USS Fitzgerald collision in C7F

[Jim123]

That's funny but sad at the same time. Sometimes I wonder what to believe anymore...

 

[BackOrdered]

Does anyone know of aviators being taken to CM for mishaps that have resulted in the death of others?

The Cavalese cable car disaster? That was a pretty big deal.

 

[sickboy]

Does anyone know of aviators being taken to CM for mishaps that have resulted in the death of others?

I think there was a USCG crew that was after running into power lines.

 

[Flash]

The Cavalese cable car disaster? That was a pretty big deal.

Yes.

The Aviano EA-6B crew back in 1998, but somehow they dodged any real accountability for the people they killed.

I think there was a USCG crew that was after running into power lines.

Sort of.

The Prowler crew in Italy as was mentioned, the other that comes to mind is the copilot and sole survivor of a USCG MH-60 mishap who was initially charged with negligent homicide but it was later dismissed. Two combat-related incidents that I can recall were the prosecution of one of the E-3 controllers in the shutdown of the H-60's in northern Iraq in 1994, he was acquitted, and the NJP of two F-16 pilots in a friendly fire incident that killed 4 Canadians in 2002

 

[nittany03]

“So you have no frame of reference here, Donny. You're like a child who wanders into the middle of a movie . . .”

 

[STOVLer]

The Prowler crew in Italy as was mentioned, the other that comes to mind is the copilot and sole survivor of a USCG MH-60 mishap who was initially charged with negligent homicide but it was later dismissed. Two combat-related incidents that I can recall were the prosecution of one of the E-3 controllers in the shutdown of the H-60's in northern Iraq in 1994, he was acquitted, and the NJP of two F-16 pilots in a friendly fire incident that killed 4 Canadians in 2002.



One of the backseat ECMO's gave a pretty frank and thorough briefing to VT-86 when he was an instructor there, there were a lot of mitigating circumstances that weren't the fault of the crew. I have mixed feelings about where the blame lies for that particular incident, a lot rests on the crew but a lot is also shared by others. The two front-seaters were eventually convicted and dismissed from the USMC.

Two interesting notes from his brief; they were cut loose/hung out to dry by the Marines and handed over to the Italians with zero support shortly after the mishap and there was never a mishap investigation.

Didn't help that the crew intentionally destroyed the tapes post-mishap.

 

[Flash]

Didn't help that the crew intentionally destroyed the tapes post-mishap.

That is part of the 'more to the story' the backseat ECMO told us, there didn't really destroy 'tapes' but a digital photo taken prior to flight.

 

[Brett327]

Nothing on Prowler tapes would have been of value anyway.

 

[Flash]

Nothing on Prowler tapes would have been of value anyway.

I didn't even think to address that part, the tapes in the Prowler had basic data for a mission and were useless for any sort of record of anything useful done during the flight.

 

[nittany03]

Fitz’s ex-CO will fight the charges at court-martial.

 

[BigRed389]

Fitz’s ex-CO will fight the charges at court-martial.

Good.

Absolutely BS to let the OOD who was actually present and responsible plead out on reduced charges to bring the higher charge against the CO.

 

[robav8r]

Good.

Absolutely BS to let the OOD who was actually present and responsible plead out on reduced charges to bring the higher charge against the CO.

I think the OOD should be held to the highest, possible, level of accountability. But so should the CO. One day in command, or one year, it’s his responsibility to set the tone and culture. Fry the OOD and bridge watch team, but pull the string on why they performed the way they did.

 

[DanMa1156]

That is part of the 'more to the story' the backseat ECMO told us, there didn't really destroy 'tapes' but a digital photo taken prior to flight.

Really? I remember at an ethics brief at USNA, the actual pilot came in to surprise us (I've told this story before here - long story short: USNA presents us this as an honor case, we sit around in groups crushing the guy's decisions, then, he presented himself as one of the instructors / facilitators in that very room) and I remember him talking about the tapes he destroyed, and how it was a video of what was supposed to be his last flight in the Prowler.

 

[Flash]

Really? I remember at an ethics brief at USNA, the actual pilot came in to surprise us (I've told this story before here - long story short: USNA presents us this as an honor case, we sit around in groups crushing the guy's decisions, then, he presented himself as one of the instructors / facilitators in that very room) and I remember him talking about the tapes he destroyed, and how it was a video of what was supposed to be his last flight in the Prowler.

I don't remember that being mentioned by the ECMO that briefed us and I would hope that I would have recalled that particular detail, it was ~17 years ago though. As for his last flight, maybe in country or low level but the timing would have been odd for his last flight in a Prowler with the squadron headed home to NC 2-3 weeks after the mishap.

 

[nittany03]

Fry the OOD and bridge watch team, but pull the string on why they performed the way they did.

I’m pretty sure the lawyers on both sides are going to be very interested in pulling a lot of strings. The CO’s defense attorneys on every manning/ops decision from the DESRON on up. And the government for every possible deficiency from the head shed during the CO’s entire tour, because he fleeted up.