Just selected, and got....

[jugg34naut]

First, congrats on selection. Second, what makes you think selecting jets would have not kept your "family in one piece"? People, relationships, and marriages fail across the spectrum of employment - and that means they fail across the spectrum of flight school selection and community.

If it was a bullet, why'd you put it first?

Look, I'm not trying to rain on your parade - I'm just trying to offer some advice. If you think the community you selected is what is going to make or break a family/marriage.... It's not. You, your partner, your maturity, your communication, and your ability to manage expectations will go lot further toward ensuring happiness then whether or not your aircraft has a tail hook or a microwave

Agreed sir, I'm thinking more along the lines that, and this is just going off of what I have heard from those that have been there, that the day to day time commitment is somewhat more in the jet and fighter community as well as work ups, 9 month deployments, 3 deployments in 3 years etc...This is not to say that maritime guys don't work hard and have long days either. I am aware of that each person must make his own decisions. Had I got jets I would have been stoked just as much and worked my ass off to be good at what I do. I still will. I say that I dodged a bullet for my family's sake. I think that each family functions differently and I only wanted to illustrate that I believe that family satisfaction coupled with my working hard and all that about maturity, communication, and ability to manage expectation will be easier to do from a hotel room in 7th fleet on my wifi enabled phone than from the bowels of carrier. Please don't misunderstand me. I think that jets are the shit and I already have a shit ton of respect for the guys that can do that. I had jet grades, wanted jets, got maritime. I am not butt hurt either way. I'll do the task that Big Navy has given me to the best of my ability.

 

[jugg34naut]

I'll pile on here a little bit. Two friends of mine recently graduated Primary and were asking me to verify some rumors lurking around the VTs about tacair. They informed me that the gouge is jet guys are ALWAYS gone, fly very little, have a poor ready room/community attitude, have high divorce rates, and (this one was really funny) have no shot at getting picked up at an airline compared to a big wing guy.

I'll just caution all the Primary studs out there that if any of the above is true, it's true for all communities. I've been a helo guy and a jet guy and you're gonna love what you fly almost as much as the guys flying beside you, no matter where you go.

I can't believe someone could be led to believe that missing jets would be dodging a bullet.

That is what we hear in primary. That is also what I heard talking face to face with a RAG IP for Supers at the fleet fly in a few weeks back. Also, you can't expect to train us with helo and p3 bubbas and expect us not to have a warped perspective on the jet community, right or wrong. As you are well aware there aren't any primary jet IPs to defend the community. I know that all communities have good and bad times.

I wanted to carry a gun and be a freaking Marine grunt too at one point and realized that the Navy was a far better option for ME and MINE. I'm not here to flame on the jet guys in the slightest. I still envy you, just like I envy the Marine guys some days. In the end I am content with the hand that has been dealt to me. That doesn't mean my road will be any less difficult or arduous just that it is a different road and for ME and MINE I am excited about what maritime has in store.

 

[jugg34naut]

Just an observation, and something that I took into consideration. The guys that I have talked face to face with in the jet community have for the most part said that they didn't have kids until after they were well into their career. That is to say that they didn't have kids in advanced or the frs. I have two and getting through primary with jet grades was no easy task. Yes it can be done. Did it take a toll on my family? Absolutely. Would I have made it work in the jet community? You're damn right I would have. Am I excited that advanced is only 5ish months and that maritime deployment schedules are more fixed and I can plan family life around them? You're damn right I am.

 

[Recovering LSO]

I wish you luck. I hope you enjoy your time in MPRA - and I hope you pick up a tip or two about managing your own expectations. Something tells me there's a lot of bad gouge circulating around the land of orange and white.

Perhaps by the time you're doing your obligatory shooter/ship's company tour, that WiFi iPhone will be useful

 

[jugg34naut]

Ups and downs. Still don't know where I went wrong. I had maritime 3rd big Navy said otherwise. Dodged a bullet for the family (wife was relieved). I can manage expectations just fine. Understand the disassociated tour to the ship. Trying to be excited. If our gouge is wrong then it's wrong but it's what we have when we make the decision.

 

[Flash]

...Also, you can't expect to train us with helo and p3 bubbas and expect us not to have a warped perspective on the jet community, right or wrong. As you are well aware there aren't any primary jet IPs to defend the community...

...Something tells me there's a lot of bad gouge circulating around the land of orange and white...

Are there really no jet IP's in pilot primary nowadays?

 

[jugg34naut]

There are Marine jet guys. There wasn't any Navy jet guys in my squadron. This is the Ens shutting up now.

 

[Brett327]

Are there really no jet IP's in pilot primary nowadays?

I don't think that's a new thing. Presumably it's a conscious detailing practice to ensure guys with tailhook experience go to be advanced IPs.

 

[SynixMan]

words

Stop digging dude.

 

[Flash]

I don't think that's a new thing. Presumably it's a conscious detailing practice to ensure guys with tailhook experience go to be advanced IPs.

