There are a few well-known instances where sociopaths or folks that did not believe they were doing wrong passed them, but fortunately folks like that are pretty rare.
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Lied at MEPS and applied to Federal Agency - Need to take polygraph soon
- Thread starter johnson96
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- lied meps security clearance sf-86
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There are a few well-known instances where sociopaths or folks that did not believe they were doing wrong passed them, but fortunately folks like that are pretty rare.
But big fish.
Ames and Hansen, they take a lie detector?
At my poly I remember the examiner telling me engineers are the worst. They actively try to think if they've ever told lie like it was a homework assignment for extra credit, not a check to see if you're trustworthy.
Yes and no, you don't need to be a big fish to cause serious damage nowadays unfortunately, Snowden and the Discord Dumbass have demonstrated that amply.
Pretty sure Ames did, not sure if Hansen took regular ones.
I get the basic premise and 'science' behind it and can see how some folks would mess with the desired results because of certain traits, but I don't pretend to know just how they really do the things they do or completely buy that they are effective tools. But it is what it is and 'mine is not to reason why', or something like that.
Here are the facts, I am not telling you what you should do one way or the other. For full disclosure, I disclosed my drug usage because I had an arrest on record (expunged, which caused a ton of issues but thats a different story) and didn’t know what clearance investigators had access to.
Polygraphs have been proven, thoroughly, to be incredibly unreliable and essentially pseudoscience. However, the federal government keeps using them as a tool to weed out easily nervous people who are not aware of that fact.
There are two types of polygraphs, and whether you get one or the other or both depends on the federal agency you’re applying to and the position. There is a CI, or counter-intelligence, polygraph where you will be asked questions about foreign contacts, travel you’ve done, if you’re a terrorist, etc. which focuses on if you’re essentially a spy or have connections to other countries whether it be financial or personal.
Then there is a lifestyle polygraph which asks questions about drug usage, sexual preferences, etc. which is designed to see if you lied about any questions relating to that/if you are a “good fit” which really means if you are considered a well-balanced individual without quirks, kinks, or blackmailable habits.
The navy will not polygraph you for either, unless you are under some kind of investigation or possibly require specific TS readins or a higher clearance than a basic TS-SCI. That stands true for 99% of Navy personnel. I’m sure there are some billets that might poly you but I’ve never come across anyone who fit that description.
Navy TS investigators will likely be able to see any information you give the federal government. If there are inconsistencies that they find, this will be a problem.
You are in a sticky situation as you’ve already got an interim secret and didn’t disclose information that the federal agency you’re applying to will likely be able to see.
What you do is up to you. It would have been easier to just tell the truth but we’re past that now. You can always tell your recruiter that you wish to disclose information now and see what they do, it may or may not affect your application and current clearance.
Polygraphs have been proven, thoroughly, to be incredibly unreliable and essentially pseudoscience. However, the federal government keeps using them as a tool to weed out easily nervous people who are not aware of that fact.
There are two types of polygraphs, and whether you get one or the other or both depends on the federal agency you’re applying to and the position. There is a CI, or counter-intelligence, polygraph where you will be asked questions about foreign contacts, travel you’ve done, if you’re a terrorist, etc. which focuses on if you’re essentially a spy or have connections to other countries whether it be financial or personal.
Then there is a lifestyle polygraph which asks questions about drug usage, sexual preferences, etc. which is designed to see if you lied about any questions relating to that/if you are a “good fit” which really means if you are considered a well-balanced individual without quirks, kinks, or blackmailable habits.
The navy will not polygraph you for either, unless you are under some kind of investigation or possibly require specific TS readins or a higher clearance than a basic TS-SCI. That stands true for 99% of Navy personnel. I’m sure there are some billets that might poly you but I’ve never come across anyone who fit that description.
Navy TS investigators will likely be able to see any information you give the federal government. If there are inconsistencies that they find, this will be a problem.
You are in a sticky situation as you’ve already got an interim secret and didn’t disclose information that the federal agency you’re applying to will likely be able to see.
What you do is up to you. It would have been easier to just tell the truth but we’re past that now. You can always tell your recruiter that you wish to disclose information now and see what they do, it may or may not affect your application and current clearance.
kaldor2c7
IWC CW Mustang
Navy 1810/1815 require TS/SCI w CI Poly
RockTopper
New Member
Can we get an update on what COA was chosen and what happened?
FormerRecruitingGuru
Making Recruiting Great Again
Why? So you can do the same? lol
RockTopper
New Member
you have nothing better to do than be a negative nancy?
FormerRecruitingGuru
Making Recruiting Great Again
It's not being negative advising someone not to lie on their application. If you don't have a sense of integrity, perhaps you ought to explore other options outside of the military.
RockTopper
New Member
The COAs were:
- Stick to what I said & not to admit anything on the polygraph (which could mean I fail the poly and am banned from the agency)
- Drop the Federal Agency application (which could leave me without a job with the Navy if denied for my OCS program)
- Admit to the usage during the polygraph and paperwork (if I get into OCS and choose that path then I may run into issues when they do the top secret clearance down the road OR possibly DQ entry into OCS for lying at MEPS???)
- Any other ideas?
facts > ideas
RockTopper
New Member
I agree. That’s what I was trying to get at with the “understanding all of the facts in this case and what happened, I think, are important when considering an important career jeopardizing decision.”
5. IF they ask on the polygraph then be simple…I misunderstood the drug use question and provided an incorrect answer. I have used drugs on X occasions.
There is zero need to toss your recruiter under the bus. Just say you “thought”’that recreational use a long time ago didn’t need to be reported. You are being a bit of a child over this…you aren’t the first and you won’t be the last. Just DON’T double down on the low.
"Good idea" -ADM Burke
AdamSmith1776
Member
Borrowing this thread to ask an urgent question. Thought it would be a good idea to lie about drug history to my recruiter, so went ahead and checked "No" on my first few forms, including the SF-86. I am headed to MEPS tomorrow and this is not sitting right with me, I want to correct my mistake before it's too late. My total use history is below waiver parameters, so I don't think that is the issue, just that I lied about it before. I am correcting my SF-86 because I still have access, and I am going to email my recruiter right now because I can't get through to them, business day is over.
My question is: is it already too late? Will they have the wrong forms at MEPS already and will I be shooting myself in the foot by trying to correct it? I am going to tell the truth either way, I am really just looking for some peace of mind or advice on how to handle this situation.
My question is: is it already too late? Will they have the wrong forms at MEPS already and will I be shooting myself in the foot by trying to correct it? I am going to tell the truth either way, I am really just looking for some peace of mind or advice on how to handle this situation.
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