P-3s--What's the community like?

[koolaiddrinker]

Agree with the wise words of these last few posts. Here's how it worked for me.
Left the squadron as the #2 EP, Instructor Pilot, Flight O, MC, all that good stuff.
XO advised me to be an Admiral's Aide or take a hard fill.
CO said,"There's a PEP billet. You are nuts if you don't take it."
XO said, "You are ruining your career".

I selected DH in a year when the select rate was well below 50%.
Meanwhile I know guys who did all the right things and didn't select. I know guys who have taken every hardfill/IA/opportunity to kiss ass and still didn't end up where they wanted to be.

So, for my 2 cents worth, take jobs you think you will enjoy, because you will spend a lot of hours doing them. If you get a crappy job, try and find some pride to do it well because hopefully someone will notice and care (your sailors will certainly do both). When it comes time for selection, hope you are in a year group where the select rate is about 90% because honestly, that is about the percentage of people who are qualified for the DH job (notice I didn't say would be good at it). If not, be honored that you are in such a selective peer group and let the chips fall where they may. In the mean time, don't sacrifice the important things (your family, your friends, you sanity or your pride) to satisfy some elusive "career track" that doesn't exist. I was told if I didn't do JPME I wouldn't select. I did and I still haven't finished it. My year it seemed like a Master's Degree was the golden ticket (which I happened to have, but not because the Navy necessarily wanted me to get one. I got it because I assumed I wouldn't select). Point being, you never know. Look out for yourself without screwing your buddies and then do your best to be okay with whatever happens. There are happy people who don't select and sad people who do. (hey some of us thought we would get to take the money and run). Don't sweat what you can't control and you'll be much better off.

/soap box

 

[Brett327]

384 bucks for a day in Barbados. Oh... the strippers and blow.

A high rate (not that $384/day is all that high) usually means everything there is very expensive. In some places, it's not unheard of for a beer to cost 8-10 dollars. When you factor in meals and an expensive 1-2 star hotel, there's not a lot of dough left over for "discretionary spending." All of a sudden, your hookers and blow scenario has turned into a 5 minute auto-erotic interlude followed by a cup of strong coffee.

Brett

 

[nvrg1vup]

All of a sudden, your hookers and blow scenario has turned into a 5 minute auto-erotic interlude followed by a cup of strong coffee.

Brett

funny. Screw the coffee, I'm getting 6 minutes.

I feel this sentence should be blurted out randomly in a wardroom before a really stressful "I've already had this brief a million times" brief.

 

[zippy]

Can you elaborate more on this as a deterrent and as a plus?
Can anyone PM me or post some info about the per diem? I hear all about it, but not with numbers. Me likes big numbers.

On Surges and deployments, my per diem has ranged from 108.50/month to 2700/month. It all depends where you go.

 

[LazersGoPEWPEW]

On Surges and deployments, my per diem has ranged from 108.50/month to 2700/month. It all depends where you go.

That's not bad at all. Especially on that high side.

 

[FlyinSpy]

A high rate (not that $384/day is all that high) usually means everything there is very expensive. In some places, it's not unheard of for a beer to cost 8-10 dollars. When you factor in meals and an expensive 1-2 star hotel, there's not a lot of dough left over for "discretionary spending." All of a sudden, your hookers and blow scenario has turned into a 5 minute auto-erotic interlude followed by a cup of strong coffee.

Absolutely true, but it's also fun to find the exceptions to the rule occasionally. One that was true (at least when I was there in 2003) was Curacao - at the time, per diem was $300, of which M&IE was $105. Whoever set the per diem rate certainly had high-end tastes, since I never spent close to that, even when stuffing my face and buying copious beers for my new bestest VAW-78 pals. (At the time I was a mercenary spy filling in on one of their frequent counter-narcotics dets.) We dined and drank well every day for a month, got scuba qual'd, bought plenty of souvenirs, and still went home with a decent chunk of change in my pocket. Oh, and we stayed in the Holiday Beach Hotel Casino Resort, home of topless sunbathers and a decent casino. You know you're going to be in for a good det when you check into your hotel and you get 2-for-1 drink coupons and $25 free chips in the casino.

Oh, and Curacao is home to the largest legal brothel in the world - Campo Alegre.... :icon_tong (Alas, officially off-limits to US personnel.)

 

[Alpha_Echo_606]

jmetx07, there are two answers to that question:

1) Hard fill first shore tour: Each VP/VQ squadron offers up so many sacrificial lambs to fill community JO shore tours, these involve overseas TSC, CTF positions. These are community jobs that don't involve flying, and are generally not sought after by those in the community. The CTF leaders put pressure on the COs to ensure that they get sent only EPs or top performers out of their first tour. Doing well in your first tour, and timing can get you identified for these tours. Flip side, do well in that tour, and you can generally write your ticket for follow ons.

2) Hard job: WRT to a second shore tour in Sky-pig's post involves those that have sufficient "slop time" prior to YG+11 (back for DH) to complete another shore tour job that can get you another "check in the box". Depending on how fast you made it through flight school, extra time for each person varies. Examples of hard/career enhancing second shore jobs would include going off to War College/PG School, Admiral's Aide (leg shaver), VP30 PRE-DH (if you didn't go to the FRS as an IP after your first shore tour), or going to one of the VX/VPU squadrons.

