The Doctor is in! Ask a Flight Surgeon!

[Mouselovr]

Based on your experience, do you know if there’s a difference between suspected keratoconus and diagnosed keratoconus for recruiters? Or are you saying any unusual topography will get me dq like that kid got dq from all military? Normally keratoconus has a crab claw or kissing doves pattern whereas I have yellow circles

Replied to you on your other post.
Sorry to hear about the full DQ. Its okay to be upset. You put a lot of time and effort to get here.
Two guys who I went to OCS with:
1. SNA diagnosed with an aggressive degenerative eye condition. Got surgery. Transferred to SpecOps. Doing great.
2. SpecOps guy diagnosed with a potential eye problem that hadn't set in yet. DQed from Navy SpecOps then all military service in all branches. He tried a ditch last effort to get an army waiver, they said no.

Moral of the story is you need to talk to the doctors about what your options are. Guy #2 ended up wasting months in student pool fighting the system.
Plenty of people from my class DQed from aviation, redesignated and love it.
One guy DQed in student pool, was accepted into AMDO, decided he didn't want it, DORed from OCS and is very happy in civi world.

If you redesignate AND then commission, its hard to get out.
Best of luck.

 

[FiveSevenK9]

Replied to you on your other post.
Sorry to hear about the full DQ. Its okay to be upset. You put a lot of time and effort to get here.
Two guys who I went to OCS with:
1. SNA diagnosed with an aggressive degenerative eye condition. Got surgery. Transferred to SpecOps. Doing great.
2. SpecOps guy diagnosed with a potential eye problem that hadn't set in yet. DQed from Navy SpecOps then all military service in all branches. He tried a ditch last effort to get an army waiver, they said no.

Moral of the story is you need to talk to the doctors about what your options are. Guy #2 ended up wasting months in student pool fighting the system.
Plenty of people from my class DQed from aviation, redesignated and love it.
One guy DQed in student pool, was accepted into AMDO, decided he didn't want it, DORed from OCS and is very happy in civi world.

If you redesignate AND then commission, its hard to get out.
Best of luck.

Thank you sir. Do you know more about the first guy’s process between DQ and SpecOps? Did he stay in the Navy and transfer or did he get out and get back in? The LCDR at OCS handling TMG (medical holds) is telling me I have to DOR and reapply for a SPECWAR contract if I want to go that route since the boards are many months away.

I’ve asked to speak with doctors and it hasn’t gotten me very far. I’m getting a civilian topography tomorrow to see if anything has worsened after 3 months. My eyes “have the potential” to develop a degenerative condition despite the fact CXL surgery is available to stop it.

Aviation wouldn’t accept the surgery for applicants, but now my worry is whether or not I will be dq from all military if I leave. I also don’t like the idea of signing up for SWO or something else in the hopes of lat transferring asap in the navy. It seems like I’m in guy 2’s medical situation while I’m trying to accomplish a similar path as guy 1’s story.

Also, I want to wish you and yours a happy Thanksgiving. I appreciate the people like you offering your advice. If you can share more information about your peers’ stories, it may help save my naval career. Thanks again sir.

 

[Empire16]

Thank you sir. Do you know more about the first guy’s process between DQ and SpecOps? Did he stay in the Navy and transfer or did he get out and get back in? The LCDR at OCS handling TMG (medical holds) is telling me I have to DOR and reapply for a SPECWAR contract if I want to go that route since the boards are many months away.

I’ve asked to speak with doctors and it hasn’t gotten me very far. I’m getting a civilian topography tomorrow to see if anything has worsened after 3 months. My eyes “have the potential” to develop a degenerative condition despite the fact CXL surgery is available to stop it.

Aviation wouldn’t accept the surgery for applicants, but now my worry is whether or not I will be dq from all military if I leave. I also don’t like the idea of signing up for SWO or something else in the hopes of lat transferring asap in the navy. It seems like I’m in guy 2’s medical situation while I’m trying to accomplish a similar path as guy 1’s story.

Also, I want to wish you and yours a happy Thanksgiving. I appreciate the people like you offering your advice. If you can share more information about your peers’ stories, it may help save my naval career. Thanks again sir.

Just thinking about it if I were in your shoes. I would personally just try to commission as an Intel O if possible? I feel like that is better than gambling getting picked up again for a different branch, not being MED dqd and having to go through another ocs/wocs/ots. Just my 0.2 cents as someone going to OCS soon and preparing to be med dqd for whatever reason.

 

[FiveSevenK9]

Just thinking about it if I were in your shoes. I would personally just try to commission as an Intel O if possible? I feel like that is better than gambling getting picked up again for a different branch, not being MED dqd and having to go through another ocs/wocs/ots. Just my 0.2 cents as someone going to OCS soon and preparing to be med dqd for whatever reason.

