Crossing the finish line... running, walking or crawling... (Reserve Retirement Process)

[Gatordev]

Jim may know, but I think it's on your -214 somewhere (some code, like Flash said). That said, definitely have your orders as a back up. The orders should have the GWOT funding line on it to validate the type of service.

 

[Flash]

Jim may know, but I think it's on your -214 somewhere (some code, like Flash said). That said, definitely have your orders as a back up. The orders should have the GWOT funding line on it to validate the type of service.

Both of my active orders had a phrase along the lines of 'Activated under US Code 13230(c)' on them which is the really important part and what the NDAA's count for early retirement credit, my second set of orders weren't associated with GWOT in any way but qualified due to the Code I was activated under.

 

[Jim123]

^^^ What Flash said.

I'd have to ask a real admin/personnel person for help before I could tell you exactly where to look to make sure the correct information is in your official record so that you start drawing retirement pay on the correct date.

 

[vxc961]

Thanks Subres. I verified with PERS (they got back to me the next day!) that my GI Bill service obligation has been adjusted (It should have been March 2019) and now I’m actually drafting a “don’t pick me” letter...I’d rather spend those six months with my kids than get an extra couple hundred a month when they’re 30.

 

[jeff86]

Not sure if this is really the right thread but figured it was at least related, so here goes:

I was recently selected to commission as a Reserve DCO. I already have 13 years and 2 months of active duty time, which gives me 6 years and 10 months of time before I would reach 20 years of active duty service.

I understand that you can waive sanctuary to accept orders that would take you past 18 years of total active duty time, but is there a similar waiver that you can sign to accept orders that would take you past 20 years of total active duty time (and agree to not apply for an active duty retirement)? Or are your options to mobilize / perform ADSW basically turned off once you get close to 20 years of active time and you’re limited to AT and IDT for the rest of your career?

Thanks for any insight you can provide!

 

[Uncle Fester]

Not sure if this is really the right thread but figured it was at least related, so here goes:

I was recently selected to commission as a Reserve DCO. I already have 13 years and 2 months of active duty time, which gives me 6 years and 10 months of time before I would reach 20 years of active duty service.

I understand that you can waive sanctuary to accept orders that would take you past 18 years of total active duty time, but is there a similar waiver that you can sign to accept orders that would take you past 20 years of total active duty time (and agree to not apply for an active duty retirement)? Or are your options to mobilize / perform ADSW basically turned off once you get close to 20 years of active time and you’re limited to AT and IDT for the rest of your career?

Thanks for any insight you can provide!

As a reservist you will not be allowed anywhere near 20 active duty years, period. The ‘waiver’ is to go over 16 years, and it’s not granted except in exceptional circumstances (eg, a doctor with a rare and valuable specialty on extended active duty at Balboa). They will not let you into sanctuary without specific written approval by Millington, and the approval has to acknowledge that they are on-purpose letting you go into sanctuary.

 

[Flash]

As a reservist you will not be allowed anywhere near 20 active duty years, period. The ‘waiver’ is to go over 16 years, and it’s not granted except in exceptional circumstances (eg, a doctor with a rare and valuable specialty on extended active duty at Balboa). They will not let you into sanctuary without specific written approval by Millington, and the approval has to acknowledge that they are on-purpose letting you go into sanctuary.

How old is that policy? I know plenty of folks who got over 16 pretty easily, of course they topped out at 17 years X months though.

 

[Uncle Fester]

How old is that policy? I know plenty of folks who got over 16 pretty easily, of course they topped out at 17 years X months though.

I don't know exactly; I think 2013 or thereabouts.

The deal is, essentially, you can be approved to go over 16, but your days are very closely tracked. Unless there's a very compelling reason, you won't get approved for mobs or ADSW once you're over 16. There have been a few cases of Reservists entering sanctuary, either 'sneaking under the wire' on purpose or accidentally (miscalculated their cumulative AD time). So the 16-year thing is supposed to be a buffer.

Here's the relevant instruction.

...all requests for reserve Sailors to receive active-duty orders will be screened to determine if the Sailor has 16 or more years cumulative active-duty service. This screening will be conducted for requests regarding ADT, ADSW, MOB, PRC, and active-duty recall (MPN and RPN) orders.

(1) Commands requesting non-training orders (ADSW, MOB, PRC, and active-duty recall (MPN or RPN)) for reserve Sailors with 16 or more years cumulative active-duty service must seek permission from OPNAV (N13), per enclosures (2) and (3), prior to issuance of orders. Per reference (a), non-training orders that will take members to, or beyond, 18 years of cumulative active-duty service will not be issued without prior coordination and authorization from OPNAV (N13).

