Difficult, but from what I'm told it's not impossible. I'd call the unit and ask them what would be involved in that.
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Just HOW difficult is the A&M Corps of Cadets? (I'm needing some advice)
- Thread starter AirAggie92
- Start date
Difficult, but from what I'm told it's not impossible. I'd call the unit and ask them what would be involved in that.
In my 4 years there, there was never a non-reg in NROTC. I don't know if it is possible or not, I'm just saying it never happened. The exception being 5th years who already finished the corps, as well as the STA-21 and MECEP guys.
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
I graduated from the Corps of Cadets at Texas A&M many years ago. I've been in the Marine Corps ever since.
The two are completely different.
That said, I enjoyed it, learned a lot, and had a great time.
The things I learned at A&M in the Corps of Cadets that directly helped me (to varying degrees) in the Marine Corps are as follows:
1) Teamwork and accomplishing a cumulative effort. (Big help)
2) How to follow/work for somebody that is either a total asshole or has no idea what he's talking about...... or both. (Very helpful at OCS/TBS, but only helps dull the pain since then)
3) Preparation for USMC OCS. (EXREMELY helpful. Lots of PT and access to the same challenges...drill instructors, obstacle course, weapons handling, gouge, land nav, etc)
4) Discipline. (helpful, mostly because I made a ton of mistakes that would have had more serious consequences if I was actually in the military)
5) A better sense of honor (a little helpful, since by the time you're 18 you should have SOME idea not to lie/cheat/steal instilled by your parents. What helped was how it showed me how important your personal honor is to your job as a leader)
6) Study habits. (Helpful, but I should have learned them better anyway. I would have failed out if it weren't for the Corps of Cadets. I had ZERO study habits before)
7) How to eat really fast. (Again, very helpful at OCS, but is rarely a talent I need much anymore)
8) How to polish shoes/boots. (see above for helpfulness)
If you're looking for a place that will turn you into the next Chesty Puller, you won't find that at any one place. If you're looking for a place that will give you some kind of edge at flight school or getting into the flight program.....I don't think it exists.
Some other things that I "got out of the Corps of Cadets" but didn't directly affect my life in the real military:
1) Some of the best friends I have.
2) A lot of character building moments.
3) A lot of fun and some of the best experiences of my life thus far.
Being in the Corps of Cadets was great for me. It fit my needs and suited my personality. I would recommend it to you, but only if you transfer as a fish and go all the way through it. The fish year is hardest, but that's where most of the best parts are. Don't be one of those clowns who transfers and skates out of fish year. It's rare, but they never truly fit in.
Having said that, A&M and the Corps of Cadets has not by any means cornered the market on military leadership training, education, or the college experience as a whole. Not even close. It's a great school with a rich tradition and history, but so are a great many other schools and student activities that do similar things in much different ways. You could learn all of the same things that I did in a different way and in a different place.
If you want some (somewhat) unsolicited advice, I'd say either do it (or don't) because of what you want to learn and experience. College is your way to learn a ton of lessons both in and out of the classroom and make it to the next level. I did it at A&M. YOU do it for yourself. If you decide NOT to transfer or join the Corps of Cadets, that's fine if that's what best suits you. Just don't avoid it because you're scared of it. It's hard, but it's not THAT hard. It's minimal compared to USMC or USN OCS. Minimal. If you can't make it in the Corps of Cadets, you'd never in a million years make it through OCS. One thing I always did when I was about to do something intimidating (OCS, solo, Carrier Qual, SERE, etc) is to look around for somebody who'd already done it and ask myself, "If he did it, why can't I?" You'll always find somebody smaller/weaker/dumber/less motivated around that made it through whatever you're about to to. If he can do it, so can you.
What you're in now is nowhere near the same as A&M College Station and the Corps of Cadets. No offense there, it's just the truth. You might visit the Campus and the Quad and look around. They even have a "spend the night with the Corps" program for HS seniors so that they can see some of what's in store for them. Not sure if they do it for transfers, but you can always ask.
TAMUG is a good school, but it's totally different. It's the same for any of the "branch campuses" out there. Going to UT Arlington is NOT the same as going to UT Austin. You'd think that something so simple would be easily understood, but it's not. I hear "Hook Em Horns" from a ton of assclowns who went to UT-A/UTSA/UT-Guapdalupe community college. Whatever. It's not the same.
I've served with, for, and in charge of graduates of many, many universities. The Aggies that rank among them all are over the page. Some were great, some not so much. Some of the worst leaders I've known went to USNA (and definitely some of the best). Some of my most admired leaders went to the likes of Chico State, Coe College, and Salisbury State. I never even heard of those schools until I met them.
College matters, but it's what you do with what you learn that really counts.
PM me if you have any particular questions.
The two are completely different.
That said, I enjoyed it, learned a lot, and had a great time.
