How Low can He Go??

[Fred]

Hypothetical example:

So there you are as POTUS, and you are meeting with the Emperor of Japan in Tokyo to strike a mutually beneficial trade deal, but it will benefit the US more than Japan.

You are told that upon greeting him, if you refuse to bow and show respect for Japanese customs then the Emperor will consider you rude and refuse to do business with your country for the rest of your administration.

So you can swallow your pride and adhere to Japanese customs for a day to get what you want for the country, or you could take the "I bow to no one" stance and walk away with nothing.

This is the way politics works. Sometimes you have to give a little to get a lot more. The hard-charging, "we're too proud to follow your customs" diplomacy would get us nowhere.

The Emperor of Japan has no more political power than the Queen of England. It is NOT a Japanese custom to bow and shake hands at the same time….ever. It is not a Japanese custom for the leader of a foreign country to bow in a submissive manner before the Emperor. If Obama was hypothetically told by his protocol people to do as you state…they need to be fired for being idiots.

 

[zipmartin]

We are now seeing why the incident at Ft. Hood occurred. Our military as a whole has been infiltrated by the PC crowd, people who buy into the PC BS and are too concerned about their careers to speak up for what is right about this once-great country of ours. I'm proud to be a Patriot. Maybe that's why I was early-retired after 18 years in 1994.

 

[Spekkio]

Excuse me? Nobody told our glorious leader that.

The Emperor of Japan has no more political power than the Queen of England.

That's why I said it was a hypothetical example.

Despite not having any "real" power, the way our President treats the Emperor can have an effect on those who do make policy in Japan.

The point I'm trying to make is that it's easy to bitch and moan about the President not upholding your own sense of pride from where we sit. You don't have to take the blame for ruining diplomatic relations with a country for being "rude." There are a lot of things that go into international relations with the ultimate goal of achieving deals that wil be beneficial to us. If greeting the Emperor of Japan with a bow or holding hands with Saudi leaders allows us to accomplish that, then that's what the President is going to do.

 

[Fred]

When military members and their spouses are briefed before meeting foreign dignitaries, royalty, ranking members of foreign militaries, etc., on proper protocol and etiquette for that particular country I would suspect the President of the United States would also privy to such information. Like is said, if Obama was hypothetically told to act the way he did….then his hypothetical protocol person needs to be hypothetically fired.

 

[ChunksJR]

We are now seeing why the incident at Ft. Hood occurred

Our military as a whole has been infiltrated by the PC crowd, people who buy into the PC BS and are too concerned about their careers to speak up for what is right about this once-great country of ours.

One has nothing to do with the other. Some nutso religious fanatic, doesn't matter if it's a muslim or a middle-ages crusader, is what happened in FT Hood...we've talked about that.

The PC thing is the way it's always been in the military though...just custom to those times. Today isn't any worse, I don't think, other than the variables have changed. The rules of engagement have changed. The enemy isn't a country. Technology and availibility of war material have become more accessible. These are just a few of the changes. The PC thing hasn't changed, it's just morphed.

 

[RadicalDude]

Didn't there used to be wardroom rules on this board?

I feel like this thread did a great job of bringing out the worst in all involved.

 

[ChunksJR]

Didn't there used to be wardroom rules on this board?

I feel like this thread did a great job of bringing out the worst in all involved.

Says the guy with 15 posts...you're so cute.

 

[Mumbles]

Says the guy with 15 posts...you're so cute.

No Doubt. STFU!

 

[zipmartin]

One has nothing to do with the other. Some nutso religious fanatic, doesn't matter if it's a muslim or a middle-ages crusader, is what happened in FT Hood...we've talked about that.

Yes we have. I wasn't talking about "Some nutso religious fanatic". I was talking about statements like this:
"What happened at Ft. Hood is a tragedy, and I believe it would be a greater tragedy if diversity became a casualty here." - Gen. George W. Casey Jr.

"The PC thing is the way it's always been in the military" - True statement. I totally agree. But I believe that with our current liberal-minded educational system, more of our current military have been brainwashed at a young age and we end up with leaders like Gen. Casey who are more concerned about "diversity" than making sure attacks like this don't happen in the first place, by weeding out threatening people like Nidal Hassan instead of allowing the "diversity" he speaks so reverently about. The signs were obviously there.....people were more concerned about their careers than objecting to his radical, "diverse" views.

But I'm obviously wasting my time in this argument, errr... disagreement. The brainwashing has already occurred. And seems to be irreversible.

 

[HercDriver]

WHITE HOUSE protocol !! It's not about WHITE HOUSE protocol...It's about AMERICAN protocol. On official business the president does not represent the WHITE HOUSE.......he represents AMERICA. And in that capacity the majority of AMERICANS do not wish their elected representative to the world to bow to any head of state. As for respect, John Wayne knew how to show it....a one finger touch to the brim of his hat was sufficient. Anything beyond that is PC...and PC is killing America (literally)...ref Ft. Hood. As Earl Pitts would say "Wake up Uhmurica".

Ummm, John Wayne was an actor. That's it, just an actor. I enjoy his films as much as the next guy, but "Wake up, RBrowne".

On to the "debate".

You know who really cares about this stuff? The right wing echo chamber/pundits/blogosphere/Fox News, who have a vested interest in pushing it. No one else really cares. The bow happened in a few seconds and I doubt more than a few batted an eye when it happened, but those who dislike the Pres stare at the picture for hours, as he is frozen in the bow. We saw pics earlier in this thread of other presidents bowing and nary a peep was said by anyone at that time, however the folks on this board are unbowed by those pics. "I got out my protractor...he bowed too low", "He isn't looking him in the eye", etc.

We have the fringe right pushing the idea that Pres. Obama is acting subservient to a foreign leader, we've got a million protocol officers on this board, and we have folks making statements about "dipping the ensign" and Ft. Hood.

Goodness, it's a hoot.

 

[Mos]

WHITE HOUSE protocol !! It's not about WHITE HOUSE protocol...It's about AMERICAN protocol. On official business the president does not represent the WHITE HOUSE.......he represents AMERICA. And in that capacity the majority of AMERICANS do not wish their elected representative to the world to bow to any head of state. As for respect, John Wayne knew how to show it....a one finger touch to the brim of his hat was sufficient. Anything beyond that is PC...and PC is killing America (literally)...ref Ft. Hood. As Earl Pitts would say "Wake up Uhmurica".

Of course he represents America. Who is saying differently? It sure as f*ck wasn't me. As I said, the president needs to find a balance between showing respect for other cultures and also representing the American people. As already demonstrated photographically, past presidents get this. We don't have to be dicks to the rest of the world to affirm that we're the most powerful and blessed country on the face of the earth. Seriously, where did our sense of decorum and manners go? That used to be a conservative value too.

 

[Mumbles]

From Thomas Sowell....

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/11/17/bowing_to_world_opinion__99181.html

 

[Clux4]

Sowell is another fuck face that enjoys the privilege of internet media. Who else but the right cares about this sh!t?

 

[Spekkio]

... But how large or small an act [bowing to the emperor of Japan] is depends on its actual consequences, not on whether the politically correct intelligentsia think it is no big deal.

If the author seems content to judge the magnitude of an act based on its impact, perhaps he should take a chill pill because this "act" probably isn't going to leave any ripples.

 

[Mumbles]

Sowell is another fuck face that enjoys the privilege of internet media. Who else but the right cares about this sh!t?

Yeah....let's go you fucking clown.

I'm amazed...(no, actually it's predictable now) how you lefty moonbats hate anything that dosen't fit the template...(i.e. a black conservative).