Controversal Cartoon

[nittany03]

Yeah, the abortion threads tend to get really ugly really fast. After I read BigWorm's post though, I used some of my copious A-pool free time to do a little Web research. Turns out the annual number of deaths per 100,000 people is still lower in the forces in Iraq than it is in the population at large Stateside. How's that for a little food for thought? Happy Easter everybody!

 

[akamifeldman]

Yeah, the abortion threads tend to get really ugly really fast. After I read BigWorm's post though, I used some of my copious A-pool free time to do a little Web research. Turns out the annual number of deaths per 100,000 people is still lower in the forces in Iraq than it is in the population at large Stateside. How's that for a little food for thought? Happy Easter everybody!

Oh wow, you're right, I guess I'll just move to Baghdad right now, its obviously safer!

NO

I'm really mystified as to how/why you're all saying its safer to be in Iraq than in USA. If its just about what nittany said, "number of deaths per 100,000," then lets examine that: Who (what type of people) are included in a random 100,000 selection of people in the USA? Answer: ALL types (young-old). Who is included in a 'random selection of 100,000 coalition troops in Iraq?' Answer: Young, fit, mostly male American soldiers. What dangers do people back home in USA face? Answer: Car crashes, cancer, drugs, spending too much time in front of the PC, firearms, etc. Now, what dangers do the troops in Iraq face? Answer: Turban headed guy with machine gun, Turban headed guy with RPG, etc. My point here is that you're trying to compare apples to oranges. If you were to compare the statistics on 'number of people per 100,000 who die in RPG attacks' in Iraq and USA, then that would be a fair assesment. But, until you do so, you're just trying to downplay the real significance of what is happening there.

We're against capital punishment because two wrongs never make a right, and our legal system is built upon fairness and accountability, not vengance.
We're for abortion in some cases (NOT abortion on demand, as form of birth control) because in certain instances, it may be more compassionate to end the pregnancy and give the mother time to reach a state where she can more adaquately care for a child, and not ruin her life and the baby's through a life of poverty and insecurity.

Finally, the Republican party 'owns' the military no more than the Democrats 'own' socialism. It's just a stupid attack.

Happy Easter & Passover!

 

[jdnew]

LIKE I SAID, DON"T GO THERE. If that is the descusion you want, start another thread and I will be happy to tell you why that is total BULL. Lets just stick to what we were talkin about. Yes, you have a excellent point about the deaths in Iraq and I would agree with you, but I would phrase what you said a little differently. What they were trying to say was that the number of deaths over there is not as vast as they have been made out to be. That is not to say that each one is not a tragity. I sat next to a lady in church today whose brother died over there not too long ago. No one is trying to down play the deaths that happened over there man. I'm sorry if that is how you interpret it. They are just making a counter argument to the point that dumb cartoon was making. Your point about downplaying the deaths is excellent, however I don't think that is what they were trying to do. Just remember who you are talking to next time. Sometimes it's not what you say its how you say it.

 

[nittany03]

Akamai-
First off, I'm not going to answer the abortion argument. Let's agree to disagree. I've seen that topic snowball into a flamewar too often to add my $.02 again. With regards to statistics, like jd said, I'm just trying to counter the 'quagmire' perception which seems to be pervading certain segments of our population. I was being a little flip because the issue irritates me. Is Iraq more dangerous than here? I would say yes. As you mentioned, the people who are dying in Iraq are those who are least likely to die over here. But those who think we are suffering massive casualties are badly mistaken given the history of our armed conflicts this century. It sucks to lose people, but sometimes that's the price of our way of life. At least we're countering the idea that we'll cut and run at the sight of blood. Now let's hope the Fallujah ceasefire holds and Iraq doesn't blow up in our faces. That's what I prayed for today in church.

 

[akamifeldman]

Nittany: ...and I'll agree to that!

 

[BigWorm]

Answer: Turban headed guy with machine gun, Turban headed guy with RPG, etc. QUOTE]

Actually most of the insurgents I saw on CNN were wearing ski masks not Turbans. Is this some sort of prejudice towards Muslims?

 

[Fly Navy]

Hey akamifeldman, just a suggestion to watch the tone of your posts. You're talking to people who have been there-done that, or are going to be there-going to be doing that. Not to say that you can't have a good argument here, but just remember WHO you're talking to. Would you do that in person?

 

[Fongabonga]

I agree Fly Navy, some of the people on this board are OFFICERS, and military courtesy should always apply, not to say that your argument is not important, but caution should be used in the tone which you present your ideas. Especially if you are looking to enter the military.

 

[akamifeldman]

Anyone who misstates or misrepresents the truth needs to be corrected.
Especially if they are officers.

But yes, FlyNavy and Fongabonga, I do take your point, and I'll try to be more considerate in the future.

EDIT-Let's debate the message, not the messenger.

 

[GVSURob]

BigWorm:

It would be nice to think its safer to walk around Iraq with an M-16, however you have to consider the amount of liscensed drivers in America vs. the amount of soldiers in Iraq... I'm sure if you did the math you'd find that its much more dangerous in Iraq

Robert Mathey
Grand Rapids, MI

 

[Flash]

This looks like the signs of a liberal, communist, tyrant at work.

While this is probably not the most appropriate cartoon at this time, a communist or tyrant would not have allowed this in the first place. This is a free country and we have to take the bad as well as the good that comes with it.

From someone who has been there and done some of that.

 

[livefast]

Luckovich is characteristically a liberal political cartoonists and some of his cartoons do tend to be half-truths or exaggerations, but we have to remember that the reason America is great is because people can express their oppinions freely, even if they're not popular.

 

[graymatter]

because people can express their oppinions freely, even if they're not popular.

you know, i agree with you.. but i think there is a limit to what people have a right to say. and that goes over that limit. that cartoon is disgusting and does not belong in any newspaper.

 

[jdnew]

They have the freedom to publish and express there opinions freely, and then I have the freedom to call them a dumba$$ when they do something like this.

 

[jagges84]

They have the freedom to publish and express there opinions freely, and then I have the freedom to call them a dumba$$ when they do something like this.

Word!

S/F
Jagges