The things I learned at A&M in the Corps of Cadets that directly helped me (to varying degrees) in the Marine Corps are as follows:
1) Teamwork and accomplishing a cumulative effort. (Big help)
2) How to follow/work for somebody that is either a total asshole or has no idea what he's talking about...... or both. (Very helpful at OCS/TBS, but only helps dull the pain since then)
3) Preparation for USMC OCS. (EXREMELY helpful. Lots of PT and access to the same challenges...drill instructors, obstacle course, weapons handling, gouge, land nav, etc)
4) Discipline. (helpful, mostly because I made a ton of mistakes that would have had more serious consequences if I was actually in the military)
5) A better sense of honor (a little helpful, since by the time you're 18 you should have SOME idea not to lie/cheat/steal instilled by your parents. What helped was how it showed me how important your personal honor is to your job as a leader)
6) Study habits. (Helpful, but I should have learned them better anyway. I would have failed out if it weren't for the Corps of Cadets. I had ZERO study habits before)
7) How to eat really fast. (Again, very helpful at OCS, but is rarely a talent I need much anymore)
8) How to polish shoes/boots. (see above for helpfulness)
If you're looking for a place that will turn you into the next Chesty Puller, you won't find that at any one place. If you're looking for a place that will give you some kind of edge at flight school or getting into the flight program.....I don't think it exists.
Some other things that I "got out of the Corps of Cadets" but didn't directly affect my life in the real military:
1) Some of the best friends I have.
2) A lot of character building moments.
3) A lot of fun and some of the best experiences of my life thus far.
Being in the Corps of Cadets was great for me. It fit my needs and suited my personality. I would recommend it to you, but only if you transfer as a fish and go all the way through it. The fish year is hardest, but that's where most of the best parts are. Don't be one of those clowns who transfers and skates out of fish year. It's rare, but they never truly fit in.
Having said that, A&M and the Corps of Cadets has not by any means cornered the market on military leadership training, education, or the college experience as a whole. Not even close. It's a great school with a rich tradition and history, but so are a great many other schools and student activities that do similar things in much different ways. You could learn all of the same things that I did in a different way and in a different place.
If you want some (somewhat) unsolicited advice, I'd say either do it (or don't) because of what you want to learn and experience. College is your way to learn a ton of lessons both in and out of the classroom and make it to the next level. I did it at A&M. YOU do it for yourself. If you decide NOT to transfer or join the Corps of Cadets, that's fine if that's what best suits you. Just don't avoid it because you're scared of it. It's hard, but it's not THAT hard. It's minimal compared to USMC or USN OCS. Minimal. If you can't make it in the Corps of Cadets, you'd never in a million years make it through OCS. One thing I always did when I was about to do something intimidating (OCS, solo, Carrier Qual, SERE, etc) is to look around for somebody who'd already done it and ask myself, "If he did it, why can't I?" You'll always find somebody smaller/weaker/dumber/less motivated around that made it through whatever you're about to to. If he can do it, so can you.
What you're in now is nowhere near the same as A&M College Station and the Corps of Cadets. No offense there, it's just the truth. You might visit the Campus and the Quad and look around. They even have a "spend the night with the Corps" program for HS seniors so that they can see some of what's in store for them. Not sure if they do it for transfers, but you can always ask.
TAMUG is a good school, but it's totally different. It's the same for any of the "branch campuses" out there. Going to UT Arlington is NOT the same as going to UT Austin. You'd think that something so simple would be easily understood, but it's not. I hear "Hook Em Horns" from a ton of assclowns who went to UT-A/UTSA/UT-Guapdalupe community college. Whatever. It's not the same.
I've served with, for, and in charge of graduates of many, many universities. The Aggies that rank among them all are over the page. Some were great, some not so much. Some of the worst leaders I've known went to USNA (and definitely some of the best). Some of my most admired leaders went to the likes of Chico State, Coe College, and Salisbury State. I never even heard of those schools until I met them.
College matters, but it's what you do with what you learn that really counts.
PM me if you have any particular questions.
Can't speak much about Aggies except yes, they are fun to make fun of- I've met some who were awesome and some who were total DB's- just like every other college/commissioning source out there.
To answer your question. Many Naval Aviators don't come from a Corps of Cadets program (Most if you don't count the academy as one). It is absolutely not required to be a good officer. There are great officers who come from every source, and terrible ones who come from the same places. How good of an officer you are is going to depend on how you perform in the fleet. Nothing beforehand matters: sure, you may kick ass at being in the Corps, but on commissioning day you have the same butter bars as the worst guy there (and the same goes vice versa) and a clean record to fuck away or make shine.
A big part of being an officer and aviator is being able to adapt to the changing world around you. Things changed- maybe for the better. Take some time to see how things look once the dust settles and make an intelligent decision. If you can't stand the bullshit and things are supposedly worse in the Corps of Cadets- is that really the path you want to go down? Go talk to some of the aviation officers at your unit (you should have at least one LT aviation advisor) about some of the best and worst officers in the squadron they came from- and what backgrounds they had.
