Jan/Feb/Mar Boards

[SodiumLeak]

33/M (10yrs AD all as a cryppie)
CTN1
IW/IP Program ( 2nd time up)

OAR was weak in low 40s (will improve, I use each score twice to preserve 3 time limit on OAR. This Score is my first, and I must say, I thought I could take it without prep.... So wrong! I have since studied.

AA Computer Systems/Gen Studies, Coastline College
BS Workforce Education Development & Training, Southern Illinois Univ 3.8 gpa
MS Information Assurance, Capitol College ( graduate this summer 2012) 4.0 gpa

Information Dominance Warfare Qual
Aviation Warfare Qual

Eval- mp (new cmd following pcs), mp, p (new cmd following pcs), ep, mp
PRT- Outstanding, Outstanding low, Excellent High

5 Vendor Certifications
2 post- bach Certifications from Capitol College
6 NECs
1 O6 LOR
2 O5 interviews, 4 O4 interviews ( only 2 new interviews) all 1810
LPO
100 various volunteer
FCPOA member, 2 cmd collaterals and 1 dept.

Im hoping for a miracle! That non acceptance letter was saddening. Wish us all luck.

 

[SodiumLeak]

To all the pro recs, any tips to make a package more marketable in your opinion? Maybe mention that one key thing or things that you think put you over the edge.

 

[mjv305]

To all the pro recs, any tips to make a package more marketable in your opinion? Maybe mention that one key thing or things that you think put you over the edge.

I would say the simplest and yet reasonably marketable thing you can do would be to get a LOR from your congressman/woman and/or Senator. Its pretty simple to do, but it does take some time and follow up to complete. Search for them on the internet and contact them via e-mail or phone which is usually given out on website and tell them your story. I was in contact with both Florida Senators and 3 members of congress by phone and received just one LOR from a congresswoman. Some help out, some say they can't. It doesnt hurt to try and I would think the board realizes the effort that was put into it.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

I would say the simplest and yet reasonably marketable thing you can do would be to get a LOR from your congressman/woman and/or Senator. Its pretty simple to do, but it does take some time and follow up to complete. Search for them on the internet and contact them via e-mail or phone which is usually given out on website and tell them your story. I was in contact with both Florida Senators and 3 members of congress by phone and received just one LOR from a congresswoman. Some help out, some say they can't. It doesnt hurt to try and I would think the board realizes the effort that was put into it.

Actually no, the board doesn't want this, they want LOR's from people that have seen you in action, if civilian that is employers/professors, if active duty officers that have seen you perform.

 

[mjv305]

Actually no, the board doesn't want this, they want LOR's from people that have seen you in action, if civilian that is employers/professors, if active duty officers that have seen you perform.

With all the documents you must have, if you throw in one of these letters they look down on it? I got everything I needed plus more and I threw this in just for an added bonus. I cant see how the board would look down on this if it is just extra...

 

[exNavyOffRec]

With all the documents you must have, if you throw in one of these letters they look down on it? I got everything I needed plus more and I threw this in just for an added bonus. I cant see how the board would look down on this if it is just extra...

They won't look down on it, but they won't give it any credit either, unless it has something like "I have known XXXX for XXX", or "XXX volunteered in my office", something that adds direct personal knowledge of the individual, I have had several people get letters from elected officials, a couple were applying for very competitive fields but their letters were from officials they had known or worked for in some capacity and they were both selected, the others had standard letters they had "I met with XXX and found him...." or "I have reviewed XXXX credentials......" and the ones that had excellent applications who we thought would get in did, the average ones did not, even with the elected offical's letters.

 

[canav08]

I would say the simplest and yet reasonably marketable thing you can do would be to get a LOR from your congressman/woman and/or Senator. Its pretty simple to do, but it does take some time and follow up to complete. Search for them on the internet and contact them via e-mail or phone which is usually given out on website and tell them your story. I was in contact with both Florida Senators and 3 members of congress by phone and received just one LOR from a congresswoman. Some help out, some say they can't. It doesnt hurt to try and I would think the board realizes the effort that was put into it.

I'm no shining ball of wisdom on this topic but I don't think that helps one iota. What good is a letter from somebody who does not know you personally and can't specifically speak to your qualities? This also implies that a congressperson is automatically a respectable, authoritative source which, without getting into politics, is up for debate to say the least. I can't say I'd want my name associated with many of those people.

