I don't take offense, and I think that if OP phrased his question something like "I'm at 19.5 min for the 3 mi run and want to get an extra 1.5 min out, what do I do" then you'd have some sound advice for him. It's just that what you are writing is not geared for a beginner.
ok. well, i'm glad you didn't take offense, because no offense was intended
i think i would almost agree with your last comment.
i'm going to change what i said before though. you are right about one thing- as a runner you tend to forget some of the earlier challenges of running, so i did overlook one phase. i think you are right only about one phase of learning how to run long distance- the aerobic limited phase.
what i mean is that if you are getting out of breath as you run 3.0mi and you can't run any faster because of aerobic issues, then i think you are completely right. basic steps are needed just to get you to run at your peak, because you are being limited by aerobic capacity. i'm sure you know what i'm talking about and have seen these types of people. they huff and puff and move at a slow jog and look like any second they could have a heart attack. it's not that they can't run any faster, but that if they push themselves to go any faster, they might just collapse. but if they were asked to run as fast as they can over a shorter 50 yard distance, they could probably move their legs a bit faster. such people need to just do more cardio and aerobic training and maybe not so much pure running until they can run the 3mi without getting out of breath. ok, i've not given any good advice how to get to that point, but i don't really know what to say about this (maybe stew smith has more advice on how to get to the point where you aren't all out of breath during your run)
but if you are breathing well over your 3.0mi run and you feel like the problem is just that you simply can't move your legs any faster and they feel a little like lead, well then that's where i think it is important to build your base, do interval training, fartleks, hill running, and other stuff like this. and this is really the domain that a real running coach (and training plans from real running coaches) shines. because real running coaches are focusing on getting people to move their legs a little bit faster then they could before.
so as you mentioned, if you are going from 19:30 to 18:00, the problem is probably not that you are having aerobic problems, the problems are probably more anaerobic (like lactic acid build up and other stuff) and then definitely that 19:30 runner could use a "real" training plan to get him to lose the last 1:30 mins.
The PRT/PFT is not just a timed event, but it's a standardized time event. In other words, the candidate knows going in what time he needs to beat to earn a certain score. In a race, you have to beat the other people competing, who could run any number of variable times.
well, i personally think that this is a difference without a difference, if you know what i mean. some of the best runners in the world don't "race against others", they "race against themselves". they will set new PR's even if their competitors all snooze.
as i already agreed before, the best times (those
above 18:00 on the 3mi) are not interesting from a marine corps perspective- so that just means to me that someone who really wanted to perform his
military best and strive for the perfect prt will never need more than an "intermediate" level long distance running training plan. but the links i provided before are all in this class of training plans.
(advanced plans are customized for the individual runner and his or her physiology)
The act of actually running in the Marines is no different than any other running, I'll give you that, except for the fact that the candidates might be singing at the top of their lungs. But where is a person in the application process who is working a full-time job going to fit strength training into a workout regimen consisting of running 50 mi a week? If you are going to focus solely on the run, then you are going to run into a problem come OCS when you have to do pullups and situps. If you do a search on this site, you'll see a lot of threads started by people with that very problem.
this is a problem that high school and college cross-country runners deal with all the time. it's not called a
4:00am run for nothing! :censored_ :sleep_125 we have to run before school or late at night after homework, so of these two, morning is better.
but personally, this may be the reason i will drop cross-country running myself. i did say in a previous msg that 50mi/wk is a lot- it takes up a lot of time. as i've also mentioned to another frequent poster here in a PM, i am seriously considering whether or not i want to do varsity cross-country in college. 20:45 is my PR. my typical times have been lower. i'd really need to beat myself into shape in order to make the varsity team at the Virginia Military Institute and i just don't know if i shouldn't just focus on my studies instead. hard decision because i really love running, but it might just be too much to do. so life is full of trade offs i guess.
Again, to be clear, I do not agree with the advice you are giving members on this board about running, particularly those who have not run competitively in the past few years. This has nothing to do with your ability as a runner or what your coach has told you. You are a competitive runner, so your coach is giving you advice for someone who is already in top shape. The OP is not a competitive runner. It is unrealistic for someone who does not run cross-country to work up to 50 mi a week in a reasonable amount of time, nor does one have to work up to 50 mi a week to get a good score on the PFT (I define "good" as ~21 min or less). Telling someone that is harmful because one of two things results: 1. demotivation or 2. overtraining.
Does the OP need to run an 18 min 3 mi. run to get accepted into Marine OCS? (that wasn't rhetorical). If not, then it is unreasonable for him to set that goal as someone who does not run regularly. If he was already in the 20 min range and wanted to max out to maximize his chances of selection, that's a different story.
If it is, then the OP is probably looking at a good year or two of gearing up for maxing out the PFT. This is going to have to involve interval training, and not just working up to some insane amount of mileage per week. Yes, one should strive to do the best they can do, but it's also important to be realistic about your timeline and goals.
you are underestimating what a beginner can do. imagine a 13-14yo 9th grader talking to the high school cross country coach who is presenting at his or her middle school. this 9th grader decides they want to do cross country as a freshman. you know what that cross country coach gives that 9th grade beginner? a
summer running plan that has a minimum of 20-25 miles per week in it! yes, this isn't 35-50mi/week
(which by the way is more for college cross country runners, highschoolers target 30-45mi/week because running too much is thought to maybe stunt your growth), but it is probably more than what i assume you are thinking.
if a 13-14yo can do 25 mi/week in the summer before 9th grade, i think a big strong 25yo can do at least 30-35mi/week. just my feeling.
EDIT: one last comment on this- i also think that it is perfectly realistic in half a year to be able to reach 18:00 for a guy and 21:00 for a girl, and in high school cross country, i've seen freshman runners do it. sure, being naturally gifted helps, but so also good training! that is why i keep pointing at the plans from the real running coaches! because good coaches can easily tease even 3-4 mins out of a 5km run out a cross-country runner in a single season (cross country season is fall-only)! sure, you aren't going to get to 18:00 in 6mo if you are now running only 28:00. but if you are a girl with a PR of 23:30, do i think a good training plan could get you to a PR of 21:00 and a 100pts on the pft in just 6 months? yes! absolutely!
