Put the words "fighter pilot" on a resume and the doors fall off the hinges as you walk up to them. kidding
Along with panties? haha jk
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Career after the Marines
- Thread starter Lord Doog
- Start date
Along with panties? haha jk
phrogpilot73
Well-Known Member
Acutally, since we're talking about fighter pilots it would be boxers, jock straps, etc... that drop.
Panties and thongs are reserved for helo bubbas...
StompinNightmare
New Member
As far as competing with people just out of college...
I tried applying for engineering jobs while doing the paperwork for a Navy OCS spot (classing up in just over a month). Most places (especially in this economy), want people with at least a few years of work experience or a Masters degree. Companies like prior experience rather than just a B.S. degree, so who are they going to pick: the guy just out of college still wearing his motorboard and tassel, or the Marine officer and aviator with 8 years of experience (on top of a degree, but that's inherent with being an officer)?
I tried applying for engineering jobs while doing the paperwork for a Navy OCS spot (classing up in just over a month). Most places (especially in this economy), want people with at least a few years of work experience or a Masters degree. Companies like prior experience rather than just a B.S. degree, so who are they going to pick: the guy just out of college still wearing his motorboard and tassel, or the Marine officer and aviator with 8 years of experience (on top of a degree, but that's inherent with being an officer)?
And light bulbs.
Lord Doog
New Member
just playing devil's advocate, but one could also argue that being a Marine aviator with 8 years flying experience doesn't equal 8 years of engineering experience. Therefore the guy out of college would be competitive with the Marine, since they both have almost 0 engineering experience
Fine, 8 years of work experience, leadership experience, being an Officer of Marines, etc... your degree and bullshit college internship doesn't fucking compare.
Employers MUCH perfer someone with a track record - it is extremely difficult to judge from an interview and a resume if someone will come to work on time, be trustworthy, work well with others. That's not nearly as much of a question mark with former military. So unless there is something exceptional about the recent grad relative to the officer (i.e. fluency in a particular foreign language, or experience with the software languages being used, so that less training is required), the officer will have a significant head start in the hiring process. A recent graduate might be willing to accept a lower salary, though, which is certainly a factor.
I don't know how someone could even want to go into design or hardcore engineering after spending 8+ years as an aviator anyways. There are far bigger things you can do with engineering than design or qa/qc and 8 years of military leadership and being responsible for a multi-million dollar aircraft can only help.
If you want an engineering job that badly, then go be a damn engineer. No one in their right mind is going to look at you and say "Well, you're not qualified 'cause you wasted all this time leading Marines into combat and saving lives." If they do, then you'd be a damn fool to work for them in the first place.
Even if they are closely related, you're still giving up one career for another. My OR had a kid get laid off from his engineering job who put in app for NFO and got selected. The engineering company called back and, after 6 months of being unemployed, the kid gives up his NFO slot to go back for less money. You know what my recruiter said, and I qoute, "what a fucking idiot." Moral of the story: Do what you want, but be prepared to deal with the bullshit like getting laid off and being an expendable junior engineer who sits in a cubicle. No one should have to convince you to go into the Navy/Marine Corps. You should want it bad enough to convince them.
No.
Aside from the normal bravado I don't have to repeat...
Officer = Job with responsibilities, many of them include lives.
Experienced Engineer = Job with responsibilities, they range from the smallest, most meaningless nut or bolt to the most important component that the company sells/services/etc. Comfort with SW/Pro-E/AutoCad, IQMS (inventory system), working with other engineers, understanding the process for ECO's, quality control paperwork.
What you truly "earn" for yourself during those 8 years as an engineer is the above. That is what largely makes you valuable to companies looking specifically look for "engineering" experience, like Boeing, Lockheed, Northrop, but they are rare in that if you tried to find engineering work at any common company with years of "experience" under your belt you'd probably be equivalent to a Marine Officer that finished his duty with an undergrad engineering degree and a stellar record.
Honestly, the engineering world much prefers masters degrees and doctorates to experience. That would be the direction I'd go, if I were interested in that sort of thing.
phrogpilot73
Well-Known Member
You're right. 8 years of engineering experience =/= 8 years of experience as a Marine Officer (there's MUCH more to it than just flying). However, 8 years of experience as a Marine Officer =/= a dude just out of college.
I worked with people that were just out of college, and they were Engineer 1 & 2's. The guys that had 5-ish years of engineering experience? They were Engineer 3's. I was hired as an Engineer 4. The guy that had been working for the same company for 10 years, as an engineer - he was an Engineer 5. So that kinda blows your theory out of the water.
Why do they value it? You may not be the best engineer out there - but you've got a demonstrated ability to lead, learn quickly & under pressure, respect for rules & authority, and do more with less. Not to mention, if you go to work for a company that does engineering involved with your background (i.e. Aviation - think Boeing, Sikorsky and the like), they want to hire you because you've been an operator - and therefore can identify potential issues BEFORE they become issues. Oh, and you have an active security clearance - so they don't have to pay for an initial investigation...
And what happens if you enjoy being a Marine, leading Marines, flying, and all that jazz? You retire as a LtCol with a lifetime retirement/medical - and go VFR direct to a senior executive position... While some of your peers may have managed to make it up to department manager and now work for you.
EDIT - Just went to my old company's homepage... Let's see what's out there, shall we?
Avionics Systems Engineer - SE3-1303
Location: Lexington Park, MD
Employment Type: Full Time
Security Clearance: Secret
Required Experience: 5 Years
Required Education Level: Bachelor's Degree
Concentration: Electrical Engineering
Desired Skills:
Advanced degree in Electrical or Systems Engineering, Avionics or Aeronautics
Experience with military aircraft operations.
Pilot/NFO experience a plus.
Electrical Engineer - SE4-924
Location: Fort Belvoir, VA
Employment Type: Full Time
Security Clearance: Secret
Required Experience: 7 Years
Required Education Level: Bachelor's Degree
Concentration: Electrical Engineering
Desired Skills:
Experience with night vision, infrared and optical sensors.
Experience with Army aviation (manned and unmanned) programs.
Masters Degree.
Unmanned Air Vehicle Systems Engineer - SE4-1233
Location: Lexington Park, MD
Employment Type: Full Time
Security Clearance: Secret
Required Experience: 8 Years
Required Education Level: Bachelor's Degree
Concentration: Engineering or science
Desired Skills:
Engineering, logistics management, business development, and financial management experience.
Experience in military aviation.
Experience in Military Test and Evaluation procedures and practices.
Experience in Defense Acquisition and Logistics.
Masters Degree.
Where do you think you're going to get all the experience they list in "Desired Skills"....
Thanks for the information. I hadn't seen all that.