You know, you can get a base model AW609 for a mere $25 million! And yes…the day will come when these (or something like them) are used as training aircraft by the armed services.
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Hot new helicopter/rotorcraft news
- Thread starter Randy Daytona
- Start date
GroundPounder
Well-Known Member
I'm reminded of an old Steve Martin,
I love money. I love everything about it. I bought some pretty good stuff. Got me a $300 pair of socks. Got a fur sink. An electric dog polisher. A gasoline powered turtleneck sweater, an AW609. And, of course, I bought some dumb stuff, too.” ~ Steve Martin
All I need is this chair, and this paddleball game, and the ability to do full touchdown autorotations...
I never said Civilians don't have mishaps. I'm just saying there's a lot to be said for these guys being able to learn how to fly helos without all of the other collaterals that go along with being at the training command. They'll still get the full HT experience for everything else.
Those collaterals were/are part of the military life experience.
If we truly think these collaterals get in the way of effective learning and knowledge transfer we should also eliminate military jump training, weapons training, and all of our leadership and other schools for their civilian equivalent.
Wouldn't want collaterals of a military command getting in the way.
I sure didn't become a military officer and aviator for all those distracting collaterals.
Those collaterals are part of what made me the Officer and aviator that I became.
"The more one sweats in peace, the less one's bleed in war."
The collaterals of military life are part of that sweat.
And of course the gif I posted was in jest.
I hope we never lose sight of the value of humor.
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Again, they'll still get the full HT experience. I'm glad you brought up weapons training. Think of it like that. When you go to the range, how many things are you doing? The answer is just one. You don't write reports, or sign FITREPs, or answer the squadron telephone while you're on the line. You are 100% focused on the safe employment of your weapon. Because it's vital that you fully understand how to use it effectively and safely. That doesn't mean that the other things go away. They're still there, but your focus needs to be 100% when you're learning about something with the potential to cause that much harm. Why should learning to fly be any less vital?
Besides, you've got two sets of wings. I bet you know people who have been killed in mishaps. I'm also betting that not one of them died because the pilots lacked military bearing.
+1 @FlyNavy03 on your points here. I think the win for COPT-R is the emphasis it places on emphasizing the art and science of hand flying a helicopter with a integrated understanding of aircraft control, aerodynamics, ex. The capstone experience of a true "sole coccupant" solo is also key.
After teaching ai the HT's for 36 months, being teh STAN-O, working in the HITU I thought I was a pretty good stick. My interview flight at PHI quickly humbled me after the company check airman gave me some feedback on my flying after 45 minute flight in their 206 on floats. "Yeah you are a dual piloted robot like every other pilot we hire from Navy and Marines - you'll have to relearn a little" - which of course I did.
After teaching ai the HT's for 36 months, being teh STAN-O, working in the HITU I thought I was a pretty good stick. My interview flight at PHI quickly humbled me after the company check airman gave me some feedback on my flying after 45 minute flight in their 206 on floats. "Yeah you are a dual piloted robot like every other pilot we hire from Navy and Marines - you'll have to relearn a little" - which of course I did.
The point I'm making and I think should not disappear.
I've sung Eternal Father at more memorial services than I wan to discuss.
And their deaths have NOTHING to do with this discussion.
I have made my points, and still feel that eliminating, as you called them, the collaterals, does a disservice to the overall profession.
If we want technical experts minus these collaterals, we could eliminate all military schools, especially those expensive service academies $275M annual budget), and just send everyone to contracted training by the lowest bidder.
I’m lost. Are we really saying a SNA is stressed out that they can’t learn to fly by having to wear a uniform right and take a PFA once a year while in flight school? If so, that’s utterly idiotic.
And the ones in the squadron with below average military bearing also made some really bad decisions in the air. Might not have killed somebody but certainly weren’t given the advanced quals.
You left the service years ago. The invasive nature and amount of regulations with regards to collaterals has grown significantly. There is always some overhead to pay for a squadron to operate when it comes to collaterals, but some of them need reduced, elevated to a higher command, or deleted. Collateral jobs are not synonymous with having a successful military career or service.
I'd fucking puke if a collateral ever became a pillar of my time in service. Most of them are associated with a check-in-the-box mentality that offered very little impact because we don't monitor or assess for the effectiveness of these programs (with few exceptions). Once they're written in an order or administrative note - it's effectively set in stone, because no commander wants to be the one who is seen as increasing risk.
I'm still trying to understand what "collateral" duty a SNA has. Standing duty 1-3 times per command? Other than that, I can't think of one collateral duty I had, or any of my on-wings had, once training had started all throughout flight school. Even modern FRPs don't have collaterals other than standing a couple of watches, including the ever-taxing JMPS watch, where they always seemed to disappear when I needed them to unlock something for me.