(2) Commands requesting ADT orders for reserve Sailors with 16 or more years cumulative active-duty service will be screened. Orders will not be issued for greater than 29 days per fiscal year for reserve Sailors with 17.5 or more years cumulative active-duty service unless authorized by OPNAV (N13), per enclosures (3) and (4). Only in exceptional circumstances should a waiver be sought. Per reference (a), training type orders will not make Sailors eligible for sanctuary, however all active-duty periods accrue time for retirement purposes.

b. A Naval Personnel Command (NAVPERSCOM), Reserve Personnel Management Department (PERS-9) cumulative active-duty service screening may only be requested by the order issuing authority (OIA) or sourcing agent.

c. Prior to requesting a waiver, all reserve personnel subject to screening control (greater than 16 years cumulative active-duty service) will sign a NAVPERS 1070/613 Administrative Remarks acknowledging that they have reviewed and verified the accuracy of their cumulative active-duty service. It is incumbent on the RC Sailor to ensure the accuracy of their active-duty service to enable waiver or sanctuary consideration.

d. Approval of a 16-year waiver does not imply intent to allow reserve Sailors to exceed 18 years of cumulative active
duty-service and enter sanctuary. If it is determined that a reserve Sailor has entered sanctuary without the approval of
OPNAV (N13), involuntary release from active duty via the Secretarial process may be pursued.

 

[jeff86]

I don't know exactly; I think 2013 or thereabouts.

The deal is, essentially, you can be approved to go over 16, but your days are very closely tracked. Unless there's a very compelling reason, you won't get approved for mobs or ADSW once you're over 16. There have been a few cases of Reservists entering sanctuary, either 'sneaking under the wire' on purpose or accidentally (miscalculated their cumulative AD time). So the 16-year thing is supposed to be a buffer.

Here's the relevant instruction.

Thanks! I know I'm probably "jumping the gun" being newly selected but I like to maintain a mid-to-long term career outlook. I'll plan on realistically being able to do maybe 4 180 day mobilizations (2 years) spread over a 20 year Reserve career (my goal is O5 before retiring), and then "save" the rest of my remaining active time (~2-4 years, depending if they ever let me go past 18 years cumulative active time) for schools and other stuff that might pop up. Does that seem realistic? Appreciate the guidance.

 

[Uncle Fester]

Thanks! I know I'm probably "jumping the gun" being newly selected but I like to maintain a mid-to-long term career outlook. I'll plan on realistically being able to do maybe 4 180 day mobilizations (2 years) spread over a 20 year Reserve career (my goal is O5 before retiring), and then "save" the rest of my remaining active time (~2-4 years, depending if they ever let me go past 18 years cumulative active time) for schools and other stuff that might pop up. Does that seem realistic? Appreciate the guidance.

Depends on your designator, location, and paygrade.

 

[Flash]

Thanks! I know I'm probably "jumping the gun" being newly selected but I like to maintain a mid-to-long term career outlook. I'll plan on realistically being able to do maybe 4 180 day mobilizations (2 years) spread over a 20 year Reserve career (my goal is O5 before retiring), and then "save" the rest of my remaining active time (~2-4 years, depending if they ever let me go past 18 years cumulative active time) for schools and other stuff that might pop up. Does that seem realistic? Appreciate the guidance.

First off, the Navy won't let you get past 18 years to reach sanctuary unless there are some pretty extraordinary circumstances as Fester already mentioned. The fact you need a waiver to go over 16 years now ought to tell you how badly the Navy really doesn't want it to happen.

Second, while I admire your plans the reserves in general usually doesn't really lend itself to that sort of planning . You can expect to be mobilized at least once in your career, more dependent on your designator, especially once you get fully qual'd or are past any sort of exemption. I know quite a few folks who have volunteered for a MOB instead of gambling with whatever they got stuck with but they all either took some work coordinating it or they jumped on an opportunity. Some communities are better than others, Intel and IW seem to manage their MOB's a little better than the URL's but they also MOB at a higher rate and seem to have a tougher time getting promoted lately. I did both, got stuck with something out of the blue and jumped on a great opportunity that landed in my lap.

Whatever community you are in I would ask the folks who have been around 6-8 years or more what the options and general lay of the land is, be sure to ask as many as possible since no one career in the reserves is like another.

I don't know exactly; I think 2013 or thereabouts.

That make sense, most of the folks who got to 17 years X months did most of their active duty time before then when GWOT money for MOB's and ADSW's seemed to be inexhaustible.

 

[Uncle Fester]

First off, the Navy won't let you get past 18 years to reach sanctuary unless there are some pretty extraordinary circumstances as Fester already mentioned. The fact you need a waiver to go over 16 years now ought to tell you how badly the Navy really doesn't want it to happen....That make sense, most of the folks who got to 17 years X months did most of their active duty time before then when GWOT money for MOB's and ADSW's seemed to be inexhaustible.

It's not Mob/ADSW money that's the issue, it's retirement money. The Navy doesn't want SELRES sneaking/stumbling into sanctuary and an AD retirement because retirements are paid out of service funds until the retiree hits 60; then it comes out of DoD funds. They can budget for an AC retirement a couple of years out - thus sancutary actually works to the Navy's benefit as well as the member's - but not an unplanned reservist retirement. And because a reservist's total AD time isn't tracked anywhere (see: earlier thread discussion about figuring out your total time), unless the sailor totals it up and documents it himself, quite a few guys managed to sneak under the wire that way. A chief in my old reserve unit managed it, by means of repeated 30-day orders supporting the unit. 30-day orders didn't trip the mandatory screening, and he kept quiet until he snuck across the line. He wasn't the only one. Thus the current rules.

