Avgas though is more costly than jet A
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- Thread starter Randy Daytona
- Start date
Beards aren't just for rotary pilots. Someone took beard oil to the 3710...the note about O2 masks has been softened to the point where you can have facial hair as long as you can get a seal. Many of our CIV & CTR are sporting beards.
Maybe it depends on the ratio of beard oil?
Looking at AF ENJPT class pics, lots of beards on our Euro student pilot T-38 brethren.
My O2 mask never fit me correctly without a beard unless I snicked it down to all three clicks on the bayonet fitting, which wasn't really a long term solution. No one seemed to be that concerned.
Data? If the "quantitative fit test" shows beards failing, is that truly representative of operational conditions? I see bearded men in all sorts of jobs, civilian and military, that use oxygen masks, respirators, etc. I hear SEALs occasionally SCUBA dive--beards. The dudes working in my company's blade and paint shops with respirators all day--almost all beards. Almost every European military--beards.
Sure a full Grizzly Adams may be an issue, but a neatly trimmed one is not.
This is about uniformity and aesthetics, which is absolutely fine. Half the rules in the military are about uniformity and aesthetics.
Let's stop pretending it's about mask seals.
If they are wearing beards they are in direct violation of OSHA's respiratory protection standards. Unless they are wearing supplied air systems..
Different physics, the molecular size of air vs water is what allows SCUBA to most likely fit with light to moderate beards.
Fire departments use a full face mask that is designed to provide a larger seal area compared to a nose/mouth mask.
Go on the manufacturer's sites, and they will have the data for how they meet appropriate ANSI standards.
Yes, that's the who point of the test. If it is leaking while seated for a test, it definitely is leaking during operational use.
Qualitative test allow the user to state whether they think the mask is good or not, quantitative compares air inside and outside the mask.
Some OSHA standards, such as Asbestos, state that only a quantitative test may be used.
And? Some are unionized also. What's that got to do with proper fit of a respirator or O2 mask?
Absolutely not, it's about proper use of any safety/survivability equipment.
Any Flight Physiologists or DOSSs wish to chime in?
Yeah, VMFA and VFA dudes were flying with baller ass beards and O2 masks during Covid. No causal physiological events noted. Any questions?
Take it or leave it, but ended up one Sunday morning at a bagel store with most of the fire department in the area on duty that day. All of them were clean shaven. No 1/4” exception. Actually was surprised and changed my perspective. Am sure others have opposite examples.
Nope, empirical data is so much better than actual studies.
Sorry to bog this thread down with 40 plus years in safety and industrial hygiene, Mil and Civ.
Heck, based on your wisdom alone Dog, I'll ignore the dozens of actual studies concerning respirators and masks I studied during the COVID period alone. And I'll ignore the actual fit tests I've done on hundreds of respirator and mask users.
So, wear your beards, wear your cloth masks, just do anything other than actually read and analyze manufacturer, industry and government studies.
Now even I want to grow a beard.
When one reflects on the fact that the Army is going to move quickly to the MV-75 and has decided to greatly reduce its Chinook, Apache, and Blackhawk fleets, the idea of starting a new flight school methodology right now is insane.
They are cutting Army aviation by at least 20%. They have no solid vision of where this will end up.
A substantial portion of their fleet is moving to a 300 knot aircraft that flies like a twin turboprop most of the time. Their "Flight School Next" program makes zero mention of this. They are looking at stepping DOWN to a less capable aircraft than they have now. They will be in for a shock when the high-school-to-flight-school crowd start trying to fly under the weather and plant tiltrotors into the trees all over Georgia.
Nothing about this is considered in the MV-75 pipeline. We don’t have a 75 pipeline that’s why the ODT stands up next year. They get to make one.
There’s been a lot acknowledged by some of the old heads at Rucker with regards to how unprepared any of our current academic models are to prepping to that aircraft as it comes online. Just getting people to realize it’s not a helicopter has been a fight, now we gotta get old Huey guys to teach aerodynamic principles they never heard of because that’s the civilian cadre that strangleholds Rucker. Same reason we can’t get effective evolution in our other flight courses.
Part of the reason so many are pushing for a second flight school somewhere west of the Mississippi, just to break the brain trust of old guys we can’t shake. Capitalizing on weather and training areas is honestly a secondary win with that model. We have to many people with too little recency trying to teach the way they were taught and fought which is decades out of date. Thats Rucker.
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Honestly not by much. Go on Foreflight and check FBO fuel prices.