Pitching Deck Carrier Landing Vid

[A4sForever]

....We usually had quite a bit of dudes on the LSO platform, up to 7-9 as I recall. Lets see, CAG paddles, LSO for glideslope, LSO for line-up, one guy calling the deck, another guy timing the groove length and usually another 3 or 4 watching.

Totally UNSAT.

And dangerous, as well ... you just get in each others way and block the view. No wonder the LSO's need someone to watch line-up, etc., etc. Even discounting the accident potential when everyone is falling all over each other tryin' to escape the fireball or broken arresting gear wire whipping across the deck -- way too many people.

I suspect that the PLATFORM still has the same dimensions ...

Professional, working PLATFORM population:

1. Controlling LSO (mebbe qual'ed, mebbe under training ...)
2. Air Wing LSO (supervisory/"controlling" in reality ...)
3. Book writer (LSO under training ...)
4. Phone talker (EM from the Air Department ...)
5. Observer (mebbe ....)
6. Observer (mebbe ....)

That's it -- usually shrink the "observers" by one @ night.

 

[Schnugg]

That was a rough day recovery for them...

Now for the Varsity Team...try that at night.

 

[bunk22]

Totally UNSAT.

And dangerous, as well ... you just get in each others way and block the view. No wonder the LSO's need someone to watch line-up, etc., etc. Even discounting the accident potential when everyone is falling all over each other tryin' to escape the fireball or broken arresting gear wire whipping across the deck -- way too many people.

I suspect that the PLATFORM still has the same dimensions ...

Professional, working PLATFORM population:

1. Controlling LSO (mebbe qual'ed, mebbe under training ...)
2. Air Wing LSO (supervisory/"controlling" in reality ...)
3. Book writer (LSO under training ...)
4. Phone talker (EM from the Air Department ...)
5. Observer (mebbe ....)
6. Observer (mebbe ....)

That's it -- usually shrink the "observers" by one @ night.

I forgot, one of the other 2-3 is the book writer. We also had the enlisted phone talker as well. It got croweded at times with a full team out there. CAG paddles would rotate us all through the pickle throughout the day.

 

[BigIron]

........Once watched their tour guide (a shooter who should have known better) try to march several of them under the cans of a Prowler the same way you see directors do with Hornets. Problem with that is the Prowler's can are canted downward. They all got blown into the deck with several resultant cases of road rash.

Unsat.

These DVs have to be managed. They think it's Disney, and I understand the fascination/gee whiz factor. I'm still impressed with it.

I agree that Vulture's Row is the place for them to watch, although they can come down on deck if it's a coordinated effort with PriFly. I take folks out starboard frame 84 or so and have them stand on near the point well behind the shot line for cat 1 (near the deckedge station). If they are going to watch the recovery, I take them out port frame 250 or so and have them stand near the finger or el 4. If something is turning back there, or they need to move aircraft back there, I won't bring DVs back there at all. I personally don't have them go to the LSO platform as it is standing room only usually.

 

[Junkball]

Question: Why don't they mount the ball/lens system on a stabilized platform?

 

[nzachman]

Question: Why don't they mount the ball/lens system on a stabilized platform?

You mean like a hydraulic system that stays level even when the deck is pitching?

 

[A4sForever]

Question: Why don't they mount the ball/lens system on a stabilized platform?

"They" do ... sometimes the conditions put the ball out of limits, however. Then you get a "WO-P/D" for the pass .....

A couple of short links (Google is your friend):

Fresnel Lens Optical Landing System (FLOLS)

History & Future of Carrrier Landing Visual System(s)

 

[brownshoe]

That was a rough day recovery for them...

Now for the Varsity Team...try that at night.

Been there and worked the deck both day and night. We did a CQ Det aboard the Indy out of Norfolk. We were in the middle of the Atlantic during winter; seas were really rough. Those poor sailors on the “tin can” escort probably hadn’t had a hot meal since we put out. We did get everyone qual’d, and it was the coldest I’d EVER been in my life.

Believe me the crew of the Indy were glad to see us go. Worse time I’d ever spent at sea while in VA-44. Ah, the sweet life… the Gulf aboard the Lex. I only had sea legs for my four years. You that have retired, or those that had/have more years in than me have surly experienced worse.

We had to leave the ship at night, and went down the aft ladder to a sea going tug, which took us back to the harbor. Now that WAS an experience… I’m afraid of heights; didn’t like going down that ladder, and was afraid while working any deck. (My head was always on a swivel.) But I wouldn’t trade any of my time aboard a carrier for anything else during my time here… so far 61 years.

Steve

 

[Fly Navy]

The sea don't look that rough.. But the deck's moving.

