PRK & BDCP Decision

[sundevil_av8r]

Thanks to both of you guys - I'll tell my OR that so he can look up the right paperwork or whatnot.

In regards to sundevil


Did you get pro-rec, prk, waiver, final selected (in that order)? How long ago was this?

i posted my story earlier but here is some more detail:

i was pro-rec'd SNA BDCP Sept 2006. i went to MEPS and applied for SCL waiver in November. The SCL waiver was rescinded before I was approved. In Dec, the Navy pitched me the same SNFO deal with the Navy-funded PRK and possibility of a transfer to SNA. I respectfully declined and got PRK in Jan 2007. BTW, the civilian at the recruiting office told me that the Navy would not hold my pro-rec and that I would have to completely re-apply.

Three months later, the last week in April, I called the recruiter to find out what I needed to do to re-apply. He asked if I could drop off my paper work ASAP and of course I did. He overnighted it and within a few days I was "waiver recommended" by some Navy Captain. as nugget81 said, you don't actually get your waiver approved until NAMI can see you in person.

in the first week of May, so less than a week after I dropped off the paperwork, I got a call from my recruiter who asked me if I was sitting down. I said yes and he then told me, "your waiver has been recommended, can you got to OCS on May 19?" WHAT?!?!?! i still had finals to complete, graduation, a job to quit, and less than two weeks get ready to move from Arizona to Florida for OCS.

I made it happen and the rest is history. i know this was a lot of info but i took the time to write it so that everyone who is going through the application process can see what the Navy CAN DO. yes there are guidelines and instructions on recruiting. but the bottom line is if you have a good recruiter who is willing to work for you, things can get done. the only recommendation i have for all of the applicants dealing with these issues is this:

be as professional and respectful as you can. show your recruiter how serious you are about doing this, and let him/her know you are willing to jump through whatever hoops necessary to achieve that final select. make them want to work hard to get you in the Navy because they need people with that kind of dedication.

good luck to you all, and if you have any more questions let me know.

 

[nugget61]

Ok, I know that at this point I have totally jacked this thread. My bad.

Just talked to the OR. Because I passed everything at MEPS/got it done at a civ place, my MEDDOCS have been submitted and accepted. Unfortunately as I have said before, MEPS gave me better eyesight than I have. My OR is trying to gather info on getting PRK now and having the FS wait on me, getting it after the FS and before OCS and also after OCS. Pretty much called him out on it, and it came out that if I get it done after OCS then I'm pretty much guaranteed SWO for 3-4 years before I'm eligible for a lateral transfer. Not excited about that. Also, everyone on here says that you can't get it after the FS and before OCS. So that leave now, before the FS. My OR is really worked up that ~60% of this fiscal year's SNA slots have already been given out, and says that if I get the PRK now then I will lose the slot (as far as he knows now).
So my gut is saying go against his advice and get the PRK next week, wait out the time (which he says is 6 months because NAMI guide doesn't apply to applicants, WTF, instead of what should be 3 months) and either sign the letter if they hold it or reapply. But I'm hoping that those of you that know better can advise me on this.

*Edit: Read sundevil's post that was made while I was typing - I'm even more inclined now to just get the surgery and do what has to be done. My main difference is that I've passed MEPS uncorrected though, so the Navy doesn't see the need for PRK.
Thanks.

 

[sundevil_av8r]

My recruiter was quoting the 6-month wait as well (that's 6 months after you're released from the doctor's care). According to several posts here, 3 months would have been my wait period instead because my correction is like -3.00 diopters in each eye. I'm waiting on some paperwork BS for me to sign the BDCP SNFO contract but this review is really making me want to get the surgery done and reapply.

i may be reading this wrong, but if you still want to be a pilot then get the surgery!!! i know people that were talked into SNFO when they really wanted SNA. don't let this happen to you if your dream is to be a pilot.

 

[sundevil_av8r]

Ok, I know that at this point I have totally jacked this thread. My bad.

Just talked to the OR. Because I passed everything at MEPS/got it done at a civ place, my MEDDOCS have been submitted and accepted. Unfortunately as I have said before, MEPS gave me better eyesight than I have. My OR is trying to gather info on getting PRK now and having the FS wait on me, getting it after the FS and before OCS and also after OCS. Pretty much called him out on it, and it came out that if I get it done after OCS then I'm pretty much guaranteed SWO for 3-4 years before I'm eligible for a lateral transfer. Not excited about that. Also, everyone on here says that you can't get it after the FS and before OCS. So that leave now, before the FS. My OR is really worked up that ~60% of this fiscal year's SNA slots have already been given out, and says that if I get the PRK now then I will lose the slot (as far as he knows now).
So my gut is saying go against his advice and get the PRK next week, wait out the time (which he says is 6 months because NAMI guide doesn't apply to applicants, WTF, instead of what should be 3 months) and either sign the letter if they hold it or reapply. But I'm hoping that those of you that know better can advise me on this.

