Sen. Schumer gas for electric car trade in program?

[nodropinufaka]

Because science and economics. If you could not measure the performance of a financial investment, would you keep pouring money into it? The only way you could do so was pure unadulterated hope. Not a good basis for science or economic policy.

Does it?

You can't just do it for yourself and think "hey this is prob better then using single use plastics", maybe I should be less wasteful, and try my best to recycle.

You know- if for the sheer fact that beaches are literally covered in microplastics and a garbage patch the size of Texas floating in the ocean.

Does their have to be a economic or scientific policy attached for human beings to just act better?

 

[wink]

Does it?

You can't just do it for yourself and think "hey this is prob better then using single use plastics", maybe I should be less wasteful, and try my best to recycle.

You know- if for the sheer fact that beaches are literally covered in microplastics and a garbage patch the size of Texas floating in the ocean.

Does their have to be a economic or scientific policy attached for human beings to just act better?

So do it to feel good about yourself? No evidence it makes a dent, but boy we feel good about ourselves. Don't think you meant that way, but it is the way it sounds.

I feel good when I KNOW I am making a measurable difference. I don't "adopt" starving kids in Africa in exchange for a thank you card. I give money to the local food bank and get a charge out of hearing thank you from a person I simply served some Chilli Mac to.

 

[nodropinufaka]

So do it to feel good about yourself? No evidence it makes a dent, but boy we feel good about ourselves. Don't think you meant that way, but it is the way it sounds.

I feel good when I KNOW I am making a measurable difference. I don't "adopt" starving kids in Africa in exchange for a thank you card. I give money to the local food bank and get a charge out of hearing thank you from a person I simply served some Chilli Mac to.

No evidence it makes a dent? Feel good?

there is literally a patch of plastic and floating garbage the size of Texas in the ocean.

beaches in California and hawaii are covered in micro plastics.

do you need some kind of peer reviewed evidence to see that single use plastics and over consumption is to blame?

 

[Treetop Flyer]

No evidence it makes a dent? Feel good?

there is literally a patch of plastic and floating garbage the size of Texas in the ocean.

beaches in California and hawaii are covered in micro plastics.

do you need some kind of peer reviewed evidence to see that single use plastics and over consumption is to blame?

Where is that plastic in the garbage patch coming from? It’s not my straw from Dallas

 

[nodropinufaka]

Where is that plastic in the garbage patch coming from? It’s not my straw from Dallas

so it has to be directly from you?

You do realize if enough people cut back on consuming single use plastics the market will change and production will shift to more sustainable methods.

But most people view it like you- not my problem and I didn't do it.

So because it doesn't affect you and where you live is fine then it doesn't matter.

 

[Spekkio]

so it has to be directly from you?

You do realize if enough people cut back on consuming single use plastics the market will change and production will shift to more sustainable methods.

But most people view it like you- not my problem and I didn't do it.

So because it doesn't affect you and where you live is fine then it doesn't matter.

Can you explain the mechanism by which plastic in the ocean changes the Earth's temperature?

 

[SELRES_AMDO]

Can you explain the mechanism by which plastic in the ocean changes the Earth's temperature?

Do you think plastic floating around the ocean is a good thing? Do you think the beaches covered in micro plastics is fine?

Single use plastic is terrible for the environment. Why does it need to be tied to the Earth's temperature in order for it to be bad?

 

[Spekkio]

Do you think plastic floating around the ocean is a good thing? Do you think the beaches covered in micro plastics is fine?

No I don't. Please follow along here: I don't know why we should care about climate change. If plastics in the ocean doesn't cause climate change, then clearly that's outside the scope of my position.

 

[nodropinufaka]

No I don't. Please follow along here: I don't know why we should care about climate change. If plastics in the ocean doesn't cause climate change, then clearly that's outside the scope of my position.

Why should we care about climate change?

I guess the real question is- why should we not care?

 

[wink]

Single use plastic is terrible for the environment. Why does it need to be tied to the Earth's temperature in order for it to be bad?

Not so horrible at all if disposed of properly.

It doesn't have to affect me directly to be concerned. We were talking about people doing something that has an impact. My plastic use does not affect debris in the ocean. Again, it seems like the solution is outsize the problem. Instead of focusing on single use consumer products reduction, start with proper disposal. Then move on to things like packaging. People navel gaze too much. Plastics in the ocean are not primarily an American problem. Manufacturing and packaging waste is a bigger deal than me using a paper plate this evening. Two thirds of landfill material is construction and landscape organic waste, not residential. I don't begrudge anyone using a metal straw or cloth napkins. I'll make my contributions in other ways.

 

[Swanee]

Not so horrible at all if disposed of properly.

It doesn't have to affect me directly to be concerned. We were talking about people doing something that has an impact. My plastic use does not affect debris in the ocean. Again, it seems like the solution is outsize the problem. Instead of focusing on single use consumer products reduction, start with proper disposal. Then move on to things like packaging. People navel gaze too much. Plastics in the ocean are not primarily an American problem. Manufacturing and packaging waste is a bigger deal than me using a paper plate this evening. Two thirds of landfill material is construction and landscape organic waste, not residential. I don't begrudge anyone using a metal straw or cloth napkins. I'll make my contributions in other ways.

1. That you know of- curbside recycling in this country is a sham, and most of it is sent to other countries where they dump it in the ocean.

2. I agree with you, this is a production problem. A packaging problem.

3. I like electric cars, and lithium batteries are cool. But I understand that the power has to be generated somehow, and lithium mines can be really bad for the environment, and they take way more water than one would think in order to operate- and those mines aren't generally in places that have easy access to water. So, lithium mining causing droughts in places where the temperature is increasing and rainfall is decreasing and droughts are already a problem... that doesn't really add up as a solution. And methane emissions would be through the roof if we all traded in our cars for horses and buggies.


Trains are still pretty efficient, all things considered- but I'm not sure America will ever spend the money to get on board with high speed rail like China has.

 

[Treetop Flyer]

so it has to be directly from you?

You do realize if enough people cut back on consuming single use plastics the market will change and production will shift to more sustainable methods.

But most people view it like you- not my problem and I didn't do it.

So because it doesn't affect you and where you live is fine then it doesn't matter.

Yes. I’m one of those crazy people that wants solutions to the actual problem instead of virtue signaling nonsense. My plastic goes in a landfill, not the ocean.

 

[nodropinufaka]

Yes. I’m one of those crazy people that wants solutions to the actual problem instead of virtue signaling nonsense. My plastic goes in a landfill, not the ocean.

So what happens when the landfill fills up?

Then you will decide that you could have not been wasteful?

 

[Treetop Flyer]

So what happens when the landfill fills up?

Then you will decide that you could have not been wasteful?

What will happen when your argument gets blown to bits? You’ll shift to something else.

 

[wink]

That you know of- curbside recycling in this country is a sham, and most of it is sent to other countries where they dump it in the ocean.

I believe that today little recycling is sent overseas. All the big importers have banned it. That is why so many programs are failing. In my very large metro area the company Waste Management no longer picks up recycling on commercial accounts because it is not profitable, mostly due to abuse and ignorance by users.

In my city I know for a fact curbside recycling is not exported. Moreover, about all I recycle are brown corrugated boxes and aluminum cans. That is where the money, environmental and energy savings are. My plastic straws, scrap wood and grocery bags are buried in a safe lined landfill.