Yeah I asked about intel. It’s full already for this fiscal year and they gave me the same answer for having to dor and come back later just like for specwar. I’m going to push back and see if I can possibly stay in TMG for the wait. It may be better for me just to leave since all that time rotting away in king hall could be better spent elsewhere. If I get fully military dq, then I’m feeling like it’s just not meant to be for me. I’m not going to settle for the options I don’t want.

 

[FiveSevenK9]

Just thinking about it if I were in your shoes. I would personally just try to commission as an Intel O if possible? I feel like that is better than gambling getting picked up again for a different branch, not being MED dqd and having to go through another ocs/wocs/ots. Just my 0.2 cents as someone going to OCS soon and preparing to be med dqd for whatever reason.

I wish you the best in your OCS journey and career. I wouldn’t wish this situation on anyone. Hopefully the captain and admiral can have this mess fixed by the time you class up. They all agree medical clearance should be determined before beginning OCS. It’s a complicated issue to solve I guess.

 

[Empire16]

So your only option really is SWO? They want you to DOR then re do ocs again? Or just get selected? That sucks man. Wish I could help.

 

[FiveSevenK9]

I was told SWO, Supply, and AMDO are my immediate options. If I DOR I would get a letter from the captain about completing OCS already. If I reapply and get accepted to intel or specwar in many months, then I would commission and this OCS would count. If I go to a different branch, I will have to do their ots/ocs again

 

[exNavyOffRec]

Yeah I asked about intel. It’s full already for this fiscal year and they gave me the same answer for having to dor and come back later just like for specwar. I’m going to push back and see if I can possibly stay in TMG for the wait. It may be better for me just to leave since all that time rotting away in king hall could be better spent elsewhere. If I get fully military dq, then I’m feeling like it’s just not meant to be for me. I’m not going to settle for the options I don’t want.

I wish you the best in your OCS journey and career. I wouldn’t wish this situation on anyone. Hopefully the captain and admiral can have this mess fixed by the time you class up. They all agree medical clearance should be determined before beginning OCS. It’s a complicated issue to solve I guess.

Most people agree it would be better to have everyone fully PQ prior to OCS, but it comes down to money, it is cheaper to not do it that way. I think everyone would agree it sucks for those in situations like yours, but it comes down to the fact it is a business decision, the same types of decisions are made in the civilian world and it sucks here too.

I was told SWO, Supply, and AMDO are my immediate options. If I DOR I would get a letter from the captain about completing OCS already. If I reapply and get accepted to intel or specwar in many months, then I would commission and this OCS would count. If I go to a different branch, I will have to do their ots/ocs again

Things can change from one class to another or month to month, once person in one class could have many options, then some guy in the next class only has two options, SWO or go home.

I know that is what he is telling you, but I wouldn't hold my breath. I have seen people complete OCS, get put on medical hold for many weeks only to not be PQ and didn't like the SWO only option, they came home, reapplied and had to go through OCS again. This has happened time and time again.

The other concern I would have is if you get out you would need to meet new accessions standards, while you could get surgery to correct the issue I would be concerned about how N33 words things, they often use the phrase "or a history of" to justify giving people a DQ.

Just be very careful of any decision you make that has you leaving the service, do so knowing you very well will have a difficult time getting back.

 

[Empire16]

I was told SWO, Supply, and AMDO are my immediate options. If I DOR I would get a letter from the captain about completing OCS already. If I reapply and get accepted to intel or specwar in many months, then I would commission and this OCS would count. If I go to a different branch, I will have to do their ots/ocs again

What was your major in college?

 

[FiveSevenK9]

Yes I’m going to try and stay in TMG if I can. However, if they force me to get out and reapply later, if I don’t get accepted back in, I can live with that. I don’t think I could compromise on my dreams and make a good officer. I was a Pre-professional Pre-veterinarian major. I originally thought I wanted to be a dog handler in specwar. I later learned that’s an enlisted job after I completed college. Additionally, I learned that I actually could have been a pilot after taking my ASTBE and getting immediate select. Here I am now back to square one but those have always been my dreams since I can remember. If the military won’t take me back then I will be okay. Extremely disappointed, but not unhappy like if I go SWO or AMDO and always wish I didn’t compromise.

 

[Mouselovr]

Thank you sir. Do you know more about the first guy’s process between DQ and SpecOps? Did he stay in the Navy and transfer or did he get out and get back in? The LCDR at OCS handling TMG (medical holds) is telling me I have to DOR and reapply for a SPECWAR contract if I want to go that route since the boards are many months away.

I was a Pre-professional Pre-veterinarian major.

No problem. I'm an ice hockey tendie, and I was pre-vet in college.... so similar background, ha.
We used to call "TMG" student pool.