*Edit: Read sundevil's post that was made while I was typing - I'm even more inclined now to just get the surgery and do what has to be done. My main difference is that I've passed MEPS uncorrected though, so the Navy doesn't see the need for PRK.
Thanks.

what is your vision? is it 20/25 or is it 20/40? how bad exactly?

i wouldn't get the surgery without coordinating with the recruiter. that wouldn't be very smart. i haven't heard of anyone getting PRK after FS. there was a guy in my OCS class that showed up and didn't pass, and was offered to NPQ or SNFO, he took SNFO.

have you told your recruiter that people have done it in 3 months? i think he needs to talk to someone at NAMI, after all he isn't the one who signs the waivers.

 

[nugget61]

what is your vision? is it 20/25 or is it 20/40? how bad exactly?

i wouldn't get the surgery without coordinating with the recruiter. that wouldn't be very smart. i haven't heard of anyone getting PRK after FS. there was a guy in my OCS class that showed up and didn't pass, and was offered to NPQ or SNFO, he took SNFO.

have you told your recruiter that people have done it in 3 months? i think he needs to talk to someone at NAMI, after all he isn't the one who signs the waivers.

I'm 20/40 uncorrected, using both eyes, squinting for all I'm worth. 20/70R, 20/100L no squinting. I didn't know squinting was illegal, so I don't want to do it at OCS and can't at NAMI.
My OR said "that's the internet, you can't trust that"... he said he has feelers out and is hoping to hear back within the next 2 weeks. However, if I don't get the surgery next week then I won't have free time to do it until Feb... so I have a large fire lit under my OR.

 

[sundevil_av8r]

http://navmedmpte.med.navy.mil/nomi.../pdfs/Waiver Guide - Ophthalmology 080624.pdf


Ophthalmology Page 21.

PRK:
General guidelines:
1. A waiver may be submitted no earlier than:
a. 3 months for myopia less than -6.00 diopters spherical equivalent (SE)
b. 6 months for myopia greater than or equal to -6.00 diopters SE
c. 6 months for hyperopia (SE) measured under cycloplegia

2. Visual Acuity - each eye with or without corrective lenses must be:
a. Class I - 20/20-0/10 letters
b. Class II and III - 20/20-3/10 letters or better
c. Corrective lenses must be worn while flying if needed to achieve the VA standard
3. A normal postoperative slit lamp exam
4. There must be no symptoms that would be cause for concern when considering the
performance of the member’s usual flight duties
5. If topical medication is still required (other than artificial tears), then restriction of flight
activities to the local area would be prudent.
6. An enhancement or “touch-up” must meet the same guidelines.

Additional guidelines:

Applicants:
1. May obtain PRK at their expense from civilian sources of care.
2. Pre-operative refractive error measured under cycloplegia must not exceed - 8.00 to +
3.00 (SE) and 3.00 diopters of cylinder.
3. Anisometropia should not exceed 3.50 diopters (using SE for each eye).
4. SNA applicants must meet refractive, cycloplegic, and vision standards postoperatively.

Active duty designated aviation personnel:
1. Shall be treated at a DOD refractive surgery center.
2. Following review and endorsement by two local flight surgeons, and an optometrist or
ophthalmologist and concurrence of the commanding officer, the CRS/PRK AMS
template may serve as a LBFS and a 90-day aeromedical clearance notice may be issued.
3. The flight surgeon shall submit the completed CRS AMS in accordance with the instructions located on the top of the form.



Notice that the time requirements are under GENERAL Guidelines. Nowhere under the additional requirements does it say that a Non-Designated Aviator has to wait 6 months.

 

[sundevil_av8r]

I'm 20/40 uncorrected, using both eyes, squinting for all I'm worth. 20/70R, 20/100L no squinting. I didn't know squinting was illegal, so I don't want to do it at OCS and can't at NAMI.
My OR said "that's the internet, you can't trust that"... he said he has feelers out and is hoping to hear back within the next 2 weeks. However, if I don't get the surgery next week then I won't have free time to do it until Feb... so I have a large fire lit under my OR.

if it is that bad, then you need the surgery. show your recruiter what i just posted. it is from NAMI's website. if he doesn't trust the waiver guide posted on NAMI's website, then you need to find another recruiter. ask him to call NAMI directly. any flight surgeon there will have the answer for him. and that would take 5 min, not 2 weeks.

