Looks like the USNA has a qouta for pacifists too.

[dilbert123]

Neither is flight school, but you don't have to repay that if you DOR.

I really don't want to get all "damn kids these days," but this is what comes of never holding kids accountable for anything. This guy swore an oath, one that included a line about no mental reservations. Now he feels entitled to say, "I changed my mind," and lawyers up when he doesn't get his way. Not hard to believe; his world is one of helicopter parents badgering teachers to raise grades, or sue the little league when Jimmy doesn't get to play, etc etc.

Goddamn it, you're not always entitled to get what you want, when you want it, no matter how strongly you feel about it. Make a decision, make a commitment, then honor your commitment, even if you feel later like it was the wrong decision.

Well, whatever. This kid'll be out job-hunting in the worst job market in a century, saddled with a $100K+ debt to Uncle Sam. I imagine it'll be a nice lesson in learning to live with the consequences of your actions.

Totally agree, Uncle Fester!!!

I flew with a guy who in 1970 applied for Conscientious Objector and was approved and returned to civilian life. I knew and was friends with him and think he was vey sincere, but he was commissioned via ROTC, full scholarship to Princeton, and he didn't have to repay a dime. That's not right any way you look at it. I'm glad to hear this submariner will have to repay.

 

[leo20307]

Not surprised he has to pay back. We had a kid leave NROTC probably two months after signing the Navy papers sophomore year because he suddenly wanted to switch to Army and they literally nickel and dimed him for the two months tuition back. NSTC threatened to take it up with the Army to force them not to pay his scholarship until he reimbursed the Navy.

This guy is on a much larger scale.

 

[CommodoreMid]

Just like Fester mentioned, since we don't force those who DOR out of flight school, no matter the reason, for their education, I don't see how he could be forced to so either.

Based on the report, it looks like he legitimately had many of his religious belief changes both before and after graduation. Joining the Quakers and taking their beliefs is a big step. Membership in a pacifist group used to be grounds for CO status, so why not now? IIRC, Sgt. York didn't get his CO exemption because he wasn't a member a church specifically advocating pacifism. Conversely, when my father was drafted in Vietnam, he was a member of the Church of the Brethren (close relatives of the Amish) and so he could have legitimately claimed conscientious objector status.

Besides, how is this any different from (well, I guess not any more with DADT going out the window) someone being legitimately gay and revealing the fact after they graduated from the academy, knowing the consequences? Have we forced any of those people to pay back their educations?

 

[phrogdriver]

From another article:

After four years at the U.S. Naval Academy, followed by a master's degree in computer science at Johns Hopkins University to further his career as a submariner, Izbicki took a required psychological exam during the first week of nuclear-power training in South Carolina. The test asked if he could launch a nuclear missile if ordered to do so.
He answered no.

Honestly? Four years at the Academy? I didn't go there, but I'm pretty sure they discuss war once or twice, even during the first two years, when he'd have had the opportunity to quit without obligation. If his religious views were that strong before he went, then he never should have accepted his appointment.

He can quit all he wants, he'd just better pay it back, either in cash or in time. He got a lot of education on the government dime. I can see a lot of people "getting religion" suddenly if he doesn't have to pay his education back. You can have principles, and I'll admire you for sticking up for them, but having strong principles means one should be willing to accept strong consequences.

 

[Treetop Flyer]

As long as he has to pay it back, I don't see any problem with it. If he really doesn't think he can do the job, then he doesn't need to be there. If he failed to realize he wouldn't be able to do his job until after incurring an obligation then he should have to repay the cost of his education. He doesn't get to scam a free education, and the Navy is free of a useless submariner.

 

[statesman]

It all seems kind of short sighted to me. I mean when was the last time a sub had to go to war. Maybe 10 years ago... 8? And even then they would have been launching TLAMs not nukes. He had a few years left he should have done everything in his power to get to a Boomer... that would have nearly guaranteed he would NEVER go to war. And then he would be able to leave with an honorable discharge, no bill for USNA, etc.

 

[Treetop Flyer]

Yeah he should have just lied, and tried to fake his way through it right? He did the more honorable thing here in my opinion instead of trying to scam a free education by lying to his shipmates.

 

[mmx1]

Yeah he should have just lied, and tried to fake his way through it right? He did the more honorable thing here in my opinion instead of trying to scam a free education by lying to his shipmates.

Agreed. The point of the psych exam was to make sure we're sending guys underway that can push the button when needed. He did us all a favor by fessing up, so long as he's not a bitch about the payback.