POWs Tell Their Tales (Pensacola)

[HH-60H]

He was hired on to work with SERE training at NASNI or so the interweb "facts" say...

It is a fact. Not only did (I think he's retired now) he speak during the course of instruction, he was actually part of the training.

His SRO was then CAPT Stockdale, who actually ordered him to leave early despite his protests.

As far as I am aware VADM Stockdale remained involved with west coast SERE for many, many years. In fact, he had a reserved parking spot at the FASO bldg. Given VADM Stockdale's close association with the program and Doug Hegdhal's participation in the training, I think we can accept what he says as the truth (although I don't think anyone was doubting his POW stories).

Besides, does it really matter how he ended up in the water? He was instrumental in delivering an accurate picture of the status of several hundred downed aircrew being held in Hanoi.

 

[A4sForever]

...Besides, does it really matter how he ended up in the water? ...

I guess it does to you. I never had any credibillity questions re: Hegdhal.

I provided the info for "informational" purposes. Or would you rather I did not ... ???

 

[Scoob]

His SRO was then CAPT Stockdale, who actually ordered him to leave early despite his protests.

Actually, Hegdahl was cleared to go home by then LCDR Dick Stratton. ADM Stockdale was not captured until after they were released.

 

[A4sForever]

Actually, Hegdahl was cleared to go home by then LCDR Dick Stratton. ADM Stockdale was not captured until after they were released.

HUH?? I must be missing something here ...

Admiral Stockdale was shot down in 1965 -- one of the early ones.

SN Doug Hegdahl was knocked/blown/fell/thrown overboard in 1967.

 

[HH-60H]

Actually, Hegdahl was cleared to go home by then LCDR Dick Stratton. ADM Stockdale was not captured until after they were released.

Interesting, I hadn't heard the part about LCDR Dick Stratton. However, I believe VADM Stockdale was shot down in 1965, and Hegdahl was captured in 1967.

 

[Scoob]

HUH?? I must be missing something here ...

Admiral Stockdale was shot down in 1965 -- one of the early ones.

SN Doug Hegdahl was knocked/blown/fell/thrown overboard in 1967.

Well sure, if you want to rely on "history" and "facts".

http://www.pownetwork.org/bios/s/s118.htm

I'll take that hit - not so accurate on my part.

 

[Mumbles]

Oriskany....I'm guessing before the big fire.

 

[A4sForever]

Oriskany....I'm guessing before the big fire.

¿Qué?

 

[feddoc]

Captain McGrath makes some pretty good paintings of POW life.

 

[Catmando]

The American POWs agreed that they would not accept early release
without all the prisoners being released, but in early August 1969, the
POWs decided it was time the story of their torture was known. Allowing
someone in their midst to accept an early release would also provide the
U.S. with a more complete list of Americans being held captive. A young
seaman, Doug Hegdahl, together with Bob Frishman and Wesley Rumble were
released from Hanoi as a propaganda move for the Vietnamese, but only
Hegdahl went with the blessings of the POWs. When they were about to be
released, Stratton told Hegdahl, "Go ahead, blow the whistle. If it means
more torture for me, at least I'll know why, and will feel it's worth the
sacrifice." Eventually, after world pressure ensued, torture of American
POWs ceased. (quote from POW network) http://www.pownetwork.org/bios/h/h135.htm

Hegdahl, Frishman, (and I think Rumble) gave us their stories during a SERE seminar not long after they were released. There was respect there at SERE for Hegdahl, but not the other two.

I remember a number of early stories of those POW's who really stood out and resisted well, and maybe some who didn't quite do so well. But now very little is said. Most keep it to themselves.

 

[Zissou]

It is a fact. Not only did (I think he's retired now) he speak during the course of instruction, he was actually part of the training.

His SRO was then CAPT Stockdale, who actually ordered him to leave early despite his protests.

As far as I am aware VADM Stockdale remained involved with west coast SERE for many, many years. In fact, he had a reserved parking spot at the FASO bldg. Given VADM Stockdale's close association with the program and Doug Hegdhal's participation in the training, I think we can accept what he says as the truth (although I don't think anyone was doubting his POW stories).

Besides, does it really matter how he ended up in the water? He was instrumental in delivering an accurate picture of the status of several hundred downed aircrew being held in Hanoi.

Yes, Sir. I thought mentioning what he did at SERE might be verboten which is why I was vague. He came in civilian clothes and talked alot of smack about the USA. Then he told his story at ENDEX. I admire him, no matter how he wound up swimming in the Tonkin.

And hard as Darth Vader: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lance_Sijan

 

[Piperdriver]

Are there any books written about the POWs who came home early/collaberated/didn't adhere to the Code Of Conduct? I saw some footage of some of the early releases giving a press conference (surrounding Doug Hegdhal, who obviously had approval) but they didn't say much.

I have no intention of honoring these people, but their story would be interesting. Call it morbid curiosity.

Check out a book called "Survivors" written by Zalin Grant. This book talks quite a bit about a group of POW's who were part of the Peace Committe while in the Hanio Hilton. It's been a while since I read the book but I think a lot of these guys were brought up on charges when released but later had them dropped. The book also talks of a prisoner who was a collaborater and actually ended up staying in North Vietnam after the war. Awsome book, check it out.

 

[ea6bflyr]

... He came in civilian clothes and talked alot of smack about the USA. Then he told his story at ENDEX...

Yes, I too had this experience in 1990. IIRC, he retired from the training job at North Island.

Since we are talking about the code of conduct, I thought I'd post it as a reminder to all:

Article I: I am an American, fighting in the armed forces which guard my country and our way of life. I am prepared to give my life in their defense.

Article II: I will never surrender of my own free will. If in command I will never surrender the members of my command while they still have the means to resist.

Article III: If I am captured, I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy.

Article IV: If I become a prisoner of war, I will keep faith with my fellow prisoners. I will give no information nor take part in any action which might be harmful to my comrades. If I am senior, I will take command. If not, I will obey the lawful orders of those appointed over me and will back them up in every way.

Article V: When questioned, should I become a prisoner of war, I am required to give name, rank, service number, and date of birth. I will evade answering further questions to the utmost of my ability. I will make no oral or written statements disloyal to my country and its allies or harmful to their cause.

Article VI: I will never forget that I am an American, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and in the United States of America.

-ea6bflyr

 

[HAL Pilot]

What was the general content of said ass-chewing? Asking a hard question?

General content was that I embarrassed a guest speaker and therefore the base and it's commanding officer. My CO was more amused by my question than pissed off, but was pissed off because the Commodore was pissed off. The Commodore was pissed off because the Base CO was pissed off and the Base CO was truly pissed. The Commodore did shield me from the Base CO so I didn't have to see him. It quickly blew over and we all had a good chuckle about it at happy hour a couple of weeks later. In fact, the Commodore used it as an example of how not to be politically correct to all that would listen - which was everybody since he was the Commodore.

This was after I already knew I was not going to be the #1 or #2 DH and therefore not going to promote to CDR. Life is easier when you are no longer worried about fitreps.....you don't care about the little things at that point.....

 

[phrogpilot73]

Yes, I too had this experience in 1990. IIRC, he retired from the training job at North Island.

Don't know when he retired, but he was still an instructor when I went through in early 2001. I was amazed that he could still recite the names of all the POW's from memory.