 

[nugget61]

Mr OR says that the only part of that that applies to me is the specifically listed "Applicant" section(as you bolded), so hes good with the "applicant - any surgery = 6 months" in his OR book. However, thats not the current problem - I'll have 3 months to work that point into him. I just need to get him onboard with PRK right away. He wants me to wait to see if I can keep my slot open while I heal, but I don't see it that way. I told him that I'm not going to sign the FS letter until I can read the 20/40 line so I don't get redesignated. So if they hold it, great, if not, then I'll reapply. I don't understand why he wants me to wait.

Edit: Yeah, I've shown him that and he flat out said that nothing in the NAMI guide applies to me unless it specially says "applicant". I tried to politely call BS, but he won't listen.

 

[sundevil_av8r]

sounds like you have a stubborn recruiter. he should be willing to call NAMI directly and find out.

he wants you to wait because he has a quota he wants to fill. it's good you told him you wouldn't sign until you were ready. you have to do what is right for you.

when do you graduate? do you have to get the surgery now or could you wait until february?

 

[nugget61]

sounds like you have a stubborn recruiter. he should be willing to call NAMI directly and find out.

he wants you to wait because he has a quota he wants to fill. it's good you told him you wouldn't sign until you were ready. you have to do what is right for you.

when do you graduate? do you have to get the surgery now or could you wait until february?

Funny you should mention the quotas thing... I was getting difficult on the phone with him and he jumped into the hurt used car salesman thing, saying he'd never push me, hes not into quotas yadayadayada. I'm not thrilled with him.
I graduate in August 09, so I can wait till Feb, but I don't want to for a few reasons: If I have to wait 6 months, that pushes me till after graduation to reapply; my Pro-Rec definitely won't wait that long(assuming it will at all); If I reapply and don't get in BDCP I can turn around the next month and reapply direct - but not after I grad. Not to mention that I don't want to sit and not be proactive till then.

As a side note, was there any pre-op paperwork for the navy or did you just have to have the numbers taken by the doc to go on the waiver?

 

[TTUalumn07]

I'm sure I'll need surgery....my eyes are terrible. 20/25.

But are there waivers?

 

[nugget61]

I'm sure I'll need surgery....my eyes are terrible. 20/25.

But are there waivers?

You've left too many doors open about your eyes and not being able to read, but alas, nothing witty comes to mind. 20/25 (in each eye) is damn near perfect = no waiver required.

 

[TTUalumn07]

You've left too many doors open about your eyes and not being able to read, but alas, nothing witty comes to mind. 20/25 (in each eye) is damn near perfect = no waiver required.

Actually it's 20/20L and 20/25R...and my DP was good too. Alas...yes I leave myself open for alot of witty remarks...but I try to type and close the window...my boss would rather me do this thing called work....I don't know what he means.

 

[nugget61]

Actually it's 20/20L and 20/25R...and my DP was good too. Alas...yes I leave myself open for alot of witty remarks...but I try to type and close the window...my boss would rather me do this thing called work....I don't know what he means.

Work? Psh.
Your distant acuity is fine. As long as your near and color vision is fine then your eyes are good to go.

 

[sundevil_av8r]

Funny you should mention the quotas thing... I was getting difficult on the phone with him and he jumped into the hurt used car salesman thing, saying he'd never push me, hes not into quotas yadayadayada. I'm not thrilled with him.
I graduate in August 09, so I can wait till Feb, but I don't want to for a few reasons: If I have to wait 6 months, that pushes me till after graduation to reapply; my Pro-Rec definitely won't wait that long(assuming it will at all); If I reapply and don't get in BDCP I can turn around the next month and reapply direct - but not after I grad. Not to mention that I don't want to sit and not be proactive till then.

As a side note, was there any pre-op paperwork for the navy or did you just have to have the numbers taken by the doc to go on the waiver?

i can see why you wouldn't want to wait. but if that is what you have to do to appease your recruiter then so be it. even if you have to completely reapply next August, the process will be quick since you already have the packet put together. it sucks, but in the end a few months isn't going to make a difference.

i didn't have to do any pre-op paperwork. you are going to have a lot of paperwork from your surgery and all the info they need is on there.