Guy #1 who transferred to SpecOps ended up leaving service to have his surgery and apply to SOAS. Look through my account history, I've talked about him a couple of times on various threads. In short, we went through OCS around the time of a well-established SEAL who helped him push through the system after the fact. As he had already completed OCS, he directly commissioned after being picked up. He did not need to repeat Newport.

Aviation would not accepted guy #1 with surgery either.

I’ve asked to speak with doctors and it hasn’t gotten me very far. I’m getting a civilian topography tomorrow to see if anything has worsened after 3 months. My eyes “have the potential” to develop a degenerative condition despite the fact CXL surgery is available to stop it.

Sounds like you've already tried the right aviation resources. Shot in the dark, but if I recall, the SpecOps guys went to see the "Underwater Docs"... cant remember their exact title but ask around if you can speak to them. They are the doctors who approve candidates for dive school. They'll likely know more about if you could qualify for SpecOps.

They all agree medical clearance should be determined before beginning OCS. It’s a complicated issue to solve I guess.

Agreed. There was a big stink about this after I graduated as some applicants were waiting 6+ months for their approvals just to be DQed due to medical negligence. An admiral came down, investigated and a lot of people were replaced. They tried to implement NAMI physicals beforehand, like the marines, but it was too expensive. They have done a lot of work to fix the waiver and initial progress for what its worth. But it is frustrating that people still get DQed coming to OCS.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

No problem. I'm an ice hockey tendie, and I was pre-vet in college.... so similar background, ha.
We used to call "TMG" student pool.

Guy #1 who transferred to SpecOps ended up leaving service to have his surgery and apply to SOAS. Look through my account history, I've talked about him a couple of times on various threads. In short, we went through OCS around the time of a well-established SEAL who helped him push through the system after the fact. As he had already completed OCS, he directly commissioned after being picked up. He did not need to repeat Newport.

Aviation would not accepted guy #1 with surgery either.

Sounds like you've already tried the right aviation resources. Shot in the dark, but if I recall, the SpecOps guys went to see the "Underwater Docs"... cant remember their exact title but ask around if you can speak to them. They are the doctors who approve candidates for dive school. They'll likely know more about if you could qualify for SpecOps.


Agreed. There was a big stink about this after I graduated as some applicants were waiting 6+ months for their approvals just to be DQed due to medical negligence. An admiral came down, investigated and a lot of people were replaced. They tried to implement NAMI physicals beforehand, like the marines, but it was too expensive. They have done a lot of work to fix the waiver and initial progress for what its worth. But it is frustrating that people still get DQed coming to OCS.

Bureau of undersea medicine.

 

[kasp99]

Hello all,

Long time lurker here, if I should post in another thread let me know.

I'm currently in advanced strike right now and have been dealing with an ankle injury for a month or so. I am still able to fly with no problems and able to work out but I have lingering minor dull pain throughout the day. I had surgery twice before I commissioned on the same ankle and I am unfortunately somewhat confident that the injury I have will require some kind of procedure to fix. The pain is pretty bearable, but given my experience I think it will worsen over time to the point walking is painful. I've never been med down since I commissioned.

I wanted to know if anybody had experience with surgery mid-flight school and if it is a good time to bring this up to the doc. I wonder if I would be able to keep my upchit until the date of a potential surgery and if a 2-3 month med down would severely impact me in some way before I wing. I just don't want to risk my career for something that I could potential deal with for the next ~8 years by doing alternate means of exercise like rowing or biking. I appreciate any advice, thank you.

 

[Mouselovr]

I wanted to know if anybody had experience with surgery mid-flight school and if it is a good time to bring this up to the doc. I wonder if I would be able to keep my upchit until the date of a potential surgery and if a 2-3 month med down would severely impact me in some way before I wing. I just don't want to risk my career for something that I could potential deal with for the next ~8 years by doing alternate means of exercise like rowing or biking. I appreciate any advice, thank you.

Ive been med down for 7 months.
Needed two major surgeries and we're now working on the (hopeful) waiver.
When I get my waiver, I'll do some warm up sims then back in the syllabus where I left off.
In my case, it wasn’t an injury, so I’m not sure what they’ll do with respect to you keeping upchit status until surgery.

So no, caring for your health now will not create any major set backs.

 

[ccm02]

ADHD Waiver Question

When I was 6 or 7 years old I was diagnosed with adhd by a psychologist (not psychiatrist). Shortly after this I got prescribed meds for it however I never got the prescription and have never taken any meds for them ever. This has been a non issue since then and I am currently in college and doing well. Also I have never had an IEP or any learning accommodations. I looked on the NAMI waiver guide and it seems I would need to do the following

1. Get all school and medical records related to this
2. All college transcripts
3. A letter from my university saying I never required learning accommodations
4. A personal statement saying I did not use meds

Are there any other medical things I will need to do before hand? For example, seeing a psychiatrist and getting a letter from them saying I don’t have ADHD. Looking through this forum it seems these type of waivers don’t come easily from NAMI.