I'm wondering the same...
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Airline CEO letter RE:Oil Futures
- Thread starter FLYTPAY
- Start date
I'm wondering the same...
jorgelito
PRO-REC INTEL
Ok, to clarify, the original poll question was changed but our responses were left as is. As a result, the new, edited poll yielded inaccurate results. My assumption was based on some previous posts that this was done deliberately. I therefore concluded that this rendered the poll to be dishonest.
But as it was pointed out, at the end of the day, the sun will still rise tomorrow and we will all still have a 42% chance of getting jets.
But as it was pointed out, at the end of the day, the sun will still rise tomorrow and we will all still have a 42% chance of getting jets.
The change in the question of the poll does would not have changed your answer, at least in spirit. You may not have voted for a phrase, "down with capitalism," if it had been there before, but I fail to see how different it is from "down with options trading," which was there before, is any different...
Also, while speculation does have some bubble-ing effect on the high price of oil, BUT, it is certainly not the root cause, and any kind of moratorium or limitation on it WILL NOT bring the relief that is desired.
I don't pretend to know he intricacies of international finance or commodities trading, but at least the trading in oil futures could be done in the light of day instead of in exchanges that are out of the view of most regulators, including American ones. If there was nothing 'funny' going on, then what is the problem with having it see the light of day?
Of course, things could continue to go on in secret and people will just assume the worst, much like the poll being changed with no attribution. But I guess that is what people without a backbone or something to hide do.......
Of course, things could continue to go on in secret and people will just assume the worst, much like the poll being changed with no attribution. But I guess that is what people without a backbone or something to hide do.......
Losing faith in the free market?!?!
I don't buy it ...
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-losingfaith16-2008jul16,0,1516735.story
I don't buy it ...
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-losingfaith16-2008jul16,0,1516735.story
more of the same from the media, ie people who had no faith in the free markets to begin with.
I don't pretend to know he intricacies of international finance or commodities trading, but at least the trading in oil futures could be done in the light of day instead of in exchanges that are out of the view of most regulators, including American ones. If there was nothing 'funny' going on, then what is the problem with having it see the light of day?
Of course, things could continue to go on in secret and people will just assume the worst, much like the poll being changed with no attribution. But I guess that is what people without a backbone or something to hide do.......
Maybe.
Nobody has yet explained to me exactly how the cheating might be happening (because I can't come up with a good possibility myself, but my education is likely lacking).
BUT, it's hard to argue with transparency, although I don't really think that is what people are asking for.
At any rate, somebody changed the poll back...
How exactly do you plan to achieve transparency for the trading of a product that is bought and sold on the world market, the majority is produced outside of the United States, and our government has no control over the vast majority of the people who trade oil or the markets they are sold on?
Even if you could find out where every dollar went, it would not matter. It's not illegal to make money buying and selling oil futures. It has been going on for decades. Nobody paid any attention until there was a shortage.
The problem with oil it not how it is traded, the problem is the shortage. The shortage has been created by US government restrictions on the market. The solution is not more government restrictions on trading, the solution is to balance the supply side of the equation.
I don't pretend to know he intricacies of international finance or commodities trading, but at least the trading in oil futures could be done in the light of day instead of in exchanges that are out of the view of most regulators, including American ones. If there was nothing 'funny' going on, then what is the problem with having it see the light of day?
Of course, things could continue to go on in secret and people will just assume the worst, much like the poll being changed with no attribution. But I guess that is what people without a backbone or something to hide do.......
You have no blue links to support this. Where is your research?
The light of day does in fact shine on the NYMEX in New York, between the hours of 10 am and 4 pm on average.
http://images.google.com/imgres?img...=firefox-a&rls=com.google:en-US:official&sa=N
But seriously, if a strong "anti-speculation" bill passes its main effect will be to move a large portion of the commodities trade somewhere else. One of the biggest results of Sarbanes-Oxley was a precipitous decrease in the amount of foreign companies that were listed in the US. Why pay double in accounting fees, just to be listed in the US?
