Are you kidding me? Navy QB charged with rape...

[The Chief]

If no one will pay that, then it's not worth that. I think that's some rule of economics, or something.

Yep. My economist friends call it "Elasticity of demand" or Elasticity of demand curve"! lol

 

[BigRed389]

As far as universities curving grades, my experience at a university has proven that statement (at least in the core classes like the early physics and such), but that is mainly determined by what university and what teacher you have.

Sorry I wasn't entirely clear.

What I meant was that once you get to college, you're going to be held to the same academic standards or curve, as the private school kids. Meaning if you make it through a university, we should be able assume a person is reasonably intelligent. If not, the UNIVERSITIES(Thank you Brett:icon_rage ) have a problem.

 

[goplay234]

I think we can all agree that the military is full of both sh!tbags and good dudes. No matter where they came from or how. The fact is that the media loves to jump on a story when they smell blood in the water. Anything to embarrass the military. While I don't know the entire story, I can say that when this sort of thing happens, if the person charged is affiliated to something, the entire group takes a hit. i.e. A guy in a frat gets charged with rape and all of a sudden every rumor has been confirmed about dudes in frats. Whatever, I just want to see how this is going to turn out. BTW, public school/private school, who gives a sh!t. Can you fly the ball is the only question I care about now.

 

[USMCBebop]

Schnugg

Let's see, I've gone almost 43 years and haven't raped yet....and I don't see it anytime in the near future.

Well, I'm glad to hear it. But some people can hold and play a "good" front (sort of like a Jekyll and Hyde mentality) and hide a dirty secret. That's what I'm talking about.

I'm not saying this mid is guilty, but at the sametime, I hope he's not what I described.

My statement holding no merit? Maybe, maybe not, but there are different possibilities, even the one I just described.

Huh? What the heck are you talking about?

The Rape Card? Someone just mentioned it where some woman who just had (consensual) sex and decides to go against the guy and say she was raped.

 

[Wingnut]

I believe what you meant was: 'commensurate'

Perhaps you should spend more time brushing up on spelling skills that your private institution failed to teach you, and less time bagging on public schools. I'm sure your excuse will be "I have a math degree." But at least get the easy ones right when you're picking on public schools.

Yours,
John Q. Public School, who knows how to spell 'commensurate' (and, believe it or not, has high moral character)

Talk about contentious. Note the word typical, which I used repeatedly. I never said that the public schools are incapable of producing a graduate with high moral character and a good academic grounding. I meant what I said, however, and I will furthermore say that the public school system is doing a worse job than ever of contributing to the development of intelligent, successful, principled citizens. I think there was a time when they had much higher standards, but of course some of the same things could be said of many parents (thankfully not mine). In the case of the local high school that I'm most familiar with, there are some good teachers, and the students who are well motivated often do quite well working with those teachers. Unfortunately, I would estimate those students to be in the minority. There are far too many who are allowed to slide through without having to apply themselves, who are allowed to graduate with minimal academic skills. As for colleges, even some of the better ones will handhold almost any flunky through with an eight-year BS in BS-ing as long as they keep getting checks from somewhere. Their standards have slipped as well.
I must say, I find it interesting that a misspelling is enough, to the mind of John Q. Public School anyway, to invalidate what I said and grant license to mischaracterize my statements. As eddie, who apparently took the time to check my profile, noted, I was home-schooled, not privately schooled. It didn’t take me long to become acclimated to college, and I never found my prior education to be deficient. Neither did I feel I was ‘working without a full stack of social cards and cues,’ and I was seldom, if ever, accused of such. If speaking my mind and being willing to call out the public education system (and don’t pretend I’m making things up here) is something that is socially unacceptable, then maybe I don’t mind being antisocial now and then. Your school may have been great. You may have had great teachers, you may have made lifelong friends: I never said, nor did I imply that it was all bad. Many are well-served by a public school, thanks in large part to dedicated teachers. But the statistics, the empirical and anecdotal evidence, to me indicate that the public school system on the whole is failing. That being said, I honestly don’t care whether a person is public, private, or home schooled. Good, intelligent, and honorable people have come and continue to come from all these forms of schooling, and I have no problem working and serving with anyone who is honest and capable of performing whatever the appointed task may be. I harbor no preconceptions about those who are either publicly or privately schooled, but I do resent the implication that the home-schooled are raised to do so. I think for many it is a better choice, and in retrospect I am glad that I was home-schooled, but I don’t for a minute claim that it was the one deciding factor in the development of my skills, abilities, and accomplishments.
Finally, my math degree may not have gotten me anywhere ‘out in the sticks,’ (when’s the last time you heard “Billings Montana” and “vibrant tech industry” in the same sentence?) but it undoubtedly contributed to my being recommended for flight school. In that capacity it has proven solid gold.

