How much more or less in-depth is the flight physical when starting flight training at Pensacola

[enjoyerofnaps]

USMC Pilot contract here,
I got back from NAMI about a month ago and everything went fine and I didn't need waivers, however I was told that my vision wasn't as good as I thought and I will need to wear contacts or glasses, however I am curious what would be the case if my vision regresses past 20/40? Would I need to get LASIK or would I be redesigned? the flight surgeon told me in quote "don't worry we have waivers for that when you're back here", also what happens to officers that fail a physical at NAMI after TBS and does that happen often?

 

[FormerRecruitingGuru]

USMC Pilot contract here,
I got back from NAMI about a month ago and everything went fine and I didn't need waivers, however I was told that my vision wasn't as good as I thought and I will need to wear contacts or glasses, however I am curious what would be the case if my vision regresses past 20/40? Would I need to get LASIK or would I be redesigned? the flight surgeon told me in quote "don't worry we have waivers for that when you're back here", also what happens to officers that fail a physical at NAMI after TBS and does that happen often?

Welcome to the forum. If no one responds here, you might be able to find your answers both on the NAMI and Marine Corps career development side around here.

Similar questions, use the search function first. Good luck!

 

[PhrogPhlyer]

Would I need to get LASIK or would I be redesigned? the flight surgeon told me in quote "don't worry we have waivers for that when you're back here", also what happens to officers that fail a physical at NAMI after TBS and does that happen often?

The BuMed aviation vision standards are in the following chart (from 2021, so might not be the most current).
As what happens if you fail vision, which does occur quite often, this could depend on your contract.
It could mean NFO, if vision is acceptable for such, or another MOS. Again, dependent on what you contract you signed.
Back in the dark ages, I remember that for the Corps, if I didn't complete flight training, for any reason, I would become an infantry officer for my contract years.
Talk to your Officer Recruitment personnel. They will have the exact answer.

 

[enjoyerofnaps]

The BuMed aviation vision standards are in the following chart (from 2021, so might not be the most current).
As what happens if you fail vision, which does occur quite often, this could depend on your contract.
It could mean NFO, if vision is acceptable for such, or another MOS. Again, dependent on what you contract you signed.
Back in the dark ages, I remember that for the Corps, if I didn't complete flight training, for any reason, I would become an infantry officer for my contract years.
Talk to your Officer Recruitment personnel. They will have the exact answer.

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So I wouldn’t be able to let’s say, get LASIK and just wait? I was told I had 20/20 vision on the civilian side but at NAMI they said I was kinda close :/, I’ll definitely talk to my OSO about but I’m not sure what the Capt. at NAMI was talking about when he said there are waivers for when I’m there.

 

[PhrogPhlyer]

I’ll definitely talk to my OSO

Best thing to do at this point.
I wish you luck as you start this journey.
My time in the Corps as an Officer and Aviator defines much of who I am to this very day.

 

[FormerRecruitingGuru]

Talk to your Officer Recruitment personnel

The OP already commissioned. How can an officer recruiter / OSO help him?

 

[enjoyerofnaps]

Best thing to do at this point.

The OP already commissioned. How can an officer recruiter / OSO help him?

Technically I have not commissioned but I’ve finished PLC and am NAMI qualified, however I still have TBS, it could be a year or two when I go to NAMI again,

 

[PhrogPhlyer]

I’ve finished PLC and am NAMI qualified, however I still have TBS

A lot can happen during this time. I had a TBS classmate who damaged an eye during a night compass/map exercise. Ended his flight guarantee in a split second. My best recommendation is to verify what your "contract" says, and be the best you can be while at TBS. Remember, we are Officers of Marines first and foremost. The fact we get to push metal through the sky is an added benefit.

 

[enjoyerofnaps]

A lot can happen during this time. I had a TBS classmate who damaged an eye during a night compass/map exercise. Ended his flight guarantee in a split second. My best recommendation is to verify what your "contract" says, and be the best you can be while at TBS. Remember, we are Officers of Marines first and foremost. The fact we get to push metal through the sky is an added benefit.

Got it, just looking for some reassurance, I see you have your wings, so just if you had any input to see if the NAMI Capt was fucking with me, I asked him if I should get a LASIK touch up and he told me no, but I’m having trouble and obviously it’s concerning to me

 

[PhrogPhlyer]

just looking for some reassurance

If you got though PLC (still used Camp Upshur in my day) then you're well on your way. Finish college, accept your commission, report to TBS (where you go from "candidate" to "Lieutendidate") and then report to your Training Squadron. You won't have the T-28 I had, but the T-6A looks like quite a fun aircraft. Would love to take that out on an aerobatic solo... it screams to be anywhere but straight and level.

 

[Gatordev]

So I wouldn’t be able to let’s say, get LASIK and just wait? I was told I had 20/20 vision on the civilian side but at NAMI they said I was kinda close :/, I’ll definitely talk to my OSO about but I’m not sure what the Capt. at NAMI was talking about when he said there are waivers for when I’m there.

Let's break it down to more digestible bits:

First, definitions. When you're at the point that you are now, you're an "applicant." You will be an applicant until right after you have your actual NAMI physical when you report to NIFE. After that, you'll be considered a "SNA" for medical purposes. And yes, even though you have done your NAMI physical, you'll still get another one. How in depth they go can really depend, but generally it's a "short-form" physical (vs a "long-form" physical, which you get every 5 years). Sometimes it might even be less than a short-form.

