The break

[chiplee]

Hmmmm....

An F-14A Tomcat at mil is just over 550kts at sea level. And we've got (had...sigh) the variable intake to help us out.



r/
G

Ok, sorry, last one then I'll be off your back. What does variable intake geometry have to do with subsonic flight?

 

[EODDave]

Nice fireworks. Where is the popcorn? Schnug v Chiplee, mano a mano, Tomcat v Hornet, Pilot v RIO. Variable intake v non. The new AIRWARRIORS CAGE MATCH.

 

[TurnandBurn55]

.
In any case, don't underestimate the legacy hornet bro, especially one with 10.7 software. Ask a super guy

C'mon Pappy, you gonna take that baiting from a JV guy? Jump in that cage....!

 

[HH-60H]

In the hornet we can't get below mil power above 1.23.

For someone who doesn't know, why can't you get less than mil at above 1.23M? At first glance that doesn't seem very smart.

 

[EODDave]

What he meant was that if you are going faster than M1.23 and pull the throttle back out of burner, it stays in mil until you decelerate below 1.23. This keeps the engine from doing bad things to itself. If you were in burner haulin the mail over the mach and then if the computer allowed you to go to idle that would be bad. Sorta like crossing the streams was a bad thing. The plane will decelerate from the mach at mil, just not as violently if you put the thing in park.

 

[Fly Navy]

Sorta like crossing the streams was a bad thing.

Except that worked.

 

[EODDave]

Well if you wanted to slow down reeeeeeaaallllllyyyy fast going to idle would work as well. Just not something you want to do. Probably the same results as crossing the streams. Neat colors an explosion and getting wet.

 

[mules83]

would it include a big marshmallow man?

 

[kmac]

Each airfield has their own rules.

Kingsville for example was 800' (1100' for the new studs until forms) at 325ish KIAS.

They must have changed it, because I did 415KIAS in the break at Kingsville. Freaking 22 second groove though dammit.

 

[Punk]

They must have changed it, because I did 415KIAS in the break at Kingsville. Freaking 22 second groove though dammit.

that was the new SOP that came out after numerous over-G's by IP's in the break

 

[Screamtruth]

There's no solid background for that comment, it's how I feel. here's why I feel that way. We all know we have 7.5Gs available at 350kts? sure, will you pull that in the break even if you're at 500kts, I hope so. The difference is that you'll be below corner in less than a second if it's initiated at 350, at which point you'll be capitalizing on the superior turn radius of the hornet, and you'll end up .4 abeam? Can we all adapt and overcome and just play the turn to end up closer to 1.5 abeam, sure. But let's not call it a break if that's what we're going to do, let's call it a turn to downwind. In fact at 350kts, if you pull even 4Gs, forget about 7.5, for more than 90* of turn you'll probably end up a mile abeam, still entirely too tight to make a safe approach. I have the utmost confidence in even the most junior aviator that by the time he reaches the Hornet FRS he'll know to ease the pull or end up taking it around. The issue with young pilots, and even some seasoned guys, is that naturally the stick input required for a safe and expeditious roll rate changes with airspeed. The aft stick input required for a safe smooth application of G changes with airspeed as well. As long as we're not ham fisting everything will be fine. But if we are, there's the potential for a guy to reef the nose around trying to look $hit hot but forgetting he's being legal today, and ending up in tone at 800feet.

Ok, here's the summary Brett. I believe that in order to execute a safe "break turn" at low altitude, a jet must have the airspeed required to apply full aft stick into the lap achieving every available G the airplane will give you for a full 180 degrees of turn and still be above corner when he rolls out. It's the only way such dynamic maneuvering is safe at such low altitudes. How is "aerobatic" flight defined, and how low can we do that? What is minimum maneuvering airspeed in LATT? If at any point in a "BREAK" turn you end up below corner, then in my opinion, you weren't going fast enough when you started it, and you should have simply made a left turn, not a break turn.

.4 abeam? 1.5 abeam? What does this mean? Distance? Radius?
I am not a fleet aviator, so it is confusing. Too many kicks to the face.

 

[Jedj]

the break is a completely safe manuever as it implies a transition to the landing configuration as opposed to LATT which required tactical airspeed throughout the evolution. Secondly, I do not know a single hornet guy that applies max G at the onset of the break, unless you are coming in 500+. The above mention distance is abeam your intened point of landing, straight line distance. The break was never intened to be a BFM manuever, just a simple way to expeditiously enter a landing pattern and landing configuration as well as minimize time in a WEZ if that is applicable. Half way through a cruise even a junior nugget(which I was) can develop the neccessary skills to snap one off at the round down around 400 KTS and still fly a solid fair with a hopeful upgrade. Most of the time youre a wingman anyway and are breaking well aft so it doesnt matter, another moo point as the cow would say.

 

[petescheu]

Well if you wanted to slow down reeeeeeaaallllllyyyy fast going to idle would work as well. Just not something you want to do. Probably the same results as crossing the streams. Neat colors an explosion and getting wet.

That's the best part of going full grunt down hill, screaming along and then pulling outa A/B and gettin the brakes slammed on. Gotta love shock drag.

 

[A4sForever]

If you have to "think" a break .... you probably should not be doing it. You are not a "natural" ......

Some of you boys are REALLY constipated in your attitudes .... just do it ....

 

[Brett327]

If you have to "think" a break .... you probably should not be doing it. You are not a "natural" ......

Some of you boys are REALLY constipated in your attitudes .... just do it ....

Thank you.

Brett