Stupid Questions about Naval Aviation (Part 3)

[A4sForever]

Also called an "Oscar Pattern." Not sure a) why they have different names and b) what happened to the S-2 pattern.

Yeah, really ... we did an S-1 (Yoke Pattern?) , and an S-3, but no S-2 ... I guess the S-2 must have been too dangerous ???

BTW ... you boys DO them under the bag in the bird, do you not ... ???

 

[MIDNJAC]

Sorry, meant to say S-1 originally for the comparison. Shows how much I retained from either maneuver.....

 

[BarrettRC8]

This one comes from another thread:

What is an S-3 pattern?

Like has already been mentioned, it's an instrument exercise meant to develop your scan. Not too difficult in the Alpha where you can match up movement between the clock and the large altimeter needle with a bit of practice. I'm not sure how the straight-Charlie guys were able to do it with any precision though.

BTW ... you boys DO them under the bag in the bird, do you not ... ???

Indeed. Thrilled I'll not have to see one of those again. And while we're on the topic... I've got my last advanced dual instrument flight this afternoon.

:thumbup_1

 

[phrogdriver]

Do skids on a helo have a design reasoning vice wheels? Or just a simple solution kept from the original helos?

Since helos can hover taxi, they can maneuver about the flightline without wheels. In smaller helos, it's not worth the added complexity, weight, and risk of failure to put wheels on. As helos get bigger, it's no longer safe to be hovering 15000+ pounds of wind machine around the line, so the tradeoff becomes worthwhile.

 

[MIDNJAC]

Like has already been mentioned, it's an instrument exercise meant to develop your scan. Not too difficult in the Alpha where you can match up movement between the clock and the large altimeter needle with a bit of practice. I'm not sure how the straight-Charlie guys were able to do it with any precision though.

The digital A/S and altimeter readouts on the DDI's had analog style gauge representations around them, ie, there was still a needle and circle to reference. Accuracy I'd guess was actually better, since we had instantaneous vertical velocity as well. Yeah you are using straight numbers if referencing the HUD, but nobody let you do that in BI sims.

 

[Gatordev]

Yeah, really ... we did an S-1 (Yoke Pattern?) , and an S-3, but no S-2 ... I guess the S-2 must have been too dangerous ???

BTW ... you boys DO them under the bag in the bird, do you not ... ???

What is this "bag" you speak of?

 

[jazzdude]

I thought S-1 was straight ahead, S-2 was constant SR turn, and S-3 was a turn reversal when you transitioned from climb/descent or vice versa.

 

[Pags]

Since helos can hover taxi, they can maneuver about the flightline without wheels. In smaller helos, it's not worth the added complexity, weight, and risk of failure to put wheels on. As helos get bigger, it's no longer safe to be hovering 15000+ pounds of wind machine around the line, so the tradeoff becomes worthwhile.

As the weight of a helo goes up, the amount of downwash it produces goes up as well. So a little TH-57 generates a stiff breeze, a 60 can blow people over if they're not braced and a 53 generates hurricane force winds. An air taxiing 53 can cause a lot of damage, so bigger helos have wheels so they don't generate as much downwash when they conduct ground ops.

 

[eas7888]

As the weight of a helo goes up, the amount of downwash it produces goes up as well. So a little TH-57 generates a stiff breeze, a 60 can blow people over if they're not braced and a 53 generates hurricane force winds. An air taxiing 53 can cause a lot of damage, so bigger helos have wheels so they don't generate as much downwash when they conduct ground ops.

+1

I've seen plenty of people blown over by a CH-47. . . Myself being one of them :-( That was an embarrassing moment. That was my first, and only sling loading experience. I kind of wish I had the opportunity to do it again.

 

[gotta_fly]

It's like a double rainbow. Beautiful to watch, but what does it mean? You'll be able to fall asleep while you do it after your 11TH BI sim in T45s. It's actually a half SRT with a reversal at the beginning of the second descent, though...just in case you're so bored that you jump into a sim and blow your mind trying it with a srt.

If you really want a good nap, try it out in the T-44 traveling at half the speed of smell. That pattern, plus another that I think is native to Corpus, account for too many hours of my life that I'll never get back. Oh and the only thing more mind-numbing than flying them? Sitting in the right seat 'monitoring' them.

 

[usmarinemike]

If you really want a good nap, try it out in the T-44 traveling at half the speed of smell. That pattern, plus another that I think is native to Corpus, account for too many hours of my life that I'll never get back. Oh and the only thing more mind-numbing than flying them? Sitting in the right seat 'monitoring' them.

Just for shits and giggles, what IAS do you fly them at?

 

[gotta_fly]

I don't remember for sure, it's been a while, but it was probably around 150.

 

[bunk22]

I don't remember for sure, it's been a while, but it was probably around 150.

Not that much quicker in a T-45, we do it at 200 KIAS.

 

[The Phiz]

Like has already been mentioned, it's an instrument exercise meant to develop your scan. Not too difficult in the Alpha where you can match up movement between the clock and the large altimeter needle with a bit of practice. I'm not sure how the straight-Charlie guys were able to do it with any precision though.

I honestly can't tell if you are joking, as I just finished BI's in the charlie, where I thought it was pretty simple. The digital alt is smaller, but still has a sweeping 'needle'... plus the standby...not to mention the VVI. There's plenty of options for a decent scan. Me... I slowly set bank, power and pitch to get the VVI to settle to about 1100 (counter the slow trans or momentum) and let it fall back to 1k/min. Power to adj a/s. Once I got a decent scan going, these were a walk in the park to at least get close on. I thought it was much simpler than in the 34.

Now if you want to see my little stud brain explode, have me shoot that Hi-ILS into MGM... Tacan Arc, off arc inbound ILS to a different location, (not at tacan station), to a MA using a different Tacan. Everytime I try "Request climbout.." and get "Published Climbout"... damn.

 

[BarrettRC8]

I honestly can't tell if you are joking, as I just finished BI's in the charlie, where I thought it was pretty simple. The digital alt is smaller, but still has a sweeping 'needle'... plus the standby...not to mention the VVI. There's plenty of options for a decent scan. Me... I slowly set bank, power and pitch to get the VVI to settle to about 1100 (counter the slow trans or momentum) and let it fall back to 1k/min. Power to adj a/s. Once I got a decent scan going, these were a walk in the park to at least get close on. I thought it was much simpler than in the 34.

Now if you want to see my little stud brain explode, have me shoot that Hi-ILS into MGM... Tacan Arc, off arc inbound ILS to a different location, (not at tacan station), to a MA using a different Tacan. Everytime I try "Request climbout.." and get "Published Climbout"... damn.

I appreciate your input - Next time I'm in BIs I'll be certain to look to you for guidance when I'm struggling and you can describe in detail the numerous options that are available to me to ensure a good scan.