WRT success during your first tour as a Pilot: Know your shit and be a good stick. Tubing a board, or progressing poorly through the upgrading syllabus will do you no favors. Granted, based on timing there are those that get selected to be IPs that you may scratch your head over, but by and large we as a community do well to select those that should be the IPs and have the most experience and proficiency in the aircraft. A skipper once said to me, that he was leery of any pilot in his squadron that did not want to be an IP, and become a better pilot. I think this is more important than ever with the decrease in real experience (flight hours) and more reliance on systems knowledge, HAZREP review and Pilot training/wardroom discussions. Bottom line, don't drop the pack, get in the Job Aid, NATOPs, and be proactive in engaging the senior pilots in your squadron on your JQR/P3PQS, don't fall off the curve!

WRT to the community: I am completing my disassociated tour now, with 3 community tours under my belt, and I can honestly say that I am happy with the direction we are going in. Sure, there are items that can be improved, but the rest of the Fleet values our services and our diverse mission sets. Nothing is better than getting to that final qual as aircraft commander, and taking a crew. That is what all the pain, sweat, and tears is for. Enjoy it while it lasts, there is nothing like it.

John

So are you going VP, VPU, or VQ? I work with mostly VPU and enjoy the heck out of it. I've had dealings with VQ and it's not the same. If I was to re-enlist today with a choice of VPU or VQ it would be VPU.

 

[scoober78]

Oh, and Curacao is home to the largest legal brothel in the world - Campo Alegre.... :icon_tong (Alas, officially off-limits to US personnel.)

Key word, tricky phrase there...

 

[IRfly]

A note of caution--don't get too wound up around the per diem. On a desert deployment you'll spend more than your $3.50/day on your three beers in the Bra at Al-Udeid suffering through Air Force karaoke night. In Iraq, you'll spend more than $3.50 a day trying to feed yourself because the chow hall is on Halliburton hours while you're flying 24/7. And no booze at all in Iraq. Internet and other entertainment is spotty in both places, but worse in Iraq. The flying is pretty boring for the pilots in Iraq and you won't get your quals on time. If you're a 3P you won't even get to land the plane. Bottom line: join the community because there's something about MPR that appeals to you beyond the dollar signs of per diem (mostly) in days gone by...

 

[billiken2002]

The flying is pretty boring for the pilots in Iraq and you won't get your quals on time.

I've heard the missions are really cool there. Yes, not much yanking and banking for the pilots, but I've heard IP's talk about seeing some really cool stuff. And as far as quals, isn't that the point of dets to Japan and whatnot, a crew must maintain their readiness, and that means they have to practice and not just continuously fly the mission.

Plus, for upgrading events, its not as hard to get those flights done as it is to get the minimum hours for upgrade. In Iraq, you should get your hours.

 

[KTBQ]

Come fly 40 or 50 missions and see how cool they really are. You're in for a real treat.

 

[red_ryder]

*taps window of sarcasm gauge*

 

[othromas]

I've heard the missions are really cool there. Yes, not much yanking and banking for the pilots, but I've heard IP's talk about seeing some really cool stuff. And as far as quals, isn't that the point of dets to Japan and whatnot, a crew must maintain their readiness, and that means they have to practice and not just continuously fly the mission.

Plus, for upgrading events, its not as hard to get those flights done as it is to get the minimum hours for upgrade. In Iraq, you should get your hours.

What your IPs were probably talking about was stuff that they did a few years ago. The missions are NOT as cool anymore. Yes, you can get a ton of hours, but as my PPC said the other day, there is a gigantic difference between turning dinosaurs into noise at altitude burning circles in the sky and yanking and banking down low rigging ships and doing ASW. I'm glad for the flight time, but would much rather be rigging some ships.

Incidentally, I hate KBR with a black, unutterable passion. :icon_rage

 

[IRfly]

I've heard the missions are really cool there. Yes, not much yanking and banking for the pilots, but I've heard IP's talk about seeing some really cool stuff. And as far as quals, isn't that the point of dets to Japan and whatnot, a crew must maintain their readiness, and that means they have to practice and not just continuously fly the mission.

Plus, for upgrading events, its not as hard to get those flights done as it is to get the minimum hours for upgrade. In Iraq, you should get your hours.

<shrug> You'll see. Let me know how that det to Japan from Tallil turns out :sleep_125.
One good thing about Iraq is that you'll get some company for your lonesome little National Defense medal. If you get stuck in the Deid for a whole deployment, even that goes out the window.

P.S. I, too, hate KBR.

(By the way, the contrast in what your IP's tell you and what now actually is illustrates the ever-changing nature of VP aviation. What was two years ago is not now. What is now may not be two years from now.)

 

[nvrg1vup]

Are EP-3's in the VQ's seeing as large of reduction of flight hours as the VP and VPU guys? I'm interested in the EP-3 gig. If someone could PM me about it up there and doesn't mind a few q's that'd be cool.