 

[BigRed389]

Talk about contentious. Note the word typical, which I used repeatedly. I never said that the public schools are incapable of producing a graduate with high moral character and a good academic grounding. I meant what I said, however, and I will furthermore say that the public school system is doing a worse job than ever of contributing to the development of intelligent, successful, principled citizens. I think there was a time when they had much higher standards, but of course some of the same things could be said of many parents (thankfully not mine). In the case of the local high school that I'm most familiar with, there are some good teachers, and the students who are well motivated often do quite well working with those teachers. Unfortunately, I would estimate those students to be in the minority. There are far too many who are allowed to slide through without having to apply themselves, who are allowed to graduate with minimal academic skills. As for colleges, even some of the better ones will handhold almost any flunky through with an eight-year BS in BS-ing as long as they keep getting checks from somewhere. Their standards have slipped as well.
I must say, I find it interesting that a misspelling is enough, to the mind of John Q. Public School anyway, to invalidate what I said and grant license to mischaracterize my statements. As eddie, who apparently took the time to check my profile, noted, I was home-schooled, not privately schooled. It didn’t take me long to become acclimated to college, and I never found my prior education to be deficient. Neither did I feel I was ‘working without a full stack of social cards and cues,’ and I was seldom, if ever, accused of such. If speaking my mind and being willing to call out the public education system (and don’t pretend I’m making things up here) is something that is socially unacceptable, then maybe I don’t mind being antisocial now and then. Your school may have been great. You may have had great teachers, you may have made lifelong friends: I never said, nor did I imply that it was all bad. Many are well-served by a public school, thanks in large part to dedicated teachers. But the statistics, the empirical and anecdotal evidence, to me indicate that the public school system on the whole is failing. That being said, I honestly don’t care whether a person is public, private, or home schooled. Good, intelligent, and honorable people have come and continue to come from all these forms of schooling, and I have no problem working and serving with anyone who is honest and capable of performing whatever the appointed task may be. I harbor no preconceptions about those who are either publicly or privately schooled, but I do resent the implication that the home-schooled are raised to do so. I think for many it is a better choice, and in retrospect I am glad that I was home-schooled, but I don’t for a minute claim that it was the one deciding factor in the development of my skills, abilities, and accomplishments.
Finally, my math degree may not have gotten me anywhere ‘out in the sticks,’ (when’s the last time you heard “Billings Montana” and “vibrant tech industry” in the same sentence?) but it undoubtedly contributed to my being recommended for flight school. In that capacity it has proven solid gold.

OK, yeah, I've been through public school, and I'll agree with the majority of the points about the public school system. It sucks, and is incredibly inconsistent in quality of education. However, you're assuming that the lower average statistics of public schools will impact the stellar performers. Which it doesn't. And there are standardized exams totally unrelated to public schools.

Anyhow, I'd like to hope that the calling of naval officer will draw upon better than the "average" high school graduate, with "average" grades and "average" ethics.

As for the 8-year BS in BSing, what Navy commissioning program will actually accept that? ROTC, you'd have been booted a LONG time ago. BDCP/OCS probably wouldn't even let you through the door.

So like others have said, who gives a damn where they came from? Everybody's going to get the same training. If proper selection and training can't weed out those who can't hack it, then I'd say the Navy's ****ed up, and that's a bigger problem.

 

[Wingnut]

BigRed389

Wow, I think we're on the same page here. I didn't mean to imply that the cream is being soured right along with the milk, I think the truly gifted will always find ways to excel. Also, the Navy won't take obvious bottom feeders, I was solely referring to college standards when I said they let a lot of those people through with degrees.

Everybody's going to get the same training. If proper selection and training can't weed out those who can't hack it, then I'd say the Navy's ****ed up, and that's a bigger problem.

Exactly. Many have voiced their concerns about the dumbing down of all the officer training programs, and there are plenty of people being accepted for officer programs who aren't of the material one would hope for. There are plenty of really great people from all walks of life who are choosing to serve, but it's not enough to fill the ranks. So that leaves the question of where the those being offered a commission who are lacking are going to get straightened out or weeded out.
Anyway, this thread, thanks in some part to me, is well off-topic. I'd install a topicality filter on my browser, but then you'd probably never hear from me again.

 

[HighDimension]

Next years FB season isn't looking so hot...

http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/03/08/navy.rape.ap/index.html

 

[a_m]

Seems to be a lot of double talk from the woman. Buyers remorse that only affects Lamar (since her name is withheld).

 

[Cate]

Just so y'all don't get caught by this in the future: in most states, a sexual partner cannot legally give consent if he or she is drunk. Some states even have a specific blood alcohol level for this, like drunk-driving laws. So even if you absolutely know that she's saying, "Yes, yes, oh God, harder," if it comes out as "Gaaaahohmigod... Imabaaaarf..." you could very possibly be facing rape accusations in the morning. Is it fair? Who cares? It's (in most cases) the law, and if it's an unfair law, you take it up with the lawmakers.

