• Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?

    Go here:

    Edit Account Details and Profile

COVID-19

BigRed389

Registered User
None
The Japanese internments were not considered by the courts until after the war and after the fact. Many of the U.S. governments actions during WW2 were just accepted during the war but were found to be unconstitutional after was when finally reviewed by the courts.

The constitution says the U.S. Congress controls interstate commerce and the states cannot interfere with it. By imposing restrictions such as quarantines and limits, the states are interfering with interstate commerce. To date, the few cases filed against these types of actions have been squashed by state courts and lower level federal courts without higher court reviews. They have mostly only been filed at local levels without big corporations or organizations participating mostly because they are afraid of the cancel culture backlash by government panicked consumers resulting in boycotts of their products. When life is back to normal for a few years and things have calmed down, I believe there will be lawsuits seeking injunctions against these ever happening again and even seeking damages for lost business. It will eventually end up at the Supreme Court and I am positive it will all be ruled unconstitutional.

My argument is that things like quarantines, lockdowns and restrictions on businesses (especially those operating interstate) were unconstitutional and therefore illegal. But that will be conveniently ignored by the federal, state and local governments until long after they are done. They should never have happened or been allowed.

None of this was legal, proper or should have been allowed to happen no matter the magnitude of the crisis unless the U.S. Congress passed a law putting the restrictions and quarantines in place. (Just to be clear, I'm talking blank quarantines, not quadrating sick people on an individual basis).

I'm also a believer in less government control and regulation of our lives. It is an individuals choice and responsibility to the level of risk they are willing to accept, and the consequences of their actions should only lay on themselves.

I’m not an expert on this topic by any means but that reads to me as a challenge to the internments, going from 1942-1944, upheld by the Supreme Court, 6-3. Which would also have it taking place well after the 442nd RCT had been engaged against the Nazis in the ETO.

Again, I don’t disagree exactly that it’s Congress role in that as regulating interstate commerce. That’s fine by me. My take on COVID has always been as a dress rehearsal for something that will actually be truly disastrous to society, kill way more people, kids, young and healthy workers, etc.

If your AAR out of this is that the process followed was not correct and that the proper way to do things is for Congress to do that for “the next one” then I’m all for it. If anything, I think doing the initial restrictions at a Federal level coordinating across all states, and controlling the international borders was necessary to make a lockdown attempt as short as possible and effective. It was bizarre that wealthy people in NYC at the height of the pandemic could just go to their vacation homes when the city was trying to go into lockdown.

I do in principle agree with individual rights for self determination but I disagree with it when I have to rely on the medical risk assessment ability of other individuals with preventing the spread of say, an airborne version of Ebola, instead of COVID. So...yeah, COVID doesn’t cross that personal line for me, but super Ebola would.
 

HAL Pilot

Well-Known Member
None
Contributor
You're right, it was never held to be unconstitutional. I was thinking of when the Obama administration Justice Department asked the Supreme Court to go back and invalidate that opinion.

But the Congressional committee in the 1980s said it was illegal and wrong, and that circumstances should not allow illegal actions no matter what the perceived public good. And President Reagan got the internees still alive cash reparations. Not a lot but significant. (Way different than the so called slavery reparations the libs are seeking today. Only actual surviving internees got the money, not their descendants.)
 

taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot
It is an individuals choice and responsibility to the level of risk they are willing to accept, and the consequences of their actions should only lay on themselves.
Therein lies the rub with this pandemic. The people keeping it alive in the community weren’t the people being killed by it.

If the people transmitting it were also the people dying from it, this whole thing would have played out differently.
 

taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot

Interesting read on the disappearance of flu during the time of covid.
From the article...

It is clear that attributing the current disappearance of multiple influenza and coronavirus types to NPIs is not logical

That makes no sense.

The R0 number of the standard Flu is less than the R0 of the COVID. NPIs influence that number, driving both of them down. We've kept COVID at or near an R0 of 1 with NPIs, it would make zero sense for the Flu's R0 to not be less than 1, and therefore continually suppressed.
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
From the article...

It is clear that attributing the current disappearance of multiple influenza and coronavirus types to NPIs is not logical

That makes no sense.

The R0 number of the standard Flu is less than the R0 of the COVID. NPIs influence that number, driving both of them down. We've kept COVID at or near an R0 of 1 with NPIs, it would make zero sense for the Flu's R0 to not be less than 1, and therefore continually suppressed.
Yet flu is gone is places where no measures were taken. Did you read it?
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
Speaking of NPI’s, here’s a fun trip down memory lane. “Scientific” American praising New Mexico’s draconian lockdowns last Sept


How’d that work out for them?

14th highest deaths per capita among states.
47th in unemployment
47th for in person schools
 

HAL Pilot

Well-Known Member
None
Contributor
Therein lies the rub with this pandemic. The people keeping it alive in the community weren’t the people being killed by it.

If the people transmitting it were also the people dying from it, this whole thing would have played out differently.
Bull shit statement.

If those at risk had isolated themselves then they would not have caught it.

Those that choose to not isolate, their knowingly took the risk.
 

taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot
Bull shit statement.

If those at risk had isolated themselves then they would not have caught it.

Those that choose to not isolate, their knowingly took the risk.
Really? Nursing Home folks out partying hard? Immuno-compromised patients catching it at the hospital or just getting groceries? Over 2,900 doctors and nurses have died from it too.
Yet flu is gone is places where no measures were taken. Did you read it?
I did. It'd be cool if one virus interferes with another. Maybe you could block the deadly virus by flooding the zone with a low end flu. But he ignores the difference in transmissibility completely. This statement is wrong.

If the wearing of masks was capable of almost entirely removing influenza from circulation, as has been observed, then this approach would also eliminate SARS-CoV-2.
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
Really? Nursing Home folks out partying hard? Immuno-compromised patients catching it at the hospital or just getting groceries? Over 2,900 doctors and nurses have died from it too.

I did. It'd be cool if one virus interferes with another. Maybe you could block the deadly virus by flooding the zone with a low end flu. But he ignores the difference in transmissibility completely. This statement is wrong.

If the wearing of masks was capable of almost entirely removing influenza from circulation, as has been observed, then this approach would also eliminate SARS-CoV-2.
Well since study after study found no benefit offered by masking for flu, I guess it’s kind of moot. But I’m sure they magically work for covid. And the flu when intended for covid. Good job as usual
 

taxi1

Well-Known Member
pilot
Well since study after study found no benefit offered by masking for flu...
Here's a meta-study (a study that cites study after study) that of course says you're wrong.

Good job as usual

 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
Here's a meta-study (a study that cites study after study) that of course says you're wrong.

Good job as usual

A handful of Chinese studies from before May of last year.

Here’s one a little more recent.

1.8% in masks got infected. 2.1% without got infected. Shocking stuff, I tell you. That’s not a significant finding but I admit if I was faced with a virus that was actually a threat I’d probably jump on the bandwagon of “hey it can’t hurt” and wear a mask. That’s not the case with scaryvirus though.
 
Top