ok, i am still not comprehending then. i'm saying israel and greenland are blue right now but are actually semitic and eskimo and are not western culture and shouldn't be blue. what are you saying?
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POWs unacknowledged in China, Libya and Laos?
- Thread starter A4sForever
- Start date
ok, i am still not comprehending then. i'm saying israel and greenland are blue right now but are actually semitic and eskimo and are not western culture and shouldn't be blue. what are you saying?
The form of governments/ culture there are Western. Israel has a major European/American influence (thats where the Israelis migrated from mainly) and Greenland is still tied to Denmark, which is Western.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/gl.html
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/is.html
ok. but then i think there are many other countries on the non-blue side that should get a tinge or more of blue. for example, the western part of russia which is european pretty much governs the eastern part of russia which is asian, right? so if governing counts (like for greenland) then russia should be all blue i think. same with turkey.
You guys need to get out more.
That's exactly what they're called in many traditional writings -- even including the so-called "White" Russians in some cases. And as a good portion of the Soviet population resided in the areas east of the Urals they have traditionally been considered "other than Western". Try reading more Winston Churchill immediately pops to mind.
Occidental: Occidental means generally "western". It is a traditional designation (especially when capitalized) for anything belonging to the Occident or "West" (i.e., Europe and the New World), and especially pertains to it's Western culture. Occident derives from the Latin occidens - sunset, -west, as distinct from the Orient.
Oriental : Oriental has traditionally referred to everything else; in earlier Western times and writings -- it referred to "further East". Over time the term has encompassed areas such as the Middle East, the Russian steppes, Persia, Turkey, everything east of the Urals, the Indian subcontinent, and eventually reaching east to the shores of the Pacific Ocean. Oriental derives from the Latin word oriens (rising) and equally likely, from the Greek word 'he'oros', i.e., the direction of the rising sun.
Never heard of "We 3 Kings of Orient Are ... "??? They weren't exactly zipperheads, you know ...
A depiction of Occidental (Western) and Oriental (non-Western, i.e., everything else) cultures. Guess which one the blue represents ???
Interesting lesson on the word. Still, even though certain parts of the FSU are ethnically "Asian," or "Oriental," or "Mongoloid," or whatever you want to call them, it doesn't mean that the dominant culture in the FSU doesn't resemble the "West" more than it does the Vietnamese. That map pretty much just says,"US," and "everyone else." There's a lot of variation in the "everyone else" category, so saying because the Russians did something it represents an "Oriental" mindset is misleading.
Don't take that map as authoritative. It wasn't made by anyone claiming to be an expert on the subject. Here is the original.
It was created by some random guy from Wikipedia.
aha! i see now. thanks.
looking at the notes with the map, they added blue to romania when it became part of the EU last yr. certainly romania couldn't have changed cultures last yr so i think this map is more a political map than a cultural map.
Jesus Christ people (now would He be Occidental or Oriental?) ... just to help out the nit-pickers and nose-pickers amongst us -- not thinking of you Mumbles -- the "map" was offered as an illustration of the point I was attempting to make re: Occident vs Orient. I stated it was a "depiction" -- what about that concept is so hard to comprehend?? It was not intended to represent any "hard-fast' lines of demarcation. I full well understand the limitations of "Wikipedia", but it's a quick & dirty resource and I'm not going to go to the Library of Congress to find documentation for the Air Warriors class of nattering nabobs.
"Oriental" means "east". Occidental means "west".
The "Orient Express" ran from Paris to Istanbul -- Istanbul being considered "Orient".
Portions of Christianity consider the Eastern Orthodox Church to be "Oriental".
The "official" name of Uruguay is "La Republica Oriental del Uruguay" ... 'cause it's "east" of the Rio de la Plata.
The term "Oriental" has of late come to be considered racist or non-PC in the West, OR Occident, if you prefer.
However, one recent start-up airline based in Bangkok named themselves "Thai Orient Airlines" ... run by Asians/Orientals ... saw it w/ my own beady little eyes. So much for "Asians don't like the term Oriental".
The list goes on and on and on and on and .... The use of the term in the original post was correct.
For HH-60H: I realize you think you "got me" ... but the map -- just an illustration used to help make a point -- not courtroom proof -- get it???
P.S. .. for those who don't know -- HH-60H doesn't "like" me -- (I hope I shall survive the shame & humiliation) -- so take his counter to anything I post as .... well .... Wikipedia of a sort. :icon_wink
Someone needs to split this off as it's now got nothing to do w/ POW/MIA.
"Oriental" means "east". Occidental means "west".
The "Orient Express" ran from Paris to Istanbul -- Istanbul being considered "Orient".
Portions of Christianity consider the Eastern Orthodox Church to be "Oriental".
The "official" name of Uruguay is "La Republica Oriental del Uruguay" ... 'cause it's "east" of the Rio de la Plata.
The term "Oriental" has of late come to be considered racist or non-PC in the West, OR Occident, if you prefer.
However, one recent start-up airline based in Bangkok named themselves "Thai Orient Airlines" ... run by Asians/Orientals ... saw it w/ my own beady little eyes. So much for "Asians don't like the term Oriental".The list goes on and on and on and on and .... The use of the term in the original post was correct.
For HH-60H: I realize you think you "got me" ... but the map -- just an illustration used to help make a point -- not courtroom proof -- get it???
P.S. .. for those who don't know -- HH-60H doesn't "like" me -- (I hope I shall survive the shame & humiliation) -- so take his counter to anything I post as .... well .... Wikipedia of a sort. :icon_wink
Someone needs to split this off as it's now got nothing to do w/ POW/MIA.
Wow, you have got a serious complex of some kind. Just because I have challenged a few statements you have made and called a spade a spade, means I don't "like" you, and I am "out to get you." I think that might be a persecution complex, but I'm no psychologist.For HH-60H: I realize you think you "got me" ... but the map -- just an illustration used to help make a point -- not courtroom proof -- get it???
P.S. .. for those who don't know -- HH-60H doesn't "like" me -- (I hope I shall survive the shame & humiliation) -- so take his counter to anything I post as .... well .... Wikipedia of a sort. :icon_wink
I think it is further supported by the fact that I was responding to DSL, who was trying to dig too deep into the picture, and I was just helping her understand that it was not authoritative.
But the Russians have never really fit well with Europe. I would classify them as being more Oriental/Asian than European. The way they do business and the way they play politics is different than we do in The West. There was more than Communism standing between US and Them during the Cold War. In short, they're sort the red-headed stepchild of the rest of Europe, along with many of the Balkan states.
Just my $0.02, take it for what it's worth.
They're neither - they're Slavs. Who will win the battle to classify the Russians? Will it be A4's, our beloved curmudgeon, with his barrage of anachronisms and considerable dislike for anything born before 1950? Or, will it be our standard crowd of wet behind the ears rabble-rousers, who hate America and are the cause of all evil in this world? Tune in next week for the exciting conclusion!
Brett
True, but I was trying to keep my comments in context of the conversation, i.e. Oriental or Occidental. I've always been intrigued by Russia. They don't quite fit in with the rest of Europe and yet, they aren't exactly Asian. As Brett pointed out, they're Slavs, and defy classification as either European or Asian.