As for SodiumLeak's question, I wish I could say. Focus on the things you can control first like test scores. Mine were low to say the least (6/7/6/55) but this board seemed to have a good selection rate compared to past Aviation Boards. I did not see my employers recommendations obviously but they told me they gave the best recommendations possible, don't know how much weight that carried. The non employer who wrote a general letter (not on standard employer request form) has known me all my life and was the police chief in my community and spoke to my character from that angle. Don't know if it helped.

The final piece, and its downplayed by most here and possibly for good reason, was an officer interview with a former commander of the Blue Angels and apparently he said great things too. So Id seek out officers in the community you are applying for and be willing to do the legwork to track them down and work with their schedules.

This is more logistical than part of your package but make sure to stay on top of everything in the process and don't be told "no" unless you can find a written in stone rule/regulation that says "no". For example, my recruiting station (satellite, not at an NRD) was refusing to submit my package based on ASTB scores and also refusing to submit my officer interview that I did the legwork for because they said it was for PAO and CEC applicants only. I had to press on both those items. It is likely that you wont have the same experience but just keep in mind to only let a reg you can put your hands on or a board tell you "no". Nobody else. If I had listened to my recruiter and processor cold, Id be looking for something else to do right now.

Good Luck.

 

[mjv305]

You are all misinterpreting what i said. You need officer interviews, you need astb scores. This is EXTRA thing that everbody does not have. The original question was "any tips to make package more marketable?" This is a simple tip that is simple to do and adds to the package. If i had to choose between two candidates that had very similar packages and one of them went a little further to obtain a LOR from a member of congress, why wouldnt I pick that one? I think you are making out this letter to be something that will make or break the package. I never said that, i just said its pretty simple to obtain and shows extra effort..

If you have everything done and can't think of anything else to do, why not get one of these LORS?

 

[exNavyOffRec]

I'm no shining ball of wisdom on this topic but I don't think that helps one iota. What good is a letter from somebody who does not know you personally and can't specifically speak to your qualities? This also implies that a congressperson is automatically a respectable, authoritative source which, without getting into politics, is up for debate to say the least. I can't say I'd want my name associated with many of those people.

As for SodiumLeak's question, I wish I could say. Focus on the things you can control first like test scores. Mine were low to say the least (6/7/6/55) but this board seemed to have a good selection rate compared to past Aviation Boards. I did not see my employers recommendations obviously but they told me they gave the best recommendations possible, don't know how much weight that carried. The non employer who wrote a general letter (not on standard employer request form) has known me all my life and was the police chief in my community and spoke to my character from that angle. Don't know if it helped.

The final piece, and its downplayed by most here and possibly for good reason, was an officer interview with a former commander of the Blue Angels and apparently he said great things too. So Id seek out officers in the community you are applying for and be willing to do the legwork to track them down and work with their schedules.

This is more logistical than part of your package but make sure to stay on top of everything in the process and don't be told "no" unless you can find a written in stone rule/regulation that says "no". For example, my recruiting station (satellite, not at an NRD) was refusing to submit my package based on ASTB scores and also refusing to submit my officer interview that I did the legwork for because they said it was for PAO and CEC applicants only. I had to press on both those items. It is likely that you wont have the same experience but just keep in mind to only let a reg you can put your hands on or a board tell you "no". Nobody else. If I had listened to my recruiter and processor cold, Id be looking for something else to do right now.

Good Luck.

I hate to tell you but feedback from the Pilot/NFO/SWO board was they don't want officer interviews for non active duty, they don't mean anything if you didn't work for them and are given little if any weight, the last board had the highest selection rate in the past 4 years (at least).

By the book they if they submit an IA from an officer for a civilian the NRC processors could hit them on it, and based on what has been going on with NRC lately I would expect an NRD processor to toss it, NRD's just were blasted over the hits on kits and including things that are not supposed to be included.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

You are all misinterpreting what i said. You need officer interviews, you need astb scores. This is EXTRA thing that everbody does not have. The original question was "any tips to make package more marketable?" This is a simple tip that is simple to do and adds to the package. If i had to choose between two candidates that had very similar packages and one of them went a little further to obtain a LOR from a member of congress, why wouldnt I pick that one? I think you are making out this letter to be something that will make or break the package. I never said that, i just said its pretty simple to obtain and shows extra effort..

If you have everything done and can't think of anything else to do, why not get one of these LORS?