Many moons ago when I went through primary my pilot brethren going through at the same time seemed to have a few token jet guys in their squadrons. I know that was back in the dark ages but still.... The predominance of VP and helo guys at primary IP's back was case as well back then but it didn't seem to be exclusive.

 

[MIDNJAC]

I don't think that's a new thing. Presumably it's a conscious detailing practice to ensure guys with tailhook experience go to be advanced IPs.

Agreed. I know of nobody ever who went to primary VT's from VFA. I'm sure it has/does happen, but I never saw it happen. We had 0 tacair IP's of any kind when I went through.

The rumors are funny though. I'm sure guys hear what they want to hear, but "gone all the time, never fly" couldn't describe my experience in VFA less. I did one 7 month deployment and flew nearly every day during my JO tour. I left that tour with over 1100 hrs, which if I have heard correctly, is not that different from P-3/P-8 folk as well. Granted over 900 of those were multiengine, jet, PIC hours, which few VP/VQ first tour JO's could probably claim. I don't know what the airlines want, but I would guess I wouldn't be in the hurt locker if that were my goal in a couple years.

 

[Python]

Agreed. I know of nobody ever who went to primary VT's from VFA. I'm sure it has/does happen, but I never saw it happen. We had 0 tacair IP's of any kind when I went through.

The rumors are funny though. I'm sure guys hear what they want to hear, but "gone all the time, never fly" couldn't describe my experience in VFA less. I did one 7 month deployment and flew nearly every day during my JO tour. I left that tour with over 1100 hrs, which if I have heard correctly, is not that different from P-3/P-8 folk as well. Granted over 900 of those were multiengine, jet, PIC hours, which few VP/VQ first tour JO's could probably claim. I don't know what the airlines want, but I would guess I wouldn't be in the hurt locker if that were my goal in a couple years.

900 in your JO tour in charlies? Jesus...

 

[Recovering LSO]

The rumors are funny though. I'm sure guys hear what they want to hear, but "gone all the time, never fly" couldn't describe my experience in VFA less. I did one 7 month deployment and flew nearly every day during my JO tour. I left that tour with over 1100 hrs, which if I have heard correctly, is not that different from P-3/P-8 folk as well. Granted over 900 of those were multiengine, jet, PIC hours, which few VP/VQ first tour JO's could probably claim. I don't know what the airlines want, but I would guess I wouldn't be in the hurt locker if that were my goal in a couple years.

This.

Again, not intended as an MPRA vs TacAir thread jack, but since the VFA/VAQ rumor mill topic was opened, it's worth exploring further for the benefit of other readers. MIDNJAC highlights a very very important point that often gets overlooked by young guys. You might spend three years flying something that looks like an airliner, but how many hours during that three year tour are there "hiring" kind?

Just things to think about.

 

[webmaster]

Hiring kind? I have observed that the airlines are valuing all types of backgrounds and hour experience levels. We had jet, tanker, RJ and props in my new hire class. Low guy had just over 1700 hours, high civilian pilot had 9000. At the beginning of the hiring wave instructor and NATOPs quals were valued as equivalents to LCA and CFI/MEI/CFII. With all the hiring and going through the most qualified you have guys and gals who aren't instructors getting hired. I bet in a few years the dynamic will change some more as the available pool of qualified pilots shrinks. I still think the majors will be able to be pick from the best applicants while the regionals will struggle to find people willing to work for their shit pay.

From what I have observed (my training partner was a marine F18 bubba) all the skills translate well regardless of what community you come from. Yeah. Maybe the maritime or transport guys have a leg up with CRM and flying larger planes but that is a very small hurdle that any professional pilot that is willing to learn can overcome. New plane. New company. New type of flying. New procedures. We have all gone from different aircraft with our military backgrounds so this should come a little easier to us.

The few issues I have heard and seen are mostly civilian guys and gals with high hours and are older. They have a harder time adapting to a new plane, or switching seat positions (left seat to the right).

If your eventual goal is the airlines do well and enjoy the community you are in while in the Navy. Build up the required hours to get your ATP and network, network, network.

 

[ltedge46]

As for the Whidbey transition timeline, plan is to begin in 2016, my old skipper is headed up there to be the commodore at that time and he's expecting the lead the charge. But, timelines are always a pawn to the budget, the P-8 buying curve is always in flux and the top priority for the Navy right now is to maintain the shipbuilding plan, CVN79, Ohio replacement etc. It's an easy pick for the CNO to delay another P-8 or two to "find" another 300 million dollars in the budget. If you are following the news, the 2016 budget negotiations are not going well to fully fund the military and right now we are looking at a funding level possibly 40 Billion less than what the president and DOD is asking for. If that happens, everything will take a hit and you may see further delays in transition timelines. Certainly, the transition will start on time as those first aircraft have already been funded, but the full transition timeline may extend by a couple of years.