Its illegal for online poker sites to operate in the US. Fine. They just incorporate in the Bahamas, get listed in London, my buddy quits his job at a hedge fund because he's making double playing online poker in less time, and everybody calls it a day.
I guess I am the only one around here that is supposed to back up his arguments with research.......
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/sto...E41C3-8749-4CE0-AE12-2C5295593CD6}&dist=msr_1
I am not saying it is the cause of oil prices rising, but what is the harm in making sure everything is kosher?
What exactly is not "kosher" about investors trying to make money?
Goods have been traded in this manner for a long, long time. The only difference is that nobody gave a shit when oil was 20$ a barrel or less.
The three biggest problems facing the US economy:
1. Inflation
2. Energy
3. Unemployment
All of these problems will be significantly helped by drilling for domestic oil.
Domestic production by US companies will lower prices (helping combat inflation) and will keep dollars in the US instead of exporting trillions to arab and South American nations each year will help as well.
Energy is obvious. More supply = lower prices. It works every time.
Looking for a job? Drilling several hundred wells off shore, several new refineries, pipelines, etc will do the trick. The best part...it does not cost the taxpayers one red cent. All the government has to do is get the hell out of the way and let good old American companies do what they know best.
Goods have been traded in this manner for a long, long time. The only difference is that nobody gave a shit when oil was 20$ a barrel or less.
The three biggest problems facing the US economy:
1. Inflation
2. Energy
3. Unemployment
All of these problems will be significantly helped by drilling for domestic oil.
Domestic production by US companies will lower prices (helping combat inflation) and will keep dollars in the US instead of exporting trillions to arab and South American nations each year will help as well.
Energy is obvious. More supply = lower prices. It works every time.
Looking for a job? Drilling several hundred wells off shore, several new refineries, pipelines, etc will do the trick. The best part...it does not cost the taxpayers one red cent. All the government has to do is get the hell out of the way and let good old American companies do what they know best.
If it is done illegally, which is why I am happy to see that US regulators might be gaining a view into the London market to make sure that nothing untoward is happening.
If nothing illegal is happening then good, people can stop blaming it for the rise in oil prices. If something llegal is happening, then the guilty parties should be punished.
I honestly don't think illicit activity on the London market is a big factor in the high oil prices, but if it does have even a little bit of a factor then we ought to take care of it. Few believed that manipulation was a factor in the California energy shortages back in 2001, until tapes of guys talking about shorting California out of energy became public. Apparently, manipulation of the market was a large factor in that summer's energy 'crisis'.
And I still don't know where all this oil that you think we have is. We don't have anywhere close to what we need to satisfy our energy needs. I am all for drilling for it, but what we have won't make much of a dent in what we need to import.
The difference between oil and electricity is that oil can be stored.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/25/b...ngress friends speculators&st=cse&oref=slogin
Also, I don't really understand what you mean by illegal. How can anything possibly be illegal if in every trade the buyer and seller agree on a price? It would only be illegal if one trader held a gun to somebody's head and made him trade at a price he didn't want to.
The bills in Congress that want to ban buying futures if you don't plan on taking delivery of oil are ridiculous. Almost every person in the world uses oil in some way, in their car, in their food prices, etc. Why not let them hedge their own inflation exposure? Its hard to do efficiently because of contango but the average person can indirectly get into the futures market through ETF's. It is probably a better store of value than gold, since gold doesn't actually "do" anything. And, its probably safer to be long oil here than it is to be long IndyMac Bank (oops). Why don't they just go ahead and make it illegal for me to buy stock in Boeing, since I will never actually take delivery of my own jumbo jet.
Futures trading itself is not illegal, manipulation of the market is:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/29/AR2008052903627.html
BoaisyJon
Point of parliamentary procedure!
I've resurrected this thread to toot my own horn. Congress will indeed be allowing the ban to end. The market has been shaken up, to say the least, but I still think we'll continue to see the price of oil continue to settle.