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Europe under extreme duress

nittany03

Recovering NFO. Herder of Programmers.
pilot
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
There is a software architect at my company who, when he's in a meeting, everyone makes a concerted effort to start on time and get down to business. Because if you're screwing around waiting for people to join, he's liable to fill the dead time with an absolute torrent of horrible dad jokes.
 

Llarry

Well-Known Member
I have no idea whether Ukraine will prevail in the quest for Western combat aircraft, but if they do, we should throw in a bonus few dozen A-10s. Yes, IADS but the slugfest seems to be armor-centric and what's better for armor that an A-10...
 

Mirage

Well-Known Member
pilot
I have no idea whether Ukraine will prevail in the quest for Western combat aircraft, but if they do, we should throw in a bonus few dozen A-10s. Yes, IADS but the slugfest seems to be armor-centric and what's better for armor that an A-10...
Yeah, we need to do something more than M1A1s and AT missiles to stop the mighty T-55 from sweeping across Europe. Maybe some Apaches, too, with pilots to fly them. Or we could go all in and give Ukraine some nukes. Whatever it takes to stop the terrifying Russkies from conquering the western world!
 

sevenhelmet

Low calorie attack from the Heartland
pilot
Yeah, we need to do something more than M1A1s and AT missiles to stop the mighty T-55 from sweeping across Europe. Maybe some Apaches, too, with pilots to fly them. Or we could go all in and give Ukraine some nukes. Whatever it takes to stop the terrifying Russkies from conquering the western world!
Jesus Christ. Is this level of overstatement really necessary?

Oddly enough (given the source), this is one of the more reasoned arguments I’ve seen that takes your side of the issue- not by not accusing the other side of fearmongering, but by pointing out the challenges to a path toward durable peace in the region:

 
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Randy Daytona

Cold War Relic
pilot
Super Moderator
Jesus Christ. Is this level of overstatement really necessary?

Oddly enough (given the source), this is one of the more reasoned arguments I’ve seen that takes your side of the issue- not by not accusing the other side of fearmongering, but by pointing out the challenges to a path toward durable peace in the region:

That was a good article in The Atlantic. Today, the NYT has a similar article whereby it calls DeSantis, like Trump, a Jacksonian - to use the term favored by Walter Russell Mead. Although misconstrued by some as isolationist, a better description is here:

“I think he’s kind of dead-center where Republican voters are, which is to say that he’s neither an isolationist nor a neoconservative, he’s just a Jacksonian,” said David Reaboi, a conservative national security strategist whom Mr. DeSantis has hosted at the governor’s mansion.

Mr. Reaboi was referring to a 1999 essay by the academic Walter Russell Mead, “The Jacksonian Tradition and American Foreign Policy,” which is still in heavy circulation on the intellectual right. It defines a Jacksonian as having a narrow conception of the U.S. national interest: protection of its territory, its people, its hard assets and its commercial interests overseas.

 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
That was a good article in The Atlantic. Today, the NYT has a similar article whereby it calls DeSantis, like Trump, a Jacksonian - to use the term favored by Walter Russell Mead. Although misconstrued by some as isolationist, a better description is here:

“I think he’s kind of dead-center where Republican voters are, which is to say that he’s neither an isolationist nor a neoconservative, he’s just a Jacksonian,” said David Reaboi, a conservative national security strategist whom Mr. DeSantis has hosted at the governor’s mansion.

Frankly I wouldn't read too much into the Governor's foreign policy ideas yet, it seems he is trying to figure out where to plant his foreign policy 'flags'. That doesn't sell papers though....
 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Yeah, we need to do something more than M1A1s and AT missiles to stop the mighty T-55 from sweeping across Europe. Maybe some Apaches, too, with pilots to fly them. Or we could go all in and give Ukraine some nukes. Whatever it takes to stop the terrifying Russkies from conquering the western world!

Russia remains one of two existential threats to this country, let's not forget that. In addition Russia remains one of a small handful of countries that can actually strike CONUS with little to no notice, even with their ineptitude in Ukraine they still have considerable strategic and other capabilities.
 

sevenhelmet

Low calorie attack from the Heartland
pilot
Frankly I wouldn't read too much into the Governor's foreign policy ideas yet, it seems he is trying to figure out where to plant his foreign policy 'flags'. That doesn't sell papers though....
Agreed. I also found the points about potential resolutions to the Russian invasion of Ukraine to be more salient to this discussion than comments by whatever aspiring politician du jour.

If DeSantis winds up on the ballot for national office, that would obviously become more of a consideration.
 

Mirage

Well-Known Member
pilot
Russia remains one of two existential threats to this country, let's not forget that. In addition Russia remains one of a small handful of countries that can actually strike CONUS with little to no notice, even with their ineptitude in Ukraine they still have considerable strategic and other capabilities.
Yes, Russia is a threat... If they use nukes. Not sure supplying A10s and the like decreases our security in that regard, though.
 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Yes, Russia is a threat... If they use nukes. Not sure supplying A10s and the like decreases our security in that regard, though.

They still have formidable conventional capabilities as well, to include a variety of conventionally-armed missiles and platforms to launch them from long-range bombers to submarines (their newer ones are among the world's best). Even without going nuke they could still hit us whenever they wanted.
 
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