It's a rare bird these days they will even let into that over-16 'buffer zone,' and effectively never over-18. The examples I heard given were medical guys with hard-to-find, harder-to-replace specialties, and JAGs working on Gitmo detainee cases. Just being an incumbent on a billet isn't enough - you have to be literally irreplaceable. And then Millington has to grant you a waiver explicitly stating that they're aware they're letting you into sanctuary and that they intend to give you an Active retirement.

@jeff86 - unless you're one of those irreplaceable guys, the most total AD time you could reasonably strive for is 16-and-change. If you're willing to go OCONUS, it's not that difficult to pick up a lot of AD time. I myself have done about 28 months - 12 months mob'ed at sea, 6 mob'ed in the Sandbox, 10 on a CONUS ADSW. I'm about to hit 19 years total, of which just under 14 are active (AC+mob/ADSW).

 

[jeff86]

@jeff86 - unless you're one of those irreplaceable guys, the most total AD time you could reasonably strive for is 16-and-change. If you're willing to go OCONUS, it's not that difficult to pick up a lot of AD time. I myself have done about 28 months - 12 months mob'ed at sea, 6 mob'ed in the Sandbox, 10 on a CONUS ADSW. I'm about to hit 19 years total, of which just under 14 are active (AC+mob/ADSW).[/QUOTE]

Thanks all for the information. I'll be an 1835 so from what I understand we're pretty mobilization heavy. I'll definitely approach various more senior officers to learn about their experience. My biggest goal is just to ensure that I make the most of the remaining active duty time that I have to play with, planning off a worst case scenario that I won't be allowed to go past 16, in order to stay competitive for promotion by volunteering for mobilizations at the right time in my career etc. I really have no interest in an active duty retirement as staying in the Reserves as long as possible is highly advantageous for me (clearance maintenance, maintaining currency/relevance on the Military intel side, and keeping one foot in the door in the military in case something big happens that I want to be involved in is personally important to me).

 

[Uncle Fester]

Thanks all for the information. I'll be an 1835 so from what I understand we're pretty mobilization heavy. I'll definitely approach various more senior officers to learn about their experience. My biggest goal is just to ensure that I make the most of the remaining active duty time that I have to play with, planning off a worst case scenario that I won't be allowed to go past 16, in order to stay competitive for promotion by volunteering for mobilizations at the right time in my career etc. I really have no interest in an active duty retirement as staying in the Reserves as long as possible is highly advantageous for me (clearance maintenance, maintaining currency/relevance on the Military intel side, and keeping one foot in the door in the military in case something big happens that I want to be involved in is personally important to me).

Yeah, there are grunches of Intel reservists just about everywhere out there. If your civilian job and camp followers (if any) can support it, might consider starting doing a year or two mob'ed, including OCONUS, or on a long-term ADSW. Your chances of later getting hit with an invol mob at an inopportune time go way down if you've already done your bit, and Reserve promotion boards like seeing full-time paper in your record. Pick your grenade and jump on it. Time downrange is good, but there are tons of billets INCONUS where you can do good and useful work - DC (ONI, for example), Norfolk, Ft Bragg, Tampastan, plus agreeable OCONUS locales like Naples and Stuttgart.

 

[Flash]

Thanks all for the information. I'll be an 1835 so from what I understand we're pretty mobilization heavy. I'll definitely approach various more senior officers to learn about their experience. My biggest goal is just to ensure that I make the most of the remaining active duty time that I have to play with, planning off a worst case scenario that I won't be allowed to go past 16, in order to stay competitive for promotion by volunteering for mobilizations at the right time in my career etc. I really have no interest in an active duty retirement as staying in the Reserves as long as possible is highly advantageous for me (clearance maintenance, maintaining currency/relevance on the Military intel side, and keeping one foot in the door in the military in case something big happens that I want to be involved in is personally important to me).

I want to make sure we are on the same sheet of music, what is your concern about not getting past 16 years? What Fester and I are talking about is getting 16 years of actual active duty time, that is where the waiver comes in so they can track folks nearing 'sanctuary' for an active duty retirement and not reserve retirement.

With your prior active duty time you should be able to make 20 years in the reserves and get retirement even if you don't get promoted to LCDR, you just need to make sure you get 7 good years and make LT and you'll make 20 pretty very easily with time to spare. You are one of the few in that position, an enviable one in the competitive 1835 community.

...agreeable OCONUS locales like Naples and Stuttgart.

I know a guy who was in Stuttgart for 2 months, he was able to get off base once in that whole time with 12-16 hour days being the norm supporting 'joint' (SOCOM) ops. He keeps saying it was the most miserable time he has had with the DoD, period.