MasterBates
Well-Known Member
He's not Aviation.
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How many pilots are prior enlisted?
- Thread starter Ventus
- Start date
A few things/Questions:
1) Why would I go Army WO when I would have my degree and could go regular Army Commissioned Officer?
2) @Hal Pilot, with respect sir, the only reason I would go Marine Enlisted is to earn that title of Marine, pick up experience for a few years, and hopefully wait out this "no air contracts for OCC" thing. Then I could submit my package for OCC if and when they opened up Air Contracts again. By then I would be even more physically fit, know how the Marine Corps works, and I would have some leadership experience under my belt.
3) I've always thought it would be cool to serve at least one tour on a Navy ship as part of an MEU or fly off of one. Also most Navy/Marine Corps bases are on the coast and places I would like to live later in life where as there are Army bases peppered all throughout the middle of the U.S.
3) @Renegade One, Absolutely not. I would be very happy with NFO if I could not be a pilot first. Hornet, Prowler, or second seat in a Cobra would be excellent I think. I actually contracted in Marine OCS as an NFO first but failed to be selected by the board.
4) @ HueyCobra, I agree that Army aviation is something worth looking into if my only goal is flying. And I do have to admit, many of my "brainwashing" against the Army is the whole "people who join the army weren't good enough for the marines" deal, which I know is not the case comparing the whole of one service to the other. But, that picture...lol. Haha but man I think flying MH-6's for Special Operations would be one of the coolest jobs.
I also confess, every time I do one of those "career apps" on military sites to figure out what you're most interested in, Aviation and Combat are the top two choices. So basically I want to shoot guns AND fly. (very juvenile, i know) The Marines seems like a way for me to have my cake and eat it too...if Air Contracts were still up.
Also MasterBates I like your thing under your name about article 88 haha.
1) Why would I go Army WO when I would have my degree and could go regular Army Commissioned Officer?
2) @Hal Pilot, with respect sir, the only reason I would go Marine Enlisted is to earn that title of Marine, pick up experience for a few years, and hopefully wait out this "no air contracts for OCC" thing. Then I could submit my package for OCC if and when they opened up Air Contracts again. By then I would be even more physically fit, know how the Marine Corps works, and I would have some leadership experience under my belt.
3) I've always thought it would be cool to serve at least one tour on a Navy ship as part of an MEU or fly off of one. Also most Navy/Marine Corps bases are on the coast and places I would like to live later in life where as there are Army bases peppered all throughout the middle of the U.S.
3) @Renegade One, Absolutely not. I would be very happy with NFO if I could not be a pilot first. Hornet, Prowler, or second seat in a Cobra would be excellent I think. I actually contracted in Marine OCS as an NFO first but failed to be selected by the board.
4) @ HueyCobra, I agree that Army aviation is something worth looking into if my only goal is flying. And I do have to admit, many of my "brainwashing" against the Army is the whole "people who join the army weren't good enough for the marines" deal, which I know is not the case comparing the whole of one service to the other. But, that picture...lol. Haha but man I think flying MH-6's for Special Operations would be one of the coolest jobs.
I also confess, every time I do one of those "career apps" on military sites to figure out what you're most interested in, Aviation and Combat are the top two choices. So basically I want to shoot guns AND fly. (very juvenile, i know) The Marines seems like a way for me to have my cake and eat it too...if Air Contracts were still up.
Also MasterBates I like your thing under your name about article 88 haha.
Sapper!
Excuse the BS...
Have you seen the competition for WOFT? Most WOs would laugh in your face, they get more time shaking sticks and supporting their ground guys from the air than any other service and they don't need a TAC to fall on the sword in order to pull the trigger. A large portion of WOs have their degrees, they have professional career schools, and their own degree completion program. OH and not to mention they can go to Navy test pilot school and they have their own special operations aviation regiment that fly their asses off. I remember hearing that there is an exchange program for the Marines to go fly with the 160th even and the Army has even gotten a few converts out of the deal (mainly because they fly their asses off!) A very close friend of mine just got picked up for NTPS, he is a WO with almost 4k hours after 8 years of flying, did I mention he was a Marine before becoming an Army aviator? I get it, you have your degree and think you are too good for something, so be it. My old BN commander was an LT who switched to WO ranks to fly for the TN guard and then jumped back to O ranks to go to staff work and later lead our BN in OEF. Crock of shit right there but let's see if you put your money where your mouth is. I'm not bitter but this bullshit of treating Army pukes like they are terds is enough, I don't see any other branch turning out 15-18 month deployments and keeping their retention up. F&*(#me sideways.
I have not seen the competition for WOFT. I had no idea it was as competitive as you say it is. I always assumed it was what high school kids did who didn't want to or couldn't get their degree first. The "High School to Flight School" program or something. And yes I understand that the 160th SOAR has a highly skilled group of pilots, but it sounds like those are very specific circumstances your friend went through. Also, I had no idea they could go to navy test pilot school.
I never implied or stated that I was "too good" for WOFT. Only that I had considered it before but decided against it so I could get my degree and fly in another branch. I was always told that "if you can go officer, then go officer." The only real solid things I have against the Army are that I have interests that I can't do in the Army. Fly off of or serve on a ship at least once for example. Or have a higher chance to live on the coast. Also I would prefer not to turn out a deployment longer than 15 months but so be it. I understand that Army Aviators are a highly elite part of the Army, but I don't think the "treating Army pukes like they are terds" part is against the Aviators.