The other point is, if, in fact, Owens is on tape saying, "I didn't do it for that long, you weren't even awake," then yes, it was rape, because a sexual partner similarly can't give consent while asleep. Am I saying that this tape does actually exist, and that it actually says that? No; this is just from an article. But if it does, then what he said was, "I scrogged you while you were asleep," which is nonconsensual.

I think the best thing to do is reserve judgment until all of the information is out in the open. Rape trials tend to keep a lot of stuff quiet to protect the alleged victim, so there's probably a whole lot that we don't know. Making any decisions on anyone's character at this point is pointless, because we don't have all the facts.

 

[HighDimension]

Just so y'all don't get caught by this in the future: in most states, a sexual partner cannot legally give consent if he or she is drunk. Some states even have a specific blood alcohol level for this, like drunk-driving laws. So even if you absolutely know that she's saying, "Yes, yes, oh God, harder," if it comes out as "Gaaaahohmigod... Imabaaaarf..." you could very possibly be facing rape accusations in the morning. Is it fair? Who cares? It's (in most cases) the law, and if it's an unfair law, you take it up with the lawmakers.

The other point is, if, in fact, Owens is on tape saying, "I didn't do it for that long, you weren't even awake," then yes, it was rape, because a sexual partner similarly can't give consent while asleep. Am I saying that this tape does actually exist, and that it actually says that? No; this is just from an article. But if it does, then what he said was, "I scrogged you while you were asleep," which is nonconsensual.

I think the best thing to do is reserve judgment until all of the information is out in the open. Rape trials tend to keep a lot of stuff quiet to protect the alleged victim, so there's probably a whole lot that we don't know. Making any decisions on anyone's character at this point is pointless, because we don't have all the facts.

great points Cate. Every brief I've ever received on sexual assault / rape all say the same thing. If you are under the influence of any substance, you can no longer consent to any sort of sexual activity. Also, if both parties were under the influence then technically either one could go to the authorities and call it rape. Definitely something to keep in mind when you go out to a club or a bar. It always amazes me when someone puts their future on the line over something like this! Even if the female was doing this for some attention ( not saying that she is, I will not judge either way until the outcome.) if this article is true, the case against Owens would appear to be pretty damning.

 

[KBayDog]

Just so y'all don't get caught by this in the future: in most states, a sexual partner cannot legally give consent if he or she is drunk. Some states even have a specific blood alcohol level for this, like drunk-driving laws. So even if you absolutely know that she's saying, "Yes, yes, oh God, harder," if it comes out as "Gaaaahohmigod... Imabaaaarf..." you could very possibly be facing rape accusations in the morning. Is it fair? Who cares? It's (in most cases) the law, and if it's an unfair law, you take it up with the lawmakers.

Another revolutionary, time-tested way to limit the likelihood of facing rape accusations in the morning is to keep your trousers zipped, so to speak, until you are married, and only have relations with your spouse. (I know, not a very popular suggestion these days, but I felt it was worth throwing out there. Go ahead and let the flaming begin.)

In any event, I don't think it is appropriate to discuss the specific case which started this thread. Let the legal system do its job, and refrain from editorializing on this public message board.

 

[A4sForever]

Another revolutionary, time-tested way to limit the likelihood of facing rape accusations in the morning is to keep your trousers zipped.....In any event, I don't think it is appropriate to discuss the specific case which started this thread. Let the legal system do its job, and refrain from editorializing on this public message board.

Very good advice on both counts, Marine-green grasshopper. It makes my heart soar like an eagle to see you including "boldface" in your post.

Ahhhhhh ..... The 7 "P's" .... it always works:

PPPPPPP ... or, to say it another way .... Proper Preflight Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance ..... i.e., "keep your pants zipped" (in the venacular of the misguided, woebegotten AW youth herein )

... the 7 "P's" still works whether you are in Aviation .... or in "Love" ...:icon_woma

.... You won't be sorry .... :icon_wink

 

[Brett327]

Very good advice on both counts, Marine-green grasshopper. It makes my heart soar like an eagle to see you including "boldface" in your post.

Ahhhhhh ..... The 7 "P's" .... it always works:

PPPPPPP ... or, to say it another way .... Proper Preflight Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance ..... i.e., "keep your pants zipped" (in the venacular of the misguided, woebegotten AW youth herein )

... the 7 "P's" still works whether you are in Aviation .... or in "Love" ...:icon_woma

.... You won't be sorry .... :icon_wink

Or, if I may be so bold as to translate the wisdom of the Sages into Sailor-speak:
"Don't sh!t where you eat."

@ Cate: If everyone has to be sober for consent, how in the world is anyone supposed to get laid?

Brett

 

[Cate]

The trick is to be pretty enough to scrog sober.