I understand what you were saying, remember non active duty do not get officer interviews, but for the AD yes they need them, however instead of taking time to find an elected official hunt down your past coach, person that observed you doing community service, or college professor, someone that has a direct connection to you, not some politician that is probably going to be involved in some scandal in a few years.

 

[canav08]

I hate to tell you but feedback from the Pilot/NFO/SWO board was they don't want officer interviews for non active duty, they don't mean anything if you didn't work for them and are given little if any weight, the last board had the highest selection rate in the past 4 years (at least).

By the book they if they submit an IA from an officer for a civilian the NRC processors could hit them on it, and based on what has been going on with NRC lately I would expect an NRD processor to toss it, NRD's just were blasted over the hits on kits and including things that are not supposed to be included.

Haha, you don't have to hate to tell me, I'm glad I know the official disposition on officer interviews now! Back when I was applying (we're not talking long ago, Nov/Dec) I was being told that my processor was wrong for refusing to submit mine and to go through with trying to get them to the board if possible. I had no idea how much weight they held at the time and now I know apparently zero. Maybe my processor was not as far out to lunch as I and some others thought he was which is good to know.

 

[canav08]

You are all misinterpreting what i said. You need officer interviews, you need astb scores. This is EXTRA thing that everbody does not have. The original question was "any tips to make package more marketable?" This is a simple tip that is simple to do and adds to the package. If i had to choose between two candidates that had very similar packages and one of them went a little further to obtain a LOR from a member of congress, why wouldnt I pick that one? I think you are making out this letter to be something that will make or break the package. I never said that, i just said its pretty simple to obtain and shows extra effort..

If you have everything done and can't think of anything else to do, why not get one of these LORS?

I understand the sentiment perfectly.

I don't think it says much about a candidate that they went and sought out a person who:
1) Does not personally know them.
2) Likely has no idea what Naval Aviation/OCS is all about and what qualities are necessary to succeed.

The only thing this shows is that the candidate is good at name dropping and possibly trying to one up everyone else with something that is really unimportant. Not that you are not trying to stand out but my argument is that its a poor attempt at standing out. If a candidate is willing to try to make themselves seem better with that tactic, what other tactics might they use once selected? That would be my thought if I was on a board. I don't mean to be a jerk but you said its possibly one of the most important things you can do and in reality, the consensus seems to be its useless or, in my opinion, worse than useless.

Its all about whats required, what else can you do? Everything is a variation on whats "required". I guess the only other advice I could offer is to put alot of thought into your motivational statement. You don't want to come across as arrogant or presumptuous but, at the same time, you want to try and speak to how you can lead effectively. It might seem minor but I agonized over it for quite a while before I had something I liked. I was able to incorporate past experience that jived well with other things the board saw along with some points specific to aviation while still keeping the focus on officer/leader in general, not presuming I'll be lucky enough to make it to a cockpit.

I would not take my advice as gospel, just a few thoughts from somebody who went through the process and overcame some obstacles, it was obviously not a lean board by any stretch so I can't give an honest assessment of how "above and beyond" my package as a whole might have been without seeing how it ranked at board.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

Haha, you don't have to hate to tell me, I'm glad I know the official disposition on officer interviews now! Back when I was applying (we're not talking long ago, Nov/Dec) I was being told that my processor was wrong for refusing to submit mine and to go through with trying to get them to the board if possible. I had no idea how much weight they held at the time and now I know apparently zero. Maybe my processor was not as far out to lunch as I and some others thought he was which is good to know.

Many processors have been doing that job for a long time some don't care, many do and can have great info.

 

[seanw3343]

I didn't submit any letters of recommendation, but that is mostly due to my application deadline. I had to have it submitted 90 days before I was scheduled to PCS. I would imagine that they can figure out what type of applicant an active duty member is from the sheer amount of extra stuff required to be submitted. I mean they want our prt scores, interviews, evaluations, Commanding Officer's endorsement, and every medical document known to man.....

 

[JKid]

I hate to tell you but feedback from the Pilot/NFO/SWO board was they don't want officer interviews for non active duty, they don't mean anything if you didn't work for them and are given little if any weight, the last board had the highest selection rate in the past 4 years (at least).

By the book they if they submit an IA from an officer for a civilian the NRC processors could hit them on it, and based on what has been going on with NRC lately I would expect an NRD processor to toss it, NRD's just were blasted over the hits on kits and including things that are not supposed to be included.

What if the officer has literally known you for your entire life and writes you an LOR? Would that get tossed or does it actually add some weight to a package?