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How many Naval Aviators have there been?
- Thread starter mattwieand
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Fly Navy said:Nah, that doesn't make you a worse pilot... but it makes your degree less important
(Electrical Engineer who wishes he minored/double majored in Political Science)
Less important how?
Edit: (Chemistry Major, math minor)
Fly Navy said:
lol ... fair enough
UInavy said:
You misquoted me UINAVY. I never said that "just anybody" could be a naval aviator. I said people with simple degrees and marginal GPA's could be a naval aviator, which is the truth if you look up the bio's of some naval aviators from that era. Of course they had to possess the drive and determination to make it through flight school and OCS, but they were given a shot.
I did not, nor was it my intention to impune those from prior eras. And whoever gave me negative feedback for that post needs to start being a man and sign their feedback. If you can't back up what you say, don't say it.
Godspeed said:
As someone who has a "simple degree" and had a "marginal GPA" (thanks to a previous non-simple degree), I take offense to your post. I think it shows a glaring ignorance to what it takes to go through flight school. But, I suppose that's to be expected on this site... where it is the status quo for those who have not done so to critique those who have or are doing so.
GPAs and majors have little to do with one's success in flight school, just as they have little to do with one's intelligence. To imply that such factors are overcome by hard work and determination sounds a little belittlng to some.... akin to "you're dumb, but you work hard and that makes it ok."
think about it.
guys guys guys... listen godspeed isnt trying to put anyone in the retard bus, he makes a good point. it is much harder to get in now a days than it was even 10 years ago, and i share the same frustration of having to work 7x harder than someone flying tomcats right now did a while back, just to even get the chance. that in no way is degrating their service or their efforts, it's just a different time and we're annoyed that it's different for us. we're all patriots and we all have to go through the same crap to get where we wanna be so lets not bicker
squeeze said:
It is you who decided that your degree is simple, and your GPA is marginal. It is not my fault you look down upon yourself, it is yours.
I did not pretend to know, nor did I state anything about flight school or its difficulty. I have great admiration for those that have succeed in flight school, both past and present, and no where in my post did I suggest otherwise. I always have looked up to naval aviators, and I always will. NEVER in my post did I say anything about naval aviators being dumb but compensating by working hard. Please stop putting words in my mouth.
I believe that earning a "difficult" degree is a solid demonstration that someone posseses drive and determiniation. I also believe that if one is driven enough to accomplish something extremely difficult and formidable, he/she is also capable of accomplishing something else extremely difficult.
What I have heard from the naval aviators I know, as well as the experienced and credible sources on this forum, a direct link between how hard someone works in college and other aspects of life can be directly tied to how hard they work, and thus how well they do in flight school.
All of the main points in your post are YOUR interpretations and implications squeeze, not mine. I apologize that my post offended you and a couple other people. As I mentioned, this was not my intention.
All I meant to establish in my post, is that getting to flight school is harder than it has ever been. By mentioning this, I am discussing the differences of getting in to flight school now, as opposed to the past. Isn't that what this forum is about? Naval aviation?
well said, but do you see my point? we know damn well what we are getting ourselves into. we know damn well how much work, sweat, and long tired nights we are, and going to be putting into this career. each generation has different standards to live up to, personally i dont give a flying f*ck who did what or when, because i want to fly and im going to do what it takes, and so will everyone else. but dont rag on the kid for venting. it's a frustrating process and i, nor did godspeed mean to downplay your or past generations accomplishments. if it were up to me, i would be flying in korea with nothing but steam gauges and if i were lucky an ejection seat.
Yes, this forum is about Naval Aviation. But what everyone is missing, and UI and the others are trying to put across, is that everyone in the flight program has had to surmount quite a few hurdles to get where they are. It is NOT easy, from service selection at NROTC and USNA, to fighting for a slot out of OCS, and those blue shirts working hard for those Aviation slots out of STA (many congrats to all of you BTW, just saw the list put out). No one has a perfect package, everyone sweated about some aspect, whether it was grades, major, interviews, physical, eyes, or the infamous ASTB, you name it.Godspeed said:
Then you hit API, and there are those that want to take it easy, and of course, they are HISTORY or somehow make it to Primary, and bam, they don't keep up. I am talking about the determination to make it through the challenging program that is the US Navy's Flight School pipeline. This process of training, flying, studying, getting evaluated by your peers and instructors continues through all of the pipeline and the Fleet, as we continue to work at maintaining those Wings of Gold.
I'm not hitting you on your statement, but I think you don't have the historical perspective, heck I have been in close to 15 years, and I bet bunk, frumby and the other senior guys here have even more insight than I do. But back in the late 80s, if you didn't have 20/20 and ever other thing going for you, tough luck you weren't getting in. So you have all these ppl that made it through the program, and then BLACK FRIDAY (or whatever day of the week it was), and ~400+ Naval Aviators in the program were told, sorry, it was nice knowing you, but we don't need you. Nice... Then you have the T-Notch guys, a few that I ran across and are friends of mine in P3s and were lucky enough to get a plane slot after they finished Jets and were told once again, sorry we don't need you.
So now, we go through all these cycles, what's competitive, what's not. But you still have all these waivers that didn't exist when I made it in, such as vision up to 20/40, vice the old 20/30, and also the PRK option. The window is open now to a MUCH wider % of ppl.
I can't change it, you can't change it, so you have to do what you can to make yourself as competitive as possible, and hope for the best. We are all supposed to be Type A personalities, so I question the individual that says its too hard, or why should I even apply... damnit, you won't know until you try. We have ppl on this board that have crawled through broken glass and beat their head against the wall to make it where they are today (patmack and dave shutter come to mind), I want those guys in the wardroom with me.
In no way am I coming down on you, I am just expanding on the thoughts expressed by UI. A number of the ppl on this website, aspiring Naval Aviators, don't understand who they are talking to. You have ppl who have busted their ass to get where they are, and are continuing to do it or god knows they are going to get attrited or washed, or look like slackers to the rest of the wardroom for not knowing their ****. We do NOT have all the answers, but we are here of our own free time to spread info, and help out the next group. Give their comments the weight they are due.
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