One of my NROTC roommates in college, when asked what his major was when he was a 4/c MIDN once responded "Getting into the Naval Academy". His entire goal his first semester was making himself a better candidate to get into. By the time the end of his first year in school, he had settled in and ended up loving live at school and in the NROTC program. The same thing could happen to you. If not, then you can always transfer.
AirAggie92
New Member
Are you saying not to frog in using squadron 18?
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
Yes. Absolutely.
Squadron 18 didn't exist when I was there, but if they are an "all frog" outfit I'm sure that they are ostracized. I've never heard of it. When I was there individuals frogged into any outfit that they wanted to. I never saw one who did well. Then again, they were exceedingly rare, so not many data points to draw conclusions from.
Go all the way, or don't go at all. Just my $.02.
If you can't go in as a fish, then don't bother. It'll take you 5 years to graduate anyway (most likely), so going in as a fish with sophmore hours will still work.
I really don't have a dog in this fight, so don't take this the wrong way. If you are the type that wants to get abused for 1-4 years, why not go to one of the academies and get a fairly big-name degree out of it? Outside of TX no one cares about Aggies except other Aggies. Same for VMI outside of VA and Citadel outside of SC. Everyone in the country, and the military, knows about Annapolis, West Point, and USAFA.
Not intended to be a threadjack, but perhaps it might make the OP think as well.
I'm a live-and-let-live kind of guy....you want to do crack, I don't care, just pick up your damn vials when you leave. If your journey of self-discovery or whatever leads you to a military institution, then so be it--just make sure you are doing it for the right reasons.
Not intended to be a threadjack, but perhaps it might make the OP think as well.
I'm a live-and-let-live kind of guy....you want to do crack, I don't care, just pick up your damn vials when you leave. If your journey of self-discovery or whatever leads you to a military institution, then so be it--just make sure you are doing it for the right reasons.
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
Inside of Texas, nobody cares what anybody outside of Texas thinks about anything.
Where the hell are the little smilies?
A few years ago, there were tourism commercials marketing, "Texas: a whole other country."
A medium-sized, oil-rich country with fundamentalist religion...
Sounds like Saudi Arabia could use the same pitch...
A medium-sized, oil-rich country with fundamentalist religion...
Sounds like Saudi Arabia could use the same pitch...
Phrog brings up a good point. Texas A&M, for all the brouhaha we Aggies try to stir up about it, it still a state school. Like many state schools, you're not going to get a lot of name recognition outside your state. If you want to go (back) to Texas after you're done with the military, you'll be able to use that a little more readily. Most Aggies (I think at last tally from the Association of Former Students the percentage was something like 80%) live in Texas and never left.
AirAggie92
New Member
Yes, I should've remembered that squadron 18 is a new outfit. If I go, I'd certainly join it because I would not being going as a fish with sophmore hours, it'd be more like junior hours (by the time I get to TAMU, I'll have 88 hours). It shortens your fish year to one semester: http://sq-18.aggiecorps.org/squadron-18/history
Yes this too is a good point. I do love living in Texas though, I like MUCH better than Colorado.
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
Ok. Well, after reading their website, it doesn't sound too terrible. If you legitimately get half a fish year, no matter where you come from, then it might work a little better than what I saw years ago.
How do you have 88 hours after being in college about 2 weeks? Is that what you will have after a year? Two? Are you including AP credits, etc?
After you figure out what you'll need to graduate, work backwards from there and THEN figure out what "year group" that will make you.
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
Oh, and one other thing......IF you end up going there......
Three things are important to you if you intend to get a commission through ROTC:
1) School. This means getting good grades in a decent major that interests you.
2) ROTC. This means about 25% of what you do in the Corps of Cadets (NROTC classes, etc)
3) Student activities. This means the other 75% of what you do in the Corps of Cadets. (shining shoes, getting yelled at, doing various moto pranks on upperclassmen, drinking beer, chasing girls, and general yut yut buffoonery).
Put your effort into those activites IN THE ORDER LISTED.
I did it in reverse and still graduated. While fun, it probably was not the wisest expenditure of my resources.
Three things are important to you if you intend to get a commission through ROTC:
1) School. This means getting good grades in a decent major that interests you.
2) ROTC. This means about 25% of what you do in the Corps of Cadets (NROTC classes, etc)
3) Student activities. This means the other 75% of what you do in the Corps of Cadets. (shining shoes, getting yelled at, doing various moto pranks on upperclassmen, drinking beer, chasing girls, and general yut yut buffoonery).
Put your effort into those activites IN THE ORDER LISTED.
I did it in reverse and still graduated. While fun, it probably was not the wisest expenditure of my resources.
AirAggie92
New Member
Thanks Harrier Dude, your advice has been great. I'm being told that if you're in the Corps there's no time for chasing girls though =)
Harrier Dude
Living the dream
Hopefully you're joking about that. Why do you think I spent so much of my time doing it? There may not be as much time as you'd like, but what time you have is very well rewarded. Quality over quantity.
It's still college. Not prison.