As an "applicant," you have different standards than as a SNA. You also have different standards for a winged pilot. Those standards on delineated in the NAMI Waiver Guide (it can be Googled or also found here on AW). If you don't meet one of those standards, you may either need a waiver or be DQ'ed. Again, that's spelled out in the waiver guide.

So, now for vision... If you don't meet the 20/20 standard (along with all of the other items mentioned in that chart above) but are still less than 20/40, then you need a waiver. That waiver is as simple as "Requires corrective lenses for flight." Anyone and everyone, from SNA to the Airboss, has that waiver, so it's not a big deal. You'll be reissued that waiver every year when you get your flight physical and it's put right on the Up-Chit.

All that said, what was your actual acuity?

 

[enjoyerofnaps]

Let's break it down to more digestible bits:

First, definitions. When you're at the point that you are now, you're an "applicant." You will be an applicant until right after you have your actual NAMI physical when you report to NIFE. After that, you'll be considered a "SNA" for medical purposes. And yes, even though you have done your NAMI physical, you'll still get another one. How in depth they go can really depend, but generally it's a "short-form" physical (vs a "long-form" physical, which you get every 5 years). Sometimes it might even be less than a short-form.

As an "applicant," you have different standards than as a SNA. You also have different standards for a winged pilot. Those standards on delineated in the NAMI Waiver Guide (it can be Googled or also found here on AW). If you don't meet one of those standards, you may either need a waiver or be DQ'ed. Again, that's spelled out in the waiver guide.

So, now for vision... If you don't meet the 20/20 standard (along with all of the other items mentioned in that chart above) but are still less than 20/40, then you need a waiver. That waiver is as simple as "Requires corrective lenses for flight." Anyone and everyone, from SNA to the Airboss, has that waiver, so it's not a big deal. You'll be reissued that waiver every year when you get your flight physical and it's put right on the Up-Chit.

All that said, what was your actual acuity?

Got it, so it’s basically the same thing as it’s just NAMI 2.0?

Well, for my vision it’s weird, a month before my NAMI appointment I had a check up with my optometrist miraculously and decided to ease my nerves and go, I printed out the whole NAMI packet and told him to look through it and let me know, I even gave him my LASIK documents too, he said everything was fine and I had 20/20 worst case 20/25, however when I got to NAMI I remember the vision test being wildly different and I did struggle a tad bit, however when they put the 20/40 on the screen I saw it perfectly fine, but when I did my own test with the captain he said I was “close ish” however I don’t recall if I meant close to failing or passing :/ and then gave the spew about how there are waivers and how I shouldn’t get a touch up on LASIK. I’m genuinely trying not to worry about it but that’s how I am

 

[FormerRecruitingGuru]

Technically I have not commissioned but I’ve finished PLC and am NAMI qualified, however I still have TBS, it could be a year or two when I go to NAMI again,

I got the USMC nomenclature mixed up… for some odd reason I thought you already commissioned. My bust!

So is your concern is the fact you passed NAMI but worried down the road? Not trying to downplay your concern and your question/concern (“I’m qualified today but what happens in ____ timeframe”) has been asked and posted quite frequently.

If you passed and the NAMI doc hasn’t provided any corrective feedback, I mean, it sounds like you’re good to go. You really can’t let this get to you either, even if USMC aviation has been your dream since you were 6 months old.

Of course, I don’t have shiny wings or double anchors (NFOs), but there are qualified folks who have chimed in here. Good luck!

 

[enjoyerofnaps]

I got the USMC nomenclature mixed up… for some odd reason I thought you already commissioned. My bust!

So is your concern is the fact you passed NAMI but worried down the road? Not trying to downplay your concern and your question/concern (“I’m qualified today but what happens in ____ timeframe”) has been asked and posted quite frequently.

If you passed and the NAMI doc hasn’t provided any corrective feedback, I mean, it sounds like you’re good to go. You really can’t let this get to you either, even if USMC aviation has been your dream since you were 6 months old.

Of course, I don’t have shiny wings or double anchors (NFOs), but there are qualified folks who have chimed in here. Good luck!

Thank you, and you are correct, bad habit that’s plagued me my whole life about worrying about things that haven’t happened yet or never will. obviously it’s marine corps officer first pilot second

 

[Mouselovr]

When you check into Pensacola, the check in "flight physical" consists of basic vitals (BP/temp etc) and legit a 1 minute eye test.

They give you an upchit and then you're on the annual upchit schedule that you'll do for the rest of your career based on birth month. Even long-form upchit (done at 25,30,35+ or after long downing periods) are a fraction of the true initial flight physical you have already cleared.

If you were to see worse than 20/40 at the Pensacola check in, they'll have you come on another day to make sure you weren't having an off day.
After that, you can either go get LASIK/PRK and they'll keep you as SNA or redes.

If you pass your check in flight physical and are worried about deteriorating eyes/ don't wont to wear glasses, you can easily get surgery.

Dont worry about it. They arent trying to getcha with basic medical.
When I went to NAMI at Navy OCS, the doc told me my astigmatism was right on the edge, that I was barely qualified and should get surgery. When I asked the Pcola flight docs about LASIK/PRK, my eyes had never been "barely qualified".... so sometimes the docs are weird and wrong.

I've never had an issue with my eye exams on upchits since. I just need to wear glasses in the plane.