HCS-5 Disestablished

[squorch2]

There's a struggle for hours/money between the "core" missions of HSC, which are wildly disparate and require almost completely different skill sets, along with the somewhat-less-than-tactical heritage of HC, all of which results in a delayed acquisition of what hscs is talking about: background, manning and equipment.

 

[bobbybrock]

Weren't these two units pretty much it ( in the Navy) when it came to the missions that we are talking about .
I know that they had some real experienced guys. Not sure what gap they filled between the Army and AF spec ops assets.

 

[VFA-203 Forever]

It seems the HSC/HS/HCS community is a big clusterf!ck right now.

What current Helo units are slated to get axed right now?

 

[squorch2]

There are timelines for HS squadrons to become HSC, and for HSL to become HSM, but other than that, I believe only a couple of squadrons are being disestablished.

 

[hscs]

No more axing -- actually, we have added more squadrons than we have cut. The HCS-5 deal has to deal with the whole Active-Reserve Integration.

 

[bobbybrock]

Is Naval Reserve rotary-wing aviation a thing of the past then or is 85 and 84 still part of the reserve?

 

[BigIron]

Is Naval Reserve rotary-wing aviation a thing of the past then or is 85 and 84 still part of the reserve?

84&85 are both still reserves as far as I know. HM-14 and HM-15 (MH-53Es) are both partly reserve squadrons, so there is definitely a reserve helo aspect to the USN.

 

[hscs]

HSC will pick up the missions. HSC CAG squadrons will continue to do as they always have. The future is less clear for the HSC expeditionary squadrons. I would expect to see more of the Air Ambulance and possibly even Riverine Squadron support. You won't see that many more VERTREP cruises with the contract VERTREP and the HSC CAG squadron handling the AOE det.

 

[bobbybrock]

I'm not sure about the Air Ambulance mission. I think it depends on op tempo. If things slow down I'd be suprised to see that mission not performed by the Army in Kuwait.

 

[ChuckMK23]

It seems the HSC/HS/HCS community is a big clusterf!ck right now.

What current Helo units are slated to get axed right now?

There is a plan. It's called ... now wait for it ... the Helo Master Plan. Original huh?

Navy helos are undergoing a huge transition right now and it's easy to see how it would appear to someone not in the community as a little schizophrenic. The Navy is the only service that employed it's helos in very non-combat support type roles - that along with the historical emphasis on ASW is what's driven (pushed) Navala Aviation to modernize and operationalize the helo community like never before. It's a lot of politics (See the Air Ambulance augementation thread) and cultural change. That'ss change once you get rid of the helo leadership that was bread in the 80's and get younger Senior Leaders that have the benefit of an Air Medal or DFC or two.

It looks like to me, as an outsider now, that things are starting to stabalize. More involvement in expeditionary combat operations, better equipment, better training than ever before, and helo senior officers (O-5's) that deploy with their squadrons, is making Helos probably the best place to be in Naval Aviation right now.

I've said it before but I would trade my 80-90's experience for a chance to be a nugget nowadays in a heartbeat.

 

[bobbybrock]

Chuck,
In the 12 years that I was an Army aviator we changed aviation structure 4 times. It seems as if we are trying to reinvent the wheel on the green side as well.
As we speak the active, guard and in some respects reserve side of Army aviation is going through the largest transition it has gone through in years.
It sounds like it is for the better on the navy side.
I think that on the Air Ambulance side they have done more than proven themselves. Hopefully the big Army see's things that way and maybe intergrates them into other theaters.
But then again that would take away from the ( Army) Aviation budget. So I guess we'll see in the near future how big of a team player Army aviation is.

 

[hscs]

We still have some time to go before those who have done more make it into the leadership. There is still those who say "Why do we have to qualify our people in a tactical syllabus, if all we are ever going to do is VERTREP/SAR?"

 

[bobbybrock]

We still have some time to go before those who have done more make it into the leadership. There is still those who say "Why do we have to qualify our people in a tactical syllabus, if all we are ever going to do is VERTREP/SAR?"

That is the Army mindset in a nut shell. SAR has always been a tertiary mission for us. But we spend very little time training it. The other missions take priority.
The problem with the Army is non aviators and senior aviators with very little experience make the decisions.
The mentality of "that is how we always did it" isn't going to work in todays battle filed. We all have to adapt . That is why Rumsfield wasn't like by the Army senior leadership. They didn't want things to change.