Common misconception. The sea's don't have to be too "rough" for the boat to pitch like that. It's all about the frequency of the swells, due to the long moment arm of the ship.

 

[phantomphixer82]

I donn't care what any one says, but I would rather have my brown jersy on running all over the flight deck waiting for my birds to return to the barn than to land them there. Much respect seen it pretty rough, especialy in the North Atlantic.

 

[ProwlerPilot]

Totally UNSAT.

And dangerous, as well ... you just get in each others way and block the view. No wonder the LSO's need someone to watch line-up, etc., etc. Even discounting the accident potential when everyone is falling all over each other tryin' to escape the fireball or broken arresting gear wire whipping across the deck -- way too many people.

I suspect that the PLATFORM still has the same dimensions ...

Professional, working PLATFORM population:

1. Controlling LSO (mebbe qual'ed, mebbe under training ...)
2. Air Wing LSO (supervisory/"controlling" in reality ...)
3. Book writer (LSO under training ...)
4. Phone talker (EM from the Air Department ...)
5. Observer (mebbe ....)
6. Observer (mebbe ....)

That's it -- usually shrink the "observers" by one @ night.

While I agree to an extent on your observation, more people = more potential for mishap casualties, the "min crew" on a platform will still be at least 3, but never for a full cyclic recovery. Mainly for a bag ex and or "LSO proficiency" as we like to call it.

As for fleet operations, every recovery will include:

1. Controlling (obviously)
2. Backup (in charge of lineup / WOD / Gear and lense settings / glidelope)
3. CAG paddles (supervising and making sure 1 and 2 don't kill anyone)
4. Writer (junior typically to learn)
5. Deck caller (100 ft / 10 ft window determination to aviod another S-3 / Prowler incident)
6. Groove timer / observer. (Day only)
7. Observer
8. Girl from reactor division for date night (optional)

Obviously 6 and 7 are not necessary, taking the platform down to 5 (not including the 2 enlisted)

The reason we rarely kick the 6 and 7 off though is because they are part of the wave team and are there to learn or if senior to back up the rookies controlling / etc.

RAG / TRACOM CQ dets are a whole different story and it is like a parade in a phone booth up there. We could definitely bring those numbers down a bit, but typically you will have at least 2 LSO's from every squadron flying up there.

Overall, good or bad, the tendancy is to get LSO's as much "eye" exposure on the platform as possible and to use every recovery on a wave day to train. Safe or stupid, the nights that are most difficult is when the peanut gallery is learning the most. I have found that the peanut gallery is not the ones getting in the way of the LSO's view. The Prowler on the finger is the main culprit there!

 

[A4sForever]

..... the "min crew" on a platform will still be at least 3, but never for a full cyclic recovery.....

Yeah, whenever we rigged for an "emergency" recovery (especially at night) ... I would kick everyone OFF of the PLATFORM save for one back-up LSO/book writer/2nd pair of eyes, the enlisted phone-talker/hook spotter, and of course ... yours truly, holding the PICKLE and doing my best voice-over of "Chuck Yeager the LSO".

3 guys total. The 3 Amigos ...

Forewarned was forearmed in that case, just IN case the shit hit the fan. Too many bodies on the PLATFORM is never a good thing ... too much opportunity for distraction, confusion, grab-assing, inattention.

I guess that's why they call it "too many".

 

[phantomphixer82]

Found an old video of my old squadron VF-74 in the 70's doing air ops, never seen the signal lights that were on the deck in one of the shots, or if they were signal lights. they looked to be on the sarboard side on the flight deck, and retracted. Saw video on you tube.

youtube-f4 phantom us navy

 

[bolterking]

Totally UNSAT.

And dangerous, as well ... you just get in each others way and block the view. No wonder the LSO's need someone to watch line-up, etc., etc. Even discounting the accident potential when everyone is falling all over each other tryin' to escape the fireball or broken arresting gear wire whipping across the deck -- way too many people.

I suspect that the PLATFORM still has the same dimensions ...

Professional, working PLATFORM population:

1. Controlling LSO (mebbe qual'ed, mebbe under training ...)
2. Air Wing LSO (supervisory/"controlling" in reality ...)
3. Book writer (LSO under training ...)
4. Phone talker (EM from the Air Department ...)
5. Observer (mebbe ....)
6. Observer (mebbe ....)

That's it -- usually shrink the "observers" by one @ night.

That in your personal professional opinion? or what the current school house recommendation

 

[A4sForever]

That in your personal professional opinion? or what the current school house recommendation

What do you think??

Here's a story problem for you: I'm going into town and get a Starbuck's ... you tell me the answer when I return.