapons, correct? Does this mean that he also controls the guns, or are they controlled by the pilot?

 

[eddie]

In the Rhino, the WSO controls the weapons, correct? Does this mean that he also controls the guns, or are they controlled by the pilot?

Hmm, does the NFO control the gun?

Hmm... :icon_tong

 

[Gatordev]

In the Rhino, the WSO controls the weapons, correct? Does this mean that he also controls the guns, or are they controlled by the pilot?

So this brings on another question that I don't think was completely covered in another thread. IF the WSO does control the pylon weapons (and I'm guessing the task is shared depending on what you're actually shooting/dropping), then who actually has the weapons release authority? Is it the AC? Or do WSOs get a MC qual and they get the authority? Just curious.

 

[Fly Navy]

In the Rhino, the WSO controls the weapons, correct? Does this mean that he also controls the guns, or are they controlled by the pilot?

Depends on the Lot of jet. In the higher lots, the WSO can control all the weapons except the gun. Do they have release authority? Depends on the squadron, SOP, Top Gun, etc.

 

[Gatordev]

Do they have release authority? Depends on the squadron, SOP, Top Gun, etc.

My question was a little more basic. I was asking if they ever get authority, which based of your post, sounds like they do.

 

[Fly Navy]

My question was a little more basic. I was asking if they ever get authority, which based of your post, sounds like they do.

For Air-to-Air it's not a new idea as the RIO could launch at least a Sparrow in the Tomcat. Not sure if other platforms allow for Air-to-Ground release.

 

[Brett327]

So this brings on another question that I don't think was completely covered in another thread. IF the WSO does control the pylon weapons (and I'm guessing the task is shared depending on what you're actually shooting/dropping), then who actually has the weapons release authority? Is it the AC? Or do WSOs get a MC qual and they get the authority? Just curious.

This notion of "release authority" as you've described it, doesn't exist in TACAIR, at least not in my jet. In the Prowler, ECMO 1 has the Master Arm, but the pilot pulls the trigger. Similar setup in the P-3 (master arm up front, but the TACCO could release anything except rockets from the back). I imagine it's similar in the Rhino. In our jet, you generally need action from three different people to get a HARM off the rails, so it's not a matter of being AC or MC. The crew just does what needs to be done IAW the ROE. With jamming, it's all controlled from the backseat. The front gets an annunciator light when Master Rad is on, but that's about it.

Brett

 

[Fly Navy]

This notion of "release authority" as you've described it, doesn't exist in TACAIR, at least not in my jet. In the Prowler, ECMO 1 has the Master Arm, but the pilot pulls the trigger. Similar setup in the P-3 (master arm up front, but the TACCO could release anything except rockets from the back). I imagine it's similar in the Rhino. In our jet, you generally need action from three different people to get a HARM off the rails, so it's not a matter of being AC or MC. The crew just does what needs to be done. With jamming, it's all controlled from the backseat. The front gets an annunciator light when Master Rad is on, but that's about it.

Brett

Yeah, Master Arm is in the front seat of the Rhino.

 

[Lawman]

Where's TB55 when you actually want him around?

He's at home.... Washing his tights. :icon_wink

 

[Gatordev]

For Air-to-Air it's not a new idea as the RIO could launch at least a Sparrow in the Tomcat. Not sure if other platforms allow for Air-to-Ground release.

Yeah, I undertand that part, but I wasn't asking about who can launch the weapon, I was asking about who says you can launch the weapon. I think Brett's post kind of covers this. I understand it's a different dynamic w/ an NFO and a NA, so it may not apply.

I guess what I was getting at was if a senior WSO (let's say) is flying w/ a junior AC, who says that's it's okay for the widget to leave the rail. I'm thinking more along the lines of CAS, where someone has to be careful of where the weapon specifically goes, unlike, say, a HARM, which is either going to make it or isn't to it's target that everyone already knows is a bad guy.

Again, I understand it's apples and oranges, but in our little world, two seasoned HACs can be flying, and the non-AC could have his finger on the button but it's the AC's call (and to an extent, his ass) on whether it actually goes downrange.

 

[Fly Navy]

Yeah, I undertand that part, but I wasn't asking about who can launch the weapon, I was asking about who says you can launch the weapon. I think Brett's post kind of covers this. I understand it's a different dynamic w/ an NFO and a NA, so it may not apply.

I guess what I was getting at was if a senior WSO (let's say) is flying w/ a junior AC, who says that's it's okay for the widget to leave the rail. I'm thinking more along the lines of CAS, where someone has to be careful of where the weapon specifically goes, unlike, say, a HARM, which is either going to make it or isn't to it's target that everyone already knows is a bad guy.

Again, I understand it's apples and oranges, but in our little world, two seasoned HACs can be flying, and the non-AC could have his finger on the button but it's the AC's call (and to an extent, his ass) on whether it actually goes downrange.

I wasn't specifically addressing you with that post.

As for your question, I don't know, I'm only trained as an E guy at this point (E/F selection comes near the end of the RAG).

 

[HAL Pilot]

Similar setup in the P-3 (master arm up front, but the TACCO could release anything except rockets from the back).

It takes both. The pilot can turn on the Master Arm and hit his release all day long but nothing is going unless the Tacco selects a weapons station. Similarily, the Tacco can select a station and hit his release all day long but nothing is going unless the pilot turns on Master Arm.

 

[Brett327]

I guess what I was getting at was if a senior WSO (let's say) is flying w/ a junior AC, who says that's it's okay for the widget to leave the rail. I'm thinking more along the lines of CAS, where someone has to be careful of where the weapon specifically goes, unlike, say, a HARM, which is either going to make it or isn't to it's target that everyone already knows is a bad guy.

In your scenario, it's the MC, bottom line. As for your HARM vs. bombs issue - that's a huge misconception. Not a ding on you, but just putting it out there. HARM goes guiding on all kinds of things it's not supposed to, so deconfliction and planning is a huge part of employing that weapon. It's probably responsible for a lot more collateral damage percentage wise than JDAM or LGBs. As a result, HARM employment ROE are usually very restrictive and the generals get very nervous when we're using them.

Brett