MasterBates
Well-Known Member
But he'll probably make CDR anyway.... :icon_rage
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Flight School Attrition
- Thread starter thenuge
- Start date
But he'll probably make CDR anyway.... :icon_rage
To all these stories about people getting nailed on their last flight, I will add for the peanut gallery (who haven't been through the program) that the IPs will generally bust their butts to help you and keep you in the program if they feel like you will be of value and have a good attitude. One down does not mean attrition. But a history of subpar grades and/or previous unsats can put you in the unenviable position of having to essentially walk on water to make it through, because one more strike and you're out. You won't get attrited on your last flights without having significant issues earlier in the program.
thenuge
Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult
Precisely, and well said. Someone who downs their last flight and attrites (rare, but it happens) had serious issues beforehand. In MOST cases, it's a good thing they're gone. Note I said "most".
There's a big difference between a problem child (unprepared, unmotivated apathetic, stupid) and a good guy with a problem (bad day, confused, human factors, etc).
And that's why I said "most".
Just adding to what you said for others.
Lesson served here (and from my experience in VT-86 as well) is that a large majority of the downs come from administrative mistakes. You f#ck away an intercept? Fine, that's a 'debriefing point'. That's why you're in training... to be trained.
Forgetting EPs, bad area management, screwing up approaches and basic air nav, doing checklists out of order, missing comms... that's the stuff that will force your IP/IN to down you.
Give a good brief. Know what you need to know. Straighten up your admin on the way out and on the way back. If you can prove you can do that without incident, your instructors will work with you. If you can't handle that, there's no way in hell they'll give you wings.
Ahh, but I'm sure as the advanced jet guys will remember, no one ever earns a down. Every time the stud was tooling along flying a perfect jet when the evil IP decided to down him for not doing an ICS check or for being hot mike
As a result when someone gets attrited unless they were dropping 500feet bombs in weps, it's usually hard to tell exactly why they are out.
As a result when someone gets attrited unless they were dropping 500feet bombs in weps, it's usually hard to tell exactly why they are out.I don't think 22% attrition is all that bad. Everybody groans with a way back when story, but it was significantly higher back in the early 70s.
Back in late 1970 the Navy decided it had too many SNAs and attrited about 600 Training Command wide in one day. I was at Whiting when this happened and they called all Navy SNAs in and gave them a letter telling them if they were in or out. If you were regular Navy and given the boot you were re assigned; if you were a Reserve you were out of the Navy. This was done irregardless of how far along you were, but I don't know if it was done at VT1.
Marines, thank God, and Coasties weren't affected.
Back in late 1970 the Navy decided it had too many SNAs and attrited about 600 Training Command wide in one day. I was at Whiting when this happened and they called all Navy SNAs in and gave them a letter telling them if they were in or out. If you were regular Navy and given the boot you were re assigned; if you were a Reserve you were out of the Navy. This was done irregardless of how far along you were, but I don't know if it was done at VT1.
Marines, thank God, and Coasties weren't affected.
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
It happened again in 1990. The navy personnel system sems to have great peaks and valleys.
I dunno, it seemed at least in my squadron that the real scoop, or at least something believable, still managed to float around the rumor mill if somebody did something cosmically stupid. And as far as the "evil IP" goes, on the flipside I'm sure everyone who made it through the program has an "I can't believe I didn't get pink for that" story from a solo or a flight with a forgiving IP who either gave them a below or an incomplete instead.Ahh, but I'm sure as the advanced jet guys will remember, no one ever earns a down. Every time the stud was tooling along flying a perfect jet when the evil IP decided to down him for not doing an ICS check or for being hot mike
How about getting an above when you KNOW you just earned a down You know I finished the program as a distinguished naval graduate, didn't get commodores list because I had 1 down, but even that was a 2 above 'velvet' down but from talking to guys in the squadron I always wondered why I didn't get more. As far as the SNA rumor mill, stories that start out 'he missed a checklist item' by the time the scuttlebutt ends are 'he took the runway, canopy up, in a jet without an engine'
You know I finished the program as a distinguished naval graduate, didn't get commodores list because I had 1 down, but even that was a 2 above 'velvet' down but from talking to guys in the squadron I always wondered why I didn't get more. As far as the SNA rumor mill, stories that start out 'he missed a checklist item' by the time the scuttlebutt ends are 'he took the runway, canopy up, in a jet without an engine'
Nah, never happens. Actually, some students carry a portable reality distortion field. "How was that not a 4?" "Well, for one, we're inverted..."