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NWA Turns Back

Schnugg

It's gettin' a bit dramatic 'round here...
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
With these guys in charge I'm surprised they didn't crash....


humor....:D
 

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Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
What if they take the gun?

I don't think that's going to matter. If they overpower you and you didn't have a gun, they still have the plane...

Not a valid point. (Not picking on you, I've just heard that argument before and it's just not... valid)
 

raptor10

Philosoraptor
Contributor
I don't think that's going to matter. If they overpower you and you didn't have a gun, they still have the plane...

Not a valid point. (Not picking on you, I've just heard that argument before and it's just not... valid)

But it would make it harder to retake the plane... which I have made up my mind that in that situation I would.
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
But it would make it harder to retake the plane... which I have made up my mind that in that situation I would.
You guys -- as pax -- need to resist IMMEDIATELY if the goblins strike again and you're on board. No re-taking airplanes as you'll NEVER let "them" take over in the first place ... at least that's the game plan you should be working towards ... :)

And the last, best, ultimate defense of the airplane ... if you can breach the door .... is a trained, armed, determined pilot. Believe it ....
 

raptor10

Philosoraptor
Contributor
You guys -- as pax -- need to resist IMMEDIATELY if the goblins strike again and you're on board. No re-taking airplanes as you'll NEVER let "them" take over in the first place ... at least that's the game plan you should be working towards ... :)

And the last, best, ultimate defense of the airplane ... if you can breach the door .... is a trained, armed, determined pilot. Believe it ....

Why dont they put that in the training video?

p.s. I'm not against arming the pilots, I was just trying to guess at the possible negative points.
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
Why dont they put that in the training video?

p.s. I'm not against arming the pilots, I was just trying to guess at the possible negative points.
Yes, yes, we get it: you are trying to be funny. Thanks for wasting my time for 3+ minutes of my life while watching something I thought might be germane ... :)

But back to the point: Com'on, now ... why do YOU think?? It's the SAME reason that "they" instructed us for over 20 YEARS, pre-9/11 ... to just go along, get along with any hijackers.

That would NEVER have happened on my aircraft ... Company or FAA notwithstanding ... how do I know??? Some things, you just know.
 
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pdx

HSM Pilot
But back to the point: Com'on, now ... why do YOU think?? It's the SAME reason that "they" instructed us for over 20 YEARS, pre-9/11 ... to just go along, get along with any hijackers.

That would NEVER have happened on my aircraft ... Company or FAA notwithstanding ... how do I know??? Some things, you just know.

I think these policies directly contributed to the events of 9/11. Just go along with the bad guys and they won't hurt you. Sure, that's good advice if you are the cashier at a Kwik-E Mart. Save your neck and leave the work for the police. In this case, however, it is dangerous to let anyone think airliners are weak or easy targets. After all, who is going to act the role of the police?

It just goes to show that you can never negotiate about some things. The only permissible response to terrorism is correctly aimed reprecussions.
 

Fly Navy

...Great Job!
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
I think these policies directly contributed to the events of 9/11. Just go along with the bad guys and they won't hurt you. Sure, that's good advice if you are the cashier at a Kwik-E Mart. Save your neck and leave the work for the police. In this case, however, it is dangerous to let anyone think airliners are weak or easy targets. After all, who is going to act the role of the police?

It just goes to show that you can never negotiate about some things. The only permissible response to terrorism is correctly aimed reprecussions.

They did directly contribute to how 9/11 was executed, but also, don't forget that before 9/11, no one had ever done that... most hijackings ended (semi) peacefully, not with 3 airliners being used as missiles and a 4th being crashed in a field. New rules, new game.
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
....don't forget that before 9/11, no one had ever done that... ... New rules, new game.
Except on my airplanes. Not trying to sound like Rambo ... but we always briefed pre-9/11 that if "Jacked" ... at the first opportunity ... the miscreant was going' down and goin' home in a box, if need be .... the Company and the Feds would never have agreed. Kinder, gentler hijackings .... but in the end, they would have liked the result.

My rules ... same game .... :)
 

A4sForever

BTDT OLD GUY
pilot
Contributor
Mefesto said:
Wern't you flying on the cargo side? Get a lot of beligerant boxes? :D
Naaaaaaaaaah ..... B-747/200 ..... 70% people ... the rest haulin' trash .... maybe more trash in the past few years. :)
 

HooverPilot

CODPilot
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
The program is called FFDO... And YES they are armed! Flown with a few but not sure why we have them except to skip the metal detectors and security checks... Ain't like the boxes are gonna take out the crew.. I worry more about stuff leaking out of the haz can than a jumpseater/stow-away but stranger things have happened here..

Read this if you have some time on your hands: www.tailstrike.com/070494.htm

The only problems I see with the program are 1.) You pay for your own training, weapon, and ammunition and 2.) Can be a big problem when deadheading with your gun or so I am told... :)

That story and the transcript always give me the shivers.
 

snizo

Supply Officer
I'm surprised NW still flies DC-10s. Not a new aircraft by any stretch of the imagination.

Neither are their DC-9's ... they're old as dirt, too, but as A4's said - NW doesn't owe anything on them. Everyone wants a new car, but the responsible thing to do is keep the old '96 accord going 'til she falls apart ;)

I'm more surprised by the armed pilots - I'm sure it’s a great deterrent to would-be hijackers, but how easy is it to turn around and get a good shot off while you're strapped in and surrounded by controls? Couldn't someone get a gun in your face long beforehand?
 
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