Catmando said:
Ended up with an extra ) in the URL; it really is a great speech...
http://www.sgtmoms.com/data/modules/pbm/rendered/beef.asp
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The layman's Lehman thread
- Thread starter FlyinSpy
- Start date
Ended up with an extra ) in the URL; it really is a great speech...
http://www.sgtmoms.com/data/modules/pbm/rendered/beef.asp
FlyinSpy,
You got any more good speeches like the above?
/Threadjack
You got any more good speeches like the above?
/Threadjack
Spoiled Beef ??
SLIGHT COURSE CORRECTION --- TO SET THE "RECORD" STRAIGHT (what follows ain't pretty --- so don't read it if your feelings are easily bruised) :
I thought about this long and hard after reading "Beef"'s speech on this link --- the link (above) that worked. I didn't want to put this on the thread --- thought about doing it to you via PM --- didn't want to kick the chair out from under your "hero" in front of you and the whole AW world --- but after seeing some of the reaction(s) to "Beef's speech" from others including my own, and based on your earlier post --- I wanted to set the record straight. (BTW ---- Your earlier post offered only one passage re: "Beef" and his COC speech. As such, after reading his "speech" en toto .... I take back my earlier comment that "Beef" had a good point ..... )
The reason?
I know the airline he mentioned --- and I know who sits in the cockpits --- left, right, and back seats --- and I know the history of that airline and who they hire and who they don't .... apparently .... much, much better than your buddy "Beef".
I'm gonna' have to burst your bubble and tell you that "Beef"s speech --- as much as you liked it and to the extent it pertains to airline pilots in general --- and one airline in particular --- is a bunch of crap. Let me repeat that so there is no misunderstanding: a bunch of crap. He shows no respect for those aviators with whom he currently flies and, quite frankly, he shows little knowledge of the pilot group at his airline or whether "they do (or do not) have a history of hiring Single Seat Naval Aviators" (his words). That's absolute crap and incorrect, to boot.
"Beef" states that he choses to "flat out lie" (again, his words) about his background when asked his history in the cockpit brief ??? As in ... when the Captain asks him about his background ? You know: so as to judge the experience level and the anticipated competence of the crew he (the Captain) has to work with .... ???
Let me tell you how it works in my cockpit (and most other guys I know, as well) . If a crew member "lies" to me --- about ANYTHING relating to the cockpit environment or our place in it --- that pilot is history and will be explaining themselves to the Chief Pilot before they even know what hit them. ...... A Chief Pilot who might have even flown single seat tactical. I will agree with one thing "Beef" said in the "airline" portion of his speech ... "why would anyone do that"? Give me a break, "Beef" .... or better yet, go find another job.
I don't like to fly with people who exhibit the attitude of your buddy ... "Beef". A hypothetical : were I to run into an individual in my cockpit with his apparent attitude and disrespect for his co-workers --- it would be the longest flight of his life. Trust me. Wait --- I take that back ... I'd LOVE to get hold of him.
What an fvcking egotist your "hero" is !! I have more respect --- and more use --- for a former light-civilian driver who has a good attitude and does his/her job than your warrior-hero-god-single-seat-Naval-Aviator-who-can't-get-no-satisfaction-"Beef". He evidently can hardly tolerate his co-workers and fellow airline pilots -- you know --- the ones in the job that guys like "Beef" would give their left nut for ... It seems that everyone is "beneath" Beef given his former lofty position in the world. Maybe it's because he's a Naval Aviator and none of the civilian or Air Force shlubs can "understand him" ??? Or his ego ??? Please --- Cry me a river ---- guys with "Beef's" attitude are exactly WHY some airlines DON'T like single-seat aviators .... believe it. His attitude is what gives us a bad reputation among the rest of the non-"single seat Naval Aviator" pilot group.
Or maybe he just doesn't like not being the "CO" anymore ..... ???
When I'm 90 years old --- hell, when I'm 150 years old --- "and someone asks me what I have done with my life" (to use "Beef's" wisdom and words again) --- I will tell them I was a professional aviator most of my adult life.
If pressed ... I'll tell 'em .... a Naval Aviator and an Airline Pilot. Both were great.
No AW smiles for ... "Beef" .... he's overdone.
FlyinSpy said:
SLIGHT COURSE CORRECTION --- TO SET THE "RECORD" STRAIGHT (what follows ain't pretty --- so don't read it if your feelings are easily bruised) :
I thought about this long and hard after reading "Beef"'s speech on this link --- the link (above) that worked. I didn't want to put this on the thread --- thought about doing it to you via PM --- didn't want to kick the chair out from under your "hero" in front of you and the whole AW world --- but after seeing some of the reaction(s) to "Beef's speech" from others including my own, and based on your earlier post --- I wanted to set the record straight. (BTW ---- Your earlier post offered only one passage re: "Beef" and his COC speech. As such, after reading his "speech" en toto .... I take back my earlier comment that "Beef" had a good point ..... )
The reason?
I know the airline he mentioned --- and I know who sits in the cockpits --- left, right, and back seats --- and I know the history of that airline and who they hire and who they don't .... apparently .... much, much better than your buddy "Beef".
