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Europe under extreme duress

nittany03

Recovering NFO. Herder of Programmers.
pilot
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Super Moderator
Contributor
Exactly. I spent years knowing these systems as an SA-whatever. Now, the media reports on incidents with terms that are Greek to me, like when the Russians downed a civilian airliner with a Buk missile? Or they took down something with an Igla-2...

It definitely gets Wikipedia more views from me.
SA-11/17 is a Buk . . . SA-6 is a Kub. GAAAH! Feck! Stahp! One is the other backwards; WTF is this shit?
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
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Super Moderator
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Keep that IADS rollback rolling!

Also, why the hell do the media and internet insist on using the ridiculous confusing Russian designations when there’s a much more logical NATO system available? Can you not just call something an SA-XX instead of insisting it’s the 9Zh69WTFBBQ?
Because that’s not what Ukraine or Russia, or the rest of the western non-military world call them. Using NATO designations would make the least sense to the most people.
 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
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Super Moderator
Contributor
Also, why the hell do the media and internet insist on using the ridiculous confusing Russian designations when there’s a much more logical NATO system available? Can you not just call something an SA-XX instead of insisting it’s the 9Zh69WTFBBQ?

Exactly. I spent years knowing these systems as an SA-whatever. Now, the media reports on incidents with terms that are Greek to me, like when the Russians downed a civilian airliner with a Buk missile? Or they took down something with an Igla-2...

Because that’s not what Ukraine or Russia, or the rest of the western non-military world call them. Using NATO designations would make the least sense to the most people.

Y'all have no idea. There are so many missiles out there nowadays even the US military uses a mismash of 'NATO', native and other designations for them.
 

JTS11

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
I know words like ways, means, and ends.

I want my missiles classified somewhere between SA-1 and SA-24.

You can't convince me otherwise. ?
 
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JTS11

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
I agree but I couldn't find the good pics from more credible sources after a quick search, figured the pics speak for themselves.
This is reportedly a pic of the Rostov-on-Don sub the was hit in dry dock.

I know little about subs, but my assumption is that this damage is not reparable, despite the Russian MoD claiming it is?

 
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Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
This is reportedly a pic of the Rostov-on-Don sub the was hit in dry dock.

I know little about subs, but my assumption is that this damage is not reparable, despite the Russian MoD claiming it is?


Maybe? Depends on how much they want to spend and if they are motivated to do so.

The Samuel B. Roberts' keel was broken when she hit an Iranian mine in '88 and they had to replace the whole engineering section of the ship at a cost of $89.5 million ($221.6 million in today's cost). The cost to repair the Stark after she was hit by Exocet/s? Apparently ~$142 million ($368.5 today). According to what I could find, the Perry's cost ~$122 million new. But there was definitely some extra motivation to ensure that they were fixed, along with the Cole, to show that the enemy couldn't permanently knock our warships out of action.

Whether Russia has the capability, money and motivation to repair her is a good question though.
 

JTS11

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
Maybe? Depends on how much they want to spend and if they are motivated to do so.

The Samuel B. Roberts' keel was broken when she hit an Iranian mine in '88 and they had to replace the whole engineering section of the ship at a cost of $89.5 million ($221.6 million in today's cost). The cost to repair the Stark after she was hit by Exocet/s? Apparently ~$142 million ($368.5 today). According to what I could find, the Perry's cost ~$122 million new. But there was definitely some extra motivation to ensure that they were fixed, along with the Cole, to show that the enemy couldn't permanently knock our warships out of action.

Whether Russia has the capability, money and motivation to repair her is a good question though.
Would the damage to the hull of a submarine be different to that of a surface ship? Bc the hull of a submarine is constructed to withstand higher pressures. I dunno, just one thing I heard brought up, but again I know nothing of this shit.

The economic argument applies regardless though. My opinion is they'd be hard up to patch it up, if they could.
 

JTS11

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
Things are heating up between Azerbaijan and Armenia again. Azerbaijan has wanted Nagorno-Karabakh back since they lost it 30 years ago, they might finally achieve that goal if the Russian 'peacekeepers' don't stop them.
Interesting...Even though this isn't within their borders, I think it's a harbinger for other ethnic oblasts of the Russian Federation.

Rumors of Chechen warlord Kadyrov being gravely ill or dead, which could cause upheaval.

I don't think RUS willl be able to sustain sending non-ethnic "Russians" into the meat grinder in UKR.
 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Would the damage to the hull of a submarine be different to that of a surface ship? Bc the hull of a submarine is constructed to withstand higher pressures. I dunno, just one thing I heard brought up, but again I know nothing of this shit.

The economic argument applies regardless though. My opinion is they'd be hard up to patch it up, if they could.

Not an engineer but I presume so. It may be a case where they 'repair' her but she isn't useable as an operational asset, just a showpiece. Or they bring out a 'new' Kilo and...'voila!', the Rostov-on-Don! "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!" has long been the standard in Russia/USSR/Russia.
 
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