Flight Pay for IFS?

[RHPF]

A warrant officer told me he asked the Lt. in charge of IFS (No AD names on AW of course), why we do not receive flight pay for IFS since it is required (by the Navy) flying, while under flying status orders. He was told he would get an answer, but at the time I had talked to him (couple weeks after) he had not yet received any word. Which got me wondering when they kept repeating at IFS that it was "high risk training" involving flying (their words; but sure sounded like the definition of what flying HDIP was for to me).

I looked up the IFS regulation (3501.1B), and the the DOD 7000.14R CH 22 (Aerial Flights: 2201 - HDIP) and it does in fact seem to me that we should get it. Seeing as I can't be the first person to have referenced those, does anyone know why we do not receive HDIP? Of course it is not a ton of money, but it would offset some of the gas costs incurred while in IFS.

 

[Schnugg]

HDIP...YGTBSM!!!!

No.
This:

Does not equate to this:

 

[MIDNJAC]

Your orders say that you are in flight status in a duty not involving flying. So even if they wanted to, I believe the administrative hands are tied. I'd worry more about trying to get some gas $$ from uncle than flight pay.

A warrant officer told me he asked the Lt. in charge of IFS (No AD names on AW of course), why we do not receive flight pay for IFS since it is required (by the Navy) flying, while under flying status orders. He was told he would get an answer, but at the time I had talked to him (couple weeks after) he had not yet received any word. Which got me wondering when they kept repeating at IFS that it was "high risk training" involving flying (their words; but sure sounded like the definition of what flying HDIP was for to me).

I looked up the IFS regulation (3501.1B), and the the DOD 7000.14R CH 22 (Aerial Flights: 2201 - HDIP) and it does in fact seem to me that we should get it. Seeing as I can't be the first person to have referenced those, does anyone know why we do not receive HDIP? Of course it is not a ton of money, but it would offset some of the gas costs incurred while in IFS.

 

[RHPF]

I figured I'd get flamed to all hell. As I intentionally put in quotes on the "high risk" part, that is their words not mine. Do I think we deserve hazardous duty pay for flying a Cessna around? No. Although, if the regs warrant it, and it helps alleviate some of the guys living on a tight budget than it is worth looking into. Huge difference. Especially, since it effectively works out to be 5 months of flying pay just for the time spent in IFS (2 calendar months in IFS, 3 months in the 'grace period' which the 25 hours in IFS more than satisfies the requirements for that).

BTW my orders (and I imagine all the non-married SNA's do as well) say:
"For Temporary Duty Under Instruction in a flying ACC: 341
Status Involving Flying BSC: 99990"

 

[ArkhamAsylum]

I think the actual clause in the orders that gives you flight pay is "You are to report to Commanding Officer, {insert unit name here}, for DUTY INVOLVING FLIGHT OPERATIONS." The admin guys are like robots. If they see that phrase (or whatever the local variation of it is), they mark you down for flight pay. If they don't see it, they don't mark you down. There's very little gray area.

 

[UMichfly]

While the orders DO say the bit about "...duty involving flying", there is a section near the end of your orders that says something to the effect of "PERSSUPPDET ADVISED: Please Disregard member's flight status printed above. Member is in a flying status "not involving flying". I think it's BUPERS way of getting Ensigns all excited about being "in a flight status" and then saying "just kidding, suck it Enswine".

 

[Gatordev]

The irony is that any kind of civilian flying is considered "high risk" and warrants the paper-trail of ORM.

It sounds to me that, technically, you make a valid argument. If the ACC warrants it then it's legit (again, technically). That said, I wouldn't count on it being a reality. I think UMichfly has hit the nail on the head.

 

[VIZKRIEG]

I gotta tell you Sir, Heyjoe pictures aside, this is one of the most awesome pics I have seen in a long time.

 

[HeyJoe]

I gotta tell you Sir, Heyjoe pictures aside, this is one of the most awesome pics I have seen in a long time.

Concur...Canon IS lenses allow for dramatic airshow shots like this one.

 

[MIDNJAC]

While the orders DO say the bit about "...duty involving flying", there is a section near the end of your orders that says something to the effect of "PERSSUPPDET ADVISED: Please Disregard member's flight status printed above. Member is in a flying status "not involving flying". I think it's BUPERS way of getting Ensigns all excited about being "in a flight status" and then saying "just kidding, suck it Enswine".

This is what I was referring to, just for clarification.

 

[Scoob]

I think you're SOL for HDIP:

220101. Entitlement. Members under competent orders to participate in regular and frequent aerial flights as crew or non-crew members, who otherwise meet the requirements of this chapter, are entitled to flying pay for that duty. Officers, including aviation cadets, entitled to aviation career incentive pay under section 2202, below, are not entitled to payments under this section.

Looks like you're better off trying to get qualified for ACIP while in IFS:

220201. Entitlement.
[FONT=Monotype Sorts,Monotype Sorts]+ [/FONT]A. Entitlement to ACIP shall be restricted to regular and reserve officers who hold, or are in training leading to, an aeronautical rating or designation and who engage and remain in aviation service on a career basis. Entitlement to ACIP may be on a continuous or conditional (month to month) basis. Officers above pay grade O-6 with over 25 years of aviation service are not entitled to ACIP, either continuous or conditional.

 

[billiken2002]

since it effectively works out to be 5 months of flying pay just for the time spent in IFS (2 calendar months in IFS, 3 months in the 'grace period' which the 25 hours in IFS more than satisfies the requirements for that)

Aren't guys in Pensacola completing IFS in 2-3 weeks? So, with that being said, getting Flight Pay for the actual flying is about 60-80 bucks. That'll buy me 1 tank of gas. Worth it?

 

[mmx1]

Aren't guys in Pensacola completing IFS in 2-3 weeks? So, with that being said, getting Flight Pay for the actual flying is about 60-80 bucks. That'll buy me 1 tank of gas. Worth it?

2-3 weeks? holy. I wish.

Average of 40 days at one of the faster schools (Bay Minette). Around 30 days on the rare occasion (usually a student with some prior flight time).

 

[Ducky]

Aren't guys in Pensacola completing IFS in 2-3 weeks? So, with that being said, getting Flight Pay for the actual flying is about 60-80 bucks. That'll buy me 1 tank of gas. Worth it?

I would think that it is definitely worth it. You are flying. Flying should =Flight Pay. You can die in a cessna just as easily as in a T-34 Furthermore, if I had to guess, that line on the orders about disregarding flying status is probably the same line they were using before IFS existed or when it was done prior to reporting to API.

The Navy will never hesitate to take back any excess payment you receive. So why should you allow them to not pay what you are entitled even if it is only 3 weeks.

 

[BACONATOR]

I would think that it is definitely worth it. You are flying. Flying should =Flight Pay.

The Navy will never hesitate to take back any excess payment you receive. So why should you allow them to not pay what you are entitled even if it is only 3 weeks.

I think you fail to understand what flight pay is. As I understand it, flight pay is pay to personnel whose occupation involves military flying. SNAs are performing a duty as military aviators in training, so we get flight pay. Puttering around in a cessna for a couple weeks is not fulfilling a military flight mission requirement. It is a screening before you start your flying career.

Yes it is flying, but it is not at all related to the military portion of your training. It is just a screen for it. I have no idea if this makes sense to you, but that is the way I see it. Perhaps reading more about flight pay (the instruction for it) would clarify this. But what the hell do I know. I didn't even do IFS.