Bottom line, my preferences of service have the Army listed at the bottom. No disrespect to anyone who is in the Army or has served the Army, but it just doesn't feel like it is for me.
I never implied or stated that I was "too good" for WOFT. Only that I had considered it before but decided against it so I could get my degree and fly in another branch. I was always told that "if you can go officer, then go officer." The only real solid things I have against the Army are that I have interests that I can't do in the Army. Fly off of or serve on a ship at least once for example. Or have a higher chance to live on the coast. Also I would prefer not to turn out a deployment longer than 15 months but so be it. I understand that Army Aviators are a highly elite part of the Army, but I don't think the "treating Army pukes like they are terds" part is against the Aviators.
Bottom line, my preferences of service have the Army listed at the bottom. No disrespect to anyone who is in the Army or has served the Army, but it just doesn't feel like it is for me.
Bull shit. You said being an Army Warrant Officer would be a step backward and that if you went that route, you would have failed.
BTW, WOs are officers. W-1 holds a warrant (hence the name) and W–2 through W-5 are commissioned.
I think you guys are being a bit harsh and dog piling on this kid. Give him a f'ing break. He has some legit questions and is excited, albeit highly misinformed about some aviation career fields. I don't mind having fun and squashing d-bags, but this seems to be a thread where people are picking on this guy just because he doesn''t prefer your path. He has been pretty tactful. Cut him some slack.
BREAK BREAK
There are a lot of different ways to skin this cat. If you do some searching around, you will see that going Enlisted is a long, difficult road if being an officer and flying are your goals. You will have to prove yourself with years of difficult service prior to even applying, and the competition these days is extremely tough. Lots of enlisted troops have their degree. You also don''t want to be the PFC who won't shut his suck about being a pilot. It will earn you nothing but grief and won't do anything to help you along your path.
My advice would be to search around the different services. Army WO is a great field if you want to fly a lot of hours and be in the fight, the Navy is still hiring, Marines may decide to start taking Aviation contracts next week. Fact of the matter is, you may go to flight school, find out you suck at flying, and end up either flying something totally different (without guns) or driving a desk full of boot chits as a supply officer.
Do some searching of old threads on this site, there is a wealth of knowledge there. Good luck.
BREAK BREAK
There are a lot of different ways to skin this cat. If you do some searching around, you will see that going Enlisted is a long, difficult road if being an officer and flying are your goals. You will have to prove yourself with years of difficult service prior to even applying, and the competition these days is extremely tough. Lots of enlisted troops have their degree. You also don''t want to be the PFC who won't shut his suck about being a pilot. It will earn you nothing but grief and won't do anything to help you along your path.
My advice would be to search around the different services. Army WO is a great field if you want to fly a lot of hours and be in the fight, the Navy is still hiring, Marines may decide to start taking Aviation contracts next week. Fact of the matter is, you may go to flight school, find out you suck at flying, and end up either flying something totally different (without guns) or driving a desk full of boot chits as a supply officer.
Do some searching of old threads on this site, there is a wealth of knowledge there. Good luck.
Clearly, the answer is 3.
Not so juvenile at all!! Just remember to never, NEVER EVER, disregard your Rules of Engagement!! ROE's are crucial to winning battles and/or wars. ;-)
And don't forget to excel in performing your ground/collateral duties as well.
And "I is capitalized ...and "seems" is correctly seem ...
As has been noted, you're making a lot of "final" decisions based on misinformation. Many have been addressed above, but I'm not quite sure you're believing them. Also, I've done two deployments where the Army operated off our ship for a few days. Forgetting 160th stuff, yes, it's not an everyday thing for the Army, but they do fly off of a ship, depending on where they're located.
Just make sure your preferences are based on reality. I'm not a huge fan of the AF (or big Army, for that matter), but that doesn't mean I wouldn't be willing to go fly AF Pavehawks or Army Scouts if it meant I would get to keep flying AND actually have a mission that's pretty satisfying/important.
For the curious, google Lcpl Foote. A short but interesting read on his brief, but also intersting career as a Marine Attack Pilot!
BzB
That's a pretty cool story haha.
But back to my original question sort of. Is it really that hard to go to OCS from Enlisted to Officer? It seems like the general consensus with the Marine side is to just try for OCC again and not to enlist first.
If that's the case I might try for Air Force, Navy, or Army then.
My friend who is going Ground to OCC says just to come with him ground just to get commissioned, and switch to pilot further down the line. I have no idea if this is even possible though. Can ground officers who already have an MOS apply for flight training or is that unheard of?
But back to my original question sort of. Is it really that hard to go to OCS from Enlisted to Officer? It seems like the general consensus with the Marine side is to just try for OCC again and not to enlist first.
If that's the case I might try for Air Force, Navy, or Army then.
My friend who is going Ground to OCC says just to come with him ground just to get commissioned, and switch to pilot further down the line. I have no idea if this is even possible though. Can ground officers who already have an MOS apply for flight training or is that unheard of?
Not unheard of. The process for converting from a ground MOS to an aviation MOS is handled via a Field Accession Board that is run by HQMC(Aviation). See the link for details (http://www.marines.mil/news/messages/Pages/MARADMIN250-12.aspx/)
As you can see there are only 2 slots on the FY-13 board, so its definitely a competitive process.
Also, not really answering your questions, but just so you know there are no nfo's in cobras, they're both pilots.
exNavyOffRec
Well-Known Member
If you want to fly apply to everyone, the USN has no shortage of spots for people with good GPA's and good ASTB's, I have never had a person with an 8 or 9 turned down.