Carrier deployments

[bert]

Are the professional challenges Pickle writes of more common in MPRA? I suspect that larger summary groups and a less transparent detailing process causes more people to crush themselves trying to break out of the pack.? My experience is limited to small summary groups (7-12 LTs in a summary group), and folks usually have a pretty good idea where they stand and what their future holds.

I've always had the impression that in larger summary groups (like helos and MPRA) which have less transparent detailing and career managing (like helos and MPRA), the unhappiest officers are the ones still striving for the breakout who don't realize they aren't going to get it. Yes, their smaller wardrooms make their JO management easier, but TACAIR squadrons also seem to be more straightforward with their guys.

Edit - may have nothing to do with this case, but I saw it often over 20 years.

 

[BusyBee604]

I imagine that prior guys who have an established family tend to have a more difficult time making the transition from the E to O world than prior single guys or non-priors. Having that spousal support network is so important, particularly during deployment.

I agree with this, I was a prior E-5, but didn't marry until an O-2...so the transtion for Mrs Bee was fine. Had I been married for some time prior to commissining, I can see where some integration into the unit spousal support group could be problematic.
BzB

 

[exNavyOffRec]

I agree with this, I was a prior E-5, but didn't marry until an O-2...so the transtion for Mrs Bee was fine. Had I been married for some time prior to commissining, I can see where some integration into the unit spousal support group could be problematic.
BzB

I have seen few officers that are prior have marriage issues, now most of the ones I know are LDO/CWO, of course the one that I do know of was bad enough to count for several.

 

[helo_wifey]

I think Brett may partially be right, but it's so individual. I find that theory interesting.

I met my husband when he was at the FRS and we eloped, and went overseas for his first sea tour. We've weathered a lot since then including rocky patches in the marriage, a Class A mishap, a near death experience for me and another unwanted overseas tour.

I've never been one to really fit in with the squadron spouses, even after having kids. I have friends in other branches as well as civilian but for some reason cannot connect with those in our squadron. I know that's just me though.

I think it's important as a family unit to talk about expectations, both from the service member and spouse. It seems a lot of spouses just sit back and don't speak up because we think things can't change. But, I also think its an evolution in the marriage and at the job for the service member. My husband rarely, like maybe 2 times in his 3 year sea tour took leave. He was #1 coming out and does well for himself, but he had to realize his job wouldn't crumble without him and everything would still be there when he got back. And, it took me telling him it pissed me off when everyone else took leave and he didn't.

I just find this a very interesting topic.

 

[phrogpilot73]

Pickle - even though I know you only through a website, I truly from the bottom of my heart hope Mrs. Pickle is OK, and you guys are able to get through this. As a 16 year old kid, I attempted suicide - and thankfully got the help I needed. The MO in my squadron (who is a good friend of mine) had to go through the pain of loosing his son to suicide, and I ended up helping him through it. I am probably one of the few people in the Navy/USMC that doesn't mock the required suicide awareness lectures. I can understand what brings a person to that point, and trust me brother - it wasn't you. Thank god you have a supportive command - and if I can do anything to help along the way, I beg of you not to hesitate to ask.

As for all the other comments, I can agree with most. My opinion is that yes, there is stress in the civilian world as well, but it's different than the stress of the Navy/USMC. PSW deployed for an undetermined amount of time (turned out to be about 4 months) with less than 24 hours notice. I was packing for her deployment while she was still at work. She took back-to-back sea duty so I could stay at my current job, because she knew that I enjoyed my job and the people I work with. That didn't help the stress level, and we've hit our rocky point as well. Of course, two of her co-workers that she's close with have also hit rocky points in their marriage. Coincidence? I don't know, but I do know that it's not as prevalent in the civilian world because the demands put on the individual are different.

 

[squorch2]

I imagine that prior guys who have an established family tend to have a more difficult time making the transition from the E to O world than prior single guys or non-priors.

The numbers from 2010-2011 for my old squadron from bear this out: the factors that correlate most to squadron interventions (flight ORMs, HFC/HFB actions, etc.) are being prior, married, and with kids. Doesn't correlate to finishing the program, just to human factors-related issues.

 

[Brett327]

I've definitely seen the same in all three of my squadrons. Probably a good data point for all of us to file away in our leadership toolboxes.

 

[e6bflyer]

For human factors boards, flight IMSAFE instances, etc, I will definitely agree that having more factors that would cause you to have issues (wife, kids, etc) will naturally make you more prone to triggering some sort of formal intervention. I would argue, however, that each individual has their own ability to cope/compartmentalize and that most of the "big ticket" legal and mental health issues are typically by a younger and more single crowd. You can typically tell through actually having a conversation with people if they are encountering struggles outside of work that need to be dealt with by getting leadership involved. Most guys/gals are glad to talk about it, especially if it is causing them concern. I think Pickle's example above is the perfect leadership response to a bad situation at home. A lot of commands fail to see the long term affects of their short term decisions.

 

[robav8r]

I know both the CO and XO in Pickle's squadron very well. Not surprised they reacted that way and took a proactive approach to helping him and his family.

 

[MasterBates]

As someone who went through a similar situation, having to return from deployment after their spouse attempted suicide, I will say Pickle's squadorn is handing this far better than mine ever did after chatting with him last night.

This is close to textbook how squadrons SHOULD deal with things like this. BZ to his CO/XO who have handled this as well as possible.

 

[Ralph]

from what I saw your 2nd sea tour will be a non flying tour most likely and come before your 8yrs is up?

 

[squorch2]

Yes.

 

[e6bflyer]

from what I saw your 2nd sea tour will be a non flying tour most likely and come before your 8yrs is up?

That is community dependent. For helo/maritime guys, it is most definitely non-flying with the very occasional exception. I have met many jet guys on their second sea tour who are flying, at least enough to stay current.

 

[Brett327]

That is community dependent. For helo/maritime guys, it is most definitely non-flying with the very occasional exception. I have met many jet guys on their second sea tour who are flying, at least enough to stay current.

Concur. There's always the Weps School/WTI/Super JO route.

 

[SynixMan]

Helos have Super JO, Squadron SWTI, and some other cats and dogs to stay in the cockpit for the disassociated. However, those aren't the "norm".