I'm gonna' have to burst your bubble and tell you that "Beef"s speech --- as much as you liked it and to the extent it pertains to airline pilots in general --- and one airline in particular --- is a bunch of crap. Let me repeat that so there is no misunderstanding: a bunch of crap. He shows no respect for those aviators with whom he currently flies and, quite frankly, he shows little knowledge of the pilot group at his airline or whether "they do (or do not) have a history of hiring Single Seat Naval Aviators" (his words). That's absolute crap and incorrect, to boot.
"Beef" states that he choses to "flat out lie" (again, his words) about his background when asked his history in the cockpit brief ??? As in ... when the Captain asks him about his background ? You know: so as to judge the experience level and the anticipated competence of the crew he (the Captain) has to work with .... ???
Let me tell you how it works in my cockpit (and most other guys I know, as well) . If a crew member "lies" to me --- about ANYTHING relating to the cockpit environment or our place in it --- that pilot is history and will be explaining themselves to the Chief Pilot before they even know what hit them. ...... A Chief Pilot who might have even flown single seat tactical. I will agree with one thing "Beef" said in the "airline" portion of his speech ... "why would anyone do that"? Give me a break, "Beef" .... or better yet, go find another job.
I don't like to fly with people who exhibit the attitude of your buddy ... "Beef". A hypothetical : were I to run into an individual in my cockpit with his apparent attitude and disrespect for his co-workers --- it would be the longest flight of his life. Trust me. Wait --- I take that back ... I'd LOVE to get hold of him.
What an fvcking egotist your "hero" is !! I have more respect --- and more use --- for a former light-civilian driver who has a good attitude and does his/her job than your warrior-hero-god-single-seat-Naval-Aviator-who-can't-get-no-satisfaction-"Beef". He evidently can hardly tolerate his co-workers and fellow airline pilots -- you know --- the ones in the job that guys like "Beef" would give their left nut for ... It seems that everyone is "beneath" Beef given his former lofty position in the world. Maybe it's because he's a Naval Aviator and none of the civilian or Air Force shlubs can "understand him" ??? Or his ego ??? Please --- Cry me a river ---- guys with "Beef's" attitude are exactly WHY some airlines DON'T like single-seat aviators .... believe it. His attitude is what gives us a bad reputation among the rest of the non-"single seat Naval Aviator" pilot group.
Or maybe he just doesn't like not being the "CO" anymore ..... ???
When I'm 90 years old --- hell, when I'm 150 years old --- "and someone asks me what I have done with my life" (to use "Beef's" wisdom and words again) --- I will tell them I was a professional aviator most of my adult life.
If pressed ... I'll tell 'em .... a Naval Aviator and an Airline Pilot. Both were great.
No AW smiles for ... "Beef" .... he's overdone.
A4sForever said:
At the risk of beating a dead horse, I'll weigh in one last time and then go back to assessing high schooler's chances of getting jets, and the imminent canonization of Chuck Norris....
A4S - love ya man, and your ruminations are one of the reasons I like this forum. But....
You're off-base on this one. Unlike yourself and John L., my knowledge of the man and his character is based on more than a one time good deal hop with him in the back. Beef is one of the finest naval officers, aviators, and all-around good dudes there is. I'd trust him with my life in the cockpit and my wife while on cruise. (Well, a short cruise... I'm very comfortable with his 3K+ hours in the Hornet, plus however many thousands in the bus.) I've worked closely with him professionally and drank with him socially - none finer.
But we're back to my original takeaway about our tendencies to be binary - some things just shouldn't be sorted that way, including judgements of character. Radalts beeping on low levels? Binary. Cold cat strokes? Really binary. Assessment of a man and his career? Need a bit more info for that one, and quickness to judge a man may be one of those things that aren't binary. Now, my perspective may be skewed by the $10 grand I owe him (not true...), and you may be right and I may be a poor judge of character. But I'll take my personal & professional experiences with the man over a quick read of a 5 minute speech.
Bottom line? Look up "good sh!t" in the dictionary and you'll see Beef's picture...
p.s. As far as other speeches, I've always been fond of Lincoln's 2nd Inaugural: http://www.bartleby.com/124/pres32.html
A4sForever said:.... he mentioned that he liked my orange bag on our flight/fight ... he said that you "really stick out in a crowd" with it.
I note with amusement that he later started wearing them almost exclusively instead of his usual green bag. Always lookin' for the advantage ..........
Orange Flight Suits...gotta love it...VF-114 Aardvarks and me. :icon_smil
Schnugg said:
..... Small world --- yeah, VF-114 is where I got my first orange "bag" when they were driving F-4's .... traded a friend in the squadron for something --- can't remember what. The "Varks" were a good squadron --- cocky; much more so than the Blacklions (VF-213) --- but they were good.
And I've never minded cocky --- if you're good ..... I waved them, flew with them, and drank with some of them, but I never had a "Beef" with them .... :icon_wink
Please note the lack of "single-seat" F-4 availability .... *sigh* ..... there MUST be something wrong with these guys, too, and they don't even fly C-5's. E.O.D. (end of discussion -- for me --